franco-russe
Senior Member
Fine work.
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The Q-5, J-7, J-8 and older PLAAF aircraft
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but isn't it possible that is just a dogma? and maybe we shouldn't blindly stick to a dogma?
Isn't there at least some chance the serial system isnt fully understood, no matter how it seemed? Or that perhaps the serials for a single regiment include both j8 and conversion training j7 or perhaps even q5? So out of 28 serials out there maybe not all 28 are actually applicable to combat coded j8?
In the end, what does occam's razor say? Which is more likely, that the explanation of serial system is flawless or that there are 28 j8 in each regiment but somehow there has never been a satellite image of even 24, let alone 28 planes on ANY airbase at ANY time? Once again, planes do sit most of the time on the apron. It just seems impossible that some 10 bases and total of over 30 different images never produced such a sight?
franco-russe
Senior Member
No, the serials system is correctly understood, but unfortunately the J-7 regiments are poorly covered.
And yes, twin-seaters are included in the regimental serial system and account has been made for them.
One of the best known regiments (in particular courtesy of escobar) is 7 Div 21 Regt Yanqing, where known serials are
J-7B 11081, 11082, 11084, 11088, 11185, 11187, 11188, 11189, 11283, 11284, 11285, 11289, JJ-7A 11481, 11485.
And yes, twin-seaters are included in the regimental serial system and account has been made for them.
One of the best known regiments (in particular courtesy of escobar) is 7 Div 21 Regt Yanqing, where known serials are
J-7B 11081, 11082, 11084, 11088, 11185, 11187, 11188, 11189, 11283, 11284, 11285, 11289, JJ-7A 11481, 11485.
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i was talking about j8 for the last two-three posts or so. j7 i wont even go into as there are too many of those, too much work there.
so you are suggesting that there are serials within each j8 regiment (not j7 regiment) that cover 32 (or 34?) planes, out of which 28 are always j8 and the rest are jj7 trainers (what about those q5 looking planes then? trainers also?)
considering plaaf seems to be happy enough with 20 single seater j11 in a regiment plus 4 trainer conversion j11s in the same regiment, i don't think it is such a wild assumption there are actually less combat j8 in each regiment...
i just wish photographic evidence would firmly support the math stemming from the serial system.
at least then a list of photographs of at least two different j8 regiments where there are actually 28 different photos of 28 different j8 planes (not some of them being jj7 trainers) with 28 different serials, yet each of them visibly sporting the serial from the same regiment. is there such a collection of photos anywhere? if yes, where?
so you are suggesting that there are serials within each j8 regiment (not j7 regiment) that cover 32 (or 34?) planes, out of which 28 are always j8 and the rest are jj7 trainers (what about those q5 looking planes then? trainers also?)
considering plaaf seems to be happy enough with 20 single seater j11 in a regiment plus 4 trainer conversion j11s in the same regiment, i don't think it is such a wild assumption there are actually less combat j8 in each regiment...
i just wish photographic evidence would firmly support the math stemming from the serial system.
at least then a list of photographs of at least two different j8 regiments where there are actually 28 different photos of 28 different j8 planes (not some of them being jj7 trainers) with 28 different serials, yet each of them visibly sporting the serial from the same regiment. is there such a collection of photos anywhere? if yes, where?
The second life of the J-6 :
About 200 in 4 units in MR Nankin, close Taiwan ofc...
Members who know Chinese sites would nice for me to communicate please.
Because to find it !!! ...
About 200 in 4 units in MR Nankin, close Taiwan ofc...
Members who know Chinese sites would nice for me to communicate please.
Because to find it !!! ...
ladioussupp
Junior Member
Professor Fang, chief designer of J-7BG, gave advice to Sri Lanka Air Force, user of J-7G, to shoot down rebellion Zlin Z-43. After radar looking down and acquiring target, J-7 pilot followed the advice to launch AAM immediately when the target is locked. Before taking his advice, Sri Lanka air force thought Chinese AAM needs more time to steadily aim at the target than Western counterpart. Hence few chances to achieve air-to-air victory were missed.
Here's a more detailed translation.
斯方飞行员如实回答：西方同类产品的瞄准锁定时间很长，估计你们中国的更长。听到这个答案，方锦星微微一笑，他一边安慰飞行员一边解释使用方法：“你要对我们的飞机有信心、对中国头瞄和导弹有信心！只要头瞄光圈套住敌机，你就按按钮发射导弹，不用等。保证击落！”
Sri Lankan J-7G's had consistently failed to shoot down Tamil Tiger aircraft during the 2007-2009 conflict so the Sri Lankan Air Force began to question the performance of the J-7G's. Chief designer Fang was brought in to advise the Sri Lankan Air Force on how to operate the J-7G's and also to explain the failures to shoot down enemy aircraft. During a lesson given by Fang to Sri Lankan pilots, Fang asked why the pilots had hesitated to fire even though the HMS was locked onto the enemy aircraft. The pilots responded with "Western missiles takes longer to aim, Chinese missiles would be even longer, right?" Fang responded that the pilots must have confidence in the aircraft and the equipment; once the HMS successfully locks on, press the fire button immediately. Less than a year later, J-7G's were scrambled to intercept unidentified aircraft. One of them was a Zlin Z 43 aircraft flying at 500m altitude. The J-7G pilot fired as soon as the HMS locked on and thus the Sri Lankan Air Force claimed its first air to air kill.
plawolf
Lieutenant General
Real facepalm moment for the Sri Lankan Air Force that, I guess they should just be greatful that the enemy only had unarmed (as far as air to air weapons are concerned) planes so they didn't actually loose any fighters and pilots as a result of such a groundless and silly assumption.
The whole point of a lock on tone is to tell the pilot the missile is locked on and can be launched. What else were they expecting or waiting for? This illustrates the importance of live fire training for pilots.
On the bright side, this article does confirm that HMS is operational on J/F7Gs even though I personally have never seen a picture of a J/F7 pilot wearing one, and it also suggest that Chinese IRAAMs (PL8/9 I would expect) have a faster lock on performance than whatever western IRAAMs the Sri Lankan Air Force had experience with.