New Energy Vehicles (NEVs) in China

B.I.B.

Captain
Dude, modern ICE vehicles are full of electronics nowadays.
Why do we need those fancy electronics anyway? whats wrong with manual wind up windows and learning how to drive properly?. Then one would not deed all those stupid driving aids like self parking and steering/drive etc etc
 
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B.I.B.

Captain
I think the US will easily find a way to prevent Chinese EVs from getting to the US just like they prevent Chinese smartphones from getting a chance before the chip ban. I think Chinese car companies better not have goals of selling in the US. They're probably doomed to fail. If it happens they just see it as a bonus. I can see why Jack Ma probably is having his troubles. He was probably getting into things where the West led by the US can easily cut him off and thus damaging China.
Well if Ant Group was to crash, the disaster for China could be greater than the GFC.
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Why do we need those fancy electronics anyway? whats wrong with manual wind up windows and learning how to drive properly?. Then one would not deed all those stupid driving aids like self parking and steering/drive etc etc
Fuel economy being one of the reasons

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Unit injector system: optimal pressure in each cylinder The unit injector system is an electronically controlled system developed by Bosch for diesel direct injection. It is suitable for cars and light commercial vehicles with up to 5 l engine capacity and 312 hp engine power, the first installation in series production cars was 1998.
...
Advantages:

  • High performance for clean and powerful engine
  • High engine power balanced against low consumption and low engine emissions
  • High degree of efficiency due to compact design
  • Low noise level due to direct assembly in the engine block
  • Injection pressures up to 2,200 bar for the ideal combination of air-fuel mixture.
...
The use of electronic control allows for special functions; such as temperature controlled injection timing, cylinder balancing (smooth idle), switching off individual cylinders under part load for further reduction in emissions and fuel consumption, and multi-pulse injection (more than one injection occurrence during one engine cycle).
 

voyager1

Captain
Registered Member
Well if Ant Group was to crash, the disaster for China could be greater than the GFC.
Honestly, having a crash every X (15-20) years is probably healthy. There is a lot of debt problems for China to handle right now. A crash would be good because it would solve a lot of problems due to wrong allocation of capital.

However, due to its political system, there is no way that the Chinese Gov will allow it to ever happen and also due to this competition with the US.
 

voyager1

Captain
Registered Member
Tour of BYD factory in Shenzhen and their impressive NEVs.

Honestly, not impressive.
Their production line looks so much 20th century, too much manpower and too litle automation

BYD should be taking lessons from Tesla on how to automate as much as possible in order to have high efficiency and profit margins
 

Tyler

Captain
Registered Member
Honestly, not impressive.
Their production line looks so much 20th century, too much manpower and too litle automation

BYD should be taking lessons from Tesla on how to automate as much as possible in order to have high efficiency and profit margins
BYD is doing just fine. Automation is just doing the welding and painting part of the assembly. At Tesla they still need people to put the parts together. Tesla is not more automated than BYD at all.
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Honestly, not impressive.
Their production line looks so much 20th century, too much manpower and too litle automation

BYD should be taking lessons from Tesla on how to automate as much as possible in order to have high efficiency and profit margins
Not everything Musk touched is gold

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Musk now admits he was wrong about this. "Excessive automation at Tesla was a mistake,"
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recently. "To be precise, my mistake. Humans are underrated."

"We had this crazy, complex network of conveyor belts,"
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. "And it was not working, so we got rid of that whole thing."

Musk is discovering that large-scale car manufacturing is really hard, and it's not easy to improve on the methods of conventional automakers. And while automation obviously plays an important role in car manufacturing, it's not the magic bullet Musk imagined a couple of years ago. Far from leapfrogging the techniques of conventional automakers, Tesla is now struggling just to match the efficiency of its more established rivals.
 

voyager1

Captain
Registered Member
Not everything Musk touched is gold

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Musk now admits he was wrong about this. "Excessive automation at Tesla was a mistake,"
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
recently. "To be precise, my mistake. Humans are underrated."

"We had this crazy, complex network of conveyor belts,"
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
. "And it was not working, so we got rid of that whole thing."

Musk is discovering that large-scale car manufacturing is really hard, and it's not easy to improve on the methods of conventional automakers. And while automation obviously plays an important role in car manufacturing, it's not the magic bullet Musk imagined a couple of years ago. Far from leapfrogging the techniques of conventional automakers, Tesla is now struggling just to match the efficiency of its more established rivals.
Thats an old story mate.

Look up the new single cast techniques used on model Y to see how much they have improved their efficiency and their automation.

Nobody here is talking about 100% automation
 

Skywatcher

Captain
Not everything Musk touched is gold

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Musk now admits he was wrong about this. "Excessive automation at Tesla was a mistake,"
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
recently. "To be precise, my mistake. Humans are underrated."

"We had this crazy, complex network of conveyor belts,"
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
. "And it was not working, so we got rid of that whole thing."

Musk is discovering that large-scale car manufacturing is really hard, and it's not easy to improve on the methods of conventional automakers. And while automation obviously plays an important role in car manufacturing, it's not the magic bullet Musk imagined a couple of years ago. Far from leapfrogging the techniques of conventional automakers, Tesla is now struggling just to match the efficiency of its more established rivals.
Tesla Factory in Fremont employs 10,000 people (which is more than the Fremont Assembly or NUMMI site predecessor facilities ever employed at one time) while also having somewhat higher production figures than those two ever did.

Granted, a larger part of those 10,000 may actually be involved in non-direct assembly line jobs than the Fremont Assembly/NUMMI workforces.
 
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