Ukraine Revolt/Civil War News, Reports, Data, etc.


delft

Brigadier
From the BBC website:
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Ex-Georgia leader Mikheil Saakashvili arrested in Kiev

Former Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili has been arrested in the Ukrainian capital, Kiev, accused of assisting a criminal organisation.

Masked officers dragged Mr Saakashvili from his home while supporters protested in the street.

Earlier, he addressed the crowd from the roof of the building calling on Ukrainians to drive "the thieves" away.

Mr Saakashvili has accused President Petro Poroshenko, his former ally, of failing to root out corruption.

Two days ago, he led a march in Kiev calling for the president to be impeached.

Mr Saakashvili's supporters tried to stop the police van taking him from leaving. Some of them clashed with security officers.
Mr Saakashvili, formerly Georgian, then Ukrainian, is now a stateless person,
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, after a falling out. Mr Saakashvili has accused the president of blocking efforts to stop corruption.

But in September
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where he faces the threat of possible extradition to Georgia, where he himself is wanted on corruption charges. He claims the accusations are politically motivated.

He served as one-time governor of the Odessa region after being appointed by Mr Poroshenko in 2015.

Before moving to Ukraine, Mr Saakashvili served for almost ten years as president of Georgia.
Ukrainian politics are, as always, strange.
 

Jura

General
I almost forgot Trump administration approves lethal arms sales to Ukraine
December 20
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The Trump administration has approved the largest U.S. commercial sale of lethal defensive weapons to Ukraine since 2014. The move was heavily supported by top Trump national security Cabinet officials and Congress but may complicate President Trump’s stated ambition to work with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

Administration officials confirmed that the State Department this month approved a commercial license authorizing the export of Model M107A1 Sniper Systems, ammunition, and associated parts and accessories to Ukraine, a sale valued at $41.5 million. These weapons address a specific vulnerability of Ukrainian forces fighting a Russian-backed separatist movement in two eastern provinces. There has been no approval to export the heavier weapons the Ukrainian government is asking for, such as Javelin antitank missiles.

Congress authorized such sales in 2014 in the
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, but the Obama administration never authorized large commercial or government sales, a move widely seen as a de facto decision not to provide lethal weapons to the Ukraine military. Senate Foreign Relations Committee Chairman Bob Corker (R-Tenn.), who co-sponsored the law, praised the Trump administration’s move.

“I’m pleased the administration approved the sale of defensive lethal arms to Ukraine,” Corker told me. “This decision was supported by Congress in legislation that became law three years ago and reflects our country’s longstanding commitment to Ukraine in the face of ongoing Russian aggression.”

A State Department spokesperson, speaking on background, said that although the United States has now licensed the commercial export of lethal weapons to Ukraine, the U.S. government has not sold or given weapons directly to Ukraine. There’s never been any official policy on such sales one way or another, the spokesperson said, adding that this license was granted on a case-by-case basis. There were licenses granted for small commercial sales of small arms to Ukraine before this year

Another senior Trump administration official said that Trump personally approved the decision to allow the issuing of the license after being presented a decision memo by Defense Secretary Jim Mattis and Secretary of State Rex Tillerson. While there was never a formal ban on such weapons transfers, the decision was discussed internally as a lifting of the de facto Obama administration restrictions, the official said.

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in October, the decision over whether to allow lethal arms sales to Ukraine had been sitting on Trump’s desk for months. The National Security Council’s Principals Committee, which includes Cabinet members, met months ago and provided several options to the president.

Experts and officials said Trump’s chosen option was measured; he didn’t approve everything the Ukrainians asked for but nonetheless crossed the line of approving lethal sales, a significant shift in his administration’s approach and U.S. policy overall.

“We have crossed the Rubicon, this is lethal weapons and I predict more will be coming,” said one senior congressional official. It’s likely no mere coincidence that
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lethal defense sales to Ukraine this week, which would happen only if the Canadian government knew the United States was on board, the official said.

The Trump administration notified leading congressional committees of the sale on Dec. 13 but didn’t make any public announcements, which some say reflects the sensitivity of the decision and concern about how it will be received by Trump supporters who long opposed the move, as well as by Putin.

“The way it was not rolled out tells you something, that they are concerned about the perception of this. They are not trumpeting this as a major policy shift or signature policy priority,” said
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, senior political scientist at the Rand Corporation.

The administration’s strategy of approving very limited arms sales is akin to a “Goldilocks” approach, he said, because it attempts to satisfy advocates while not sparking negative reaction by those who fear such a move could risk escalating the crisis.

One senior administration official who previously warned of this very risk is Fiona Hill, now the senior National Security Council director for Russia. She argued in a
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that if the United States arms Ukraine, “the Ukrainians won’t be the only ones caught in an escalating military conflict with Russia.”

It’s unclear whether Hill still holds that view, but other top Trump officials have been clear they support sending lethal arms to Ukraine. Mattis
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in Kiev in August that “defensive weapons are not provocative unless you are an aggressor, and clearly Ukraine is not an aggressor.” Tillerson
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his support in his Senate confirmation hearing.

Tillerson’s part-time special envoy on the Ukraine crisis, former U.S. ambassador to NATO Kurt Volker,
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he also supports providing lethal weapons to Ukraine. Volker is working with Moscow to revive a peace plan known as Minsk2, but progress is scarce.

According to Volker, Russia has not fulfilled any of its obligations, which include removing its unacknowledged troops and heavy weapons from Ukrainian territory. His argument is that the costs of Russia’s intervention should increase, making Putin choose whether to bear that burden or strike a deal.

Others, including Mattis, see the sales as a principled signal that the United States will support its allies. They say Ukraine
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and therefore lethal weapons shouldn’t be seen as a provocation.

Meanwhile, the fighting in Russian-occupied eastern Ukraine is heating up. According to a BBC report this week, Moscow is pulling all of its personnel from a Russian-Ukrainian
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that is meant to monitor a frequently violated truce.

Trump himself has consistently stated his desire to work with Putin to resolve the Ukraine crisis, dating back to his presidential campaign.

During
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, the Trump campaign beat back efforts to have the Republican platform endorse lethal assistance to Ukraine. Trump campaign officials pushed to soften a proposed amendment to remove the language “lethal defensive weapons” and replace it with “appropriate assistance.”

Trump has now decided that lethal defensive weapons constitute “appropriate assistance.” His decision to approve small amounts of weapons sales likely won’t fundamentally change Putin’s calculus or the trajectory of the war in Ukraine. But it’s one sure sign that Trump’s foreign policy views are evolving — or at least being influenced — as his presidency progresses.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
I almost forgot Trump administration approves lethal arms sales to Ukraine
December 20
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The M107A1 is a 12.7x99mm semi automatic Anti material scoped rifle.
Barrett-M107A1_29_inch.jpg
It comes in a 20 inch barrel or 29 inch barrel configuration it has a length of 57 inches for our metric centric it 140cm long... screw it 1.4 METERS!! 4.5 Feet!!! weighs in at 30 pounds or 14kg. It's considered a Anti material rifle not a sniper rifle because unless you are Sniping Robocop....


It's to much gun. the round which is the same as the M2 Browning and was used in world war 2 fighters produces such an effect that a near miss would induce hydroshock. that means that a near miss is potentially lethal. It's max range is around 4-6 km. As such it fits into that trouble spot of Treaties. Basically Treaty says "No you can't use it on humans" Where some snipers have said "Leave pink mist"
It's intended function is anti material, Radios, Jeeps, Parked light Aircraft, Drones and especially Explosive ordnance. The latter is among the most popular use. you set it up shoot it at a suspect bomb and the heat and pressure will set of most Composite explosive, thanks to its long range, you can do that from a nice spot far enough away to admire the blast but not get caught in it.

This kind of weapon has a ton of urban fear mongering. They will not take down helicopters in flight or 747's for that matter. They are not a Threat for gang bangers as good luck buying the $100 dollar rounds to fill a 10 round magazine and trying to hid that mother in your average car. Hollywood loves them reality is though This is not as big a deal as it is made out to be. I mean it's a big gun but such a specialized one that it really won't change much.
as a Sniper rifle it's not that accurate, It's massively heavy, and so huge it's hard to hide.
don't even ask about as an infantry weapon not even Arnold Schwarzenegger (in his prime) could lug this mother all day without issues.
 

Equation

Banned Idiot
The M107A1 is a 12.7x99mm semi automatic Anti material scoped rifle.
View attachment 44295
It comes in a 20 inch barrel or 29 inch barrel configuration it has a length of 57 inches for our metric centric it 140cm long... screw it 1.4 METERS!! 4.5 Feet!!! weighs in at 30 pounds or 14kg. It's considered a Anti material rifle not a sniper rifle because unless you are Sniping Robocop....


It's to much gun. the round which is the same as the M2 Browning and was used in world war 2 fighters produces such an effect that a near miss would induce hydroshock. that means that a near miss is potentially lethal. It's max range is around 4-6 km. As such it fits into that trouble spot of Treaties. Basically Treaty says "No you can't use it on humans" Where some snipers have said "Leave pink mist"
It's intended function is anti material, Radios, Jeeps, Parked light Aircraft, Drones and especially Explosive ordnance. The latter is among the most popular use. you set it up shoot it at a suspect bomb and the heat and pressure will set of most Composite explosive, thanks to its long range, you can do that from a nice spot far enough away to admire the blast but not get caught in it.

This kind of weapon has a ton of urban fear mongering. They will not take down helicopters in flight or 747's for that matter. They are not a Threat for gang bangers as good luck buying the $100 dollar rounds to fill a 10 round magazine and trying to hid that mother in your average car. Hollywood loves them reality is though This is not as big a deal as it is made out to be. I mean it's a big gun but such a specialized one that it really won't change much.
as a Sniper rifle it's not that accurate, It's massively heavy, and so huge it's hard to hide.
don't even ask about as an infantry weapon not even Arnold Schwarzenegger (in his prime) could lug this mother all day without issues.
It's good for mechanized infantry in a mobile armor tactical support role OR dinosaur hunting in a new Jurassic Park Safari land.;):D
 

Jura

General
Thursday at 6:42 PM
I almost forgot Trump administration approves lethal arms sales to Ukraine
December 20
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and here's more: US agrees to send lethal weapons to Ukraine, angering Russia
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The Trump administration has approved a plan to provide lethal weapons to Ukraine, a long-awaited move that deepens America’s involvement in the military conflict and may further strain relations with Russia. Moscow responded angrily on Saturday.

The new arms include American-made Javelin anti-tank missiles, U.S. officials said late Friday. Ukraine has long sought to boost its defenses against Russian-backed separatists armed with tanks that have rolled through eastern Ukraine during violence that has killed more than 10,000 since 2014. Previously, the U.S. has provided Ukraine with support equipment and training, and has let private companies sell some small arms like rifles.

The officials describing the plan weren’t authorized to discuss it publicly and demanded anonymity.

The move is likely to become another sore point between Washington and Moscow, as President Donald Trump contends with ongoing questions about whether he’s too hesitant to confront the Kremlin. Ukraine accuses Russia of sending the tanks, and the U.S. says Moscow is arming, training and fighting alongside the separatists.

Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov said the U.S. decision will only make the conflict more deadly and suggested that Russia could be forced to respond. He also said the U.S. can no longer cast itself as a mediator. “It’s not a mediator. It’s an accomplice in fueling the war,” Ryabkov said in a statement.

The intensified support for Ukraine’s military also comes amid early discussions about sending U.N. peacekeepers to eastern Ukraine, to improve security conditions not only for Ukrainians but for monitors from the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe who are on the ground.

The U.S. and other nations were cautiously optimistic when Russian President Vladimir Putin proposed to send in peacekeepers. But there are major disagreements about how and where the peacekeepers would operate, especially about whether they’d be deployed only on the “line of conflict” between separatists and the government. The U.S. and Ukraine want peacekeepers deployed throughout the separatist-controlled regions stretching to the Ukraine-Russia border.

By approving a plan to provide lethal weapons to Ukraine, the Trump administration could see it as providing leverage in these negotiations. While some are skeptical about Putin’s proposal, others suggest he may be looking for a way out of the conflict. Alexander Vershbow, former deputy secretary general of NATO and a former ambassador to Moscow, said a U.N. peacekeeping mission could serve as cover for Russia to withdraw its forces and weapons from eastern Ukraine.

Trump had been considering the plan for some time after the State Department and the Pentagon signed off earlier this year. President Barack Obama also considered sending lethal weapons to Ukraine, but left office without doing so.

The State Department, responsible for overseeing foreign military sales, would not confirm that anti-tank missiles or other lethal weapons would be sent. But in a statement late Friday, State Department spokeswoman Heather Nauert said the U.S. had decided to provide “enhanced defensive capabilities” to help Ukraine build its military long-term, defend its sovereignty and “deter further aggression.”

“U.S. assistance is entirely defensive in nature, and as we have always said, Ukraine is a sovereign country and has a right to defend itself,” Nauert said.

The White House’s National Security Council declined to comment.

Although the portable Javelin anti-tank missiles can kill, proponents for granting them to Ukraine have long argued they are considered “defensive” because the Ukrainians would use them to defend their territory and deter the Russians, not to attack a foreign country or seize new territory.

In thanking the U.S. for its support, Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko addressed the concerns over how the weapons would be used.

“American weapons in the hands of Ukrainian soldiers are not for an offensive, but for a decisive rebuff of the aggressor, the protection of Ukrainian soldiers and civilians, as well as for effective self-defense,” he wrote on Facebook. “It is also a trans-Atlantic vaccination against the Russian virus of aggression.”

Under law, the State Department must tell Congress of planned foreign military sales, triggering a review period in which lawmakers can act to stop the sale. It was unclear whether the administration had formally notified Congress, but lawmakers are unlikely to try to block it given that Democrats and Republicans alike have long called on the government to take the step.

The move comes as the United States and European nations struggle to break a long logjam in the Ukraine-Russia conflict that erupted three years ago when fighting broke out between Russian-backed separatists and government troops in the east. France, Russia and Germany brokered a peace arrangement in 2015 that has lowered violence but not stopped it, and a political settlement outlined in the deal hadn’t been fully implemented.

In recent days, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson has warned that violence is up about 60 percent this year. In Europe earlier this month, Tillerson called Russia’s involvement the biggest tension point between the former Cold War rivals.

“It stands as the single most difficult obstacle to us renormalizing the relationship with Russia, which we badly would like to do,” Tillerson said.

Both the Obama administration and the Trump administration had expressed concerns in the past that injecting more weapons into the conflict was unlikely to resolve it, especially considering that Russia is well-equipped to respond to any Ukrainian escalation with an even stronger escalation of its own. Sending lethal weapons to Ukraine also creates the troubling possibility that American arms could kill Russian soldiers, a situation that could thrust the two nuclear-armed nations closer to direct confrontation.

The United States, under Obama, also imposed sanctions on Russia for its invasion and annexation of Crimea. The Trump administration has insisted those sanctions will stay in place until Moscow gives up the Crimean Peninsula.
 

Jura

General
It's good for mechanized infantry in a mobile armor tactical support role OR dinosaur hunting in a new Jurassic Park Safari land.;):D
the Safari part is funny anyway I'm guessing the main Russian concern is the Javelin: I'd expect it to blast any Separatists' tank (= former Ukrainian tank, right?) just like that
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Javelin missiles were designed to eat Soviet tanks. The separatists faction tanks whether Russian supplied in the modern or Soviet union are the same models Javelin missiles were designed for. Unless the Russians started giving the Separatists factions T90s or heavily upgraded T72 series tanks and more modern armor it would give Ukrainian infantry a leg up. Assuming that the Ukrainian forces are disciplined and competent in there use.
 

Viktor Jav

Senior Member
Registered Member
Javelin missiles were designed to eat Soviet tanks. The separatists faction tanks whether Russian supplied in the modern or Soviet union are the same models Javelin missiles were designed for. Unless the Russians started giving the Separatists factions T90s or heavily upgraded T72 series tanks and more modern armor it would give Ukrainian infantry a leg up. Assuming that the Ukrainian forces are disciplined and competent in there use.
Or Russia could potentially sneak in some APS for the separatists. Though such high levels of tech could potentially open a whole can of worms.
On the side though, unless some serious firepower is obtained. I find it unlikely that either side could gain and advantage over the other, the war in Ukraine has become a guerrilla, low intensity style war. This kind of war is often long and tortuously taxing.
 

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