Taiwan Military News, Reports, Data, etc.


GTI

New Member
Registered Member
I think you mean the DPP has the CCP to thank for going in hard on the HK Opposition in the run up to the Taiwanese elections. Even if the US government had not said anything, Taiwanese would have still be worried about what they saw happening in a territory that had been "guaranteed" autonomy.

What about if the US government/CIA/NED etc. had not DONE anything as well...?

In any case your posts always swing between boring and ludicrous (and goes without saying, full of superiority and a deluded sense of exceptionalism).

We don’t care. Your time is over. Go handle your decline and leave the remaining 6.1 billion of us in peace.
 

Gloire_bb

Junior Member
Registered Member
The US military operates on the assumption that its members are willing to lay down their lives to serve their country overseas.
Their country.

It's foolish to underestimate this obligation (this is what supports the whole system of US alliances, after all), but it shouldn't be overestimated either. This is why, for example, eastern European countries(actual NATO countries) are so serious about getting US boots on the ground(read - in the harm's way).
Even this isn't a true guarantee in all honesty, but at least it'll ensure that the US will fight.

Unpopular war(especially if it'll be felt that dog is getting wagged by its tail) probably won't be fought.
 
I think you mean the DPP has the CCP to thank for going in hard on the HK Opposition in the run up to the Taiwanese elections. Even if the US government had not said anything,
They think that's hard? That's not even a warm-up. Look at how the US treats its BLM protestors... and they say China's brutal. So you know China wasn't anywhere near going hard.
Taiwanese would have still be worried about what they saw happening in a territory that had been "guaranteed" autonomy.
Guarantees come with obvious conditions. If someone guarantees you that he's a peaceful person so you throw punches at him, his guarantee is void. If Hong Kong turned into an Asian version on Somalia, those guarantees are gone.
The US military operates on the assumption that its members are willing to lay down their lives to serve their country overseas. Similarly NATO and the US' other defence pacts also require US military personnel accepting they may die to protect other people. If the US President orders an intervention over an invasion of Taiwan, those sailors, pilots and marines will do their duty. They're not going to crack out legal textbooks and question whether their orders are necessary on the basis there is no formal defence treaty.
You've missed the point. Soldiers will die for their commanders orders, but will the commanders sacrifice the lives of these soldiers? That is the obvious question. This was a terrible attempt by you to answer the question in an irrelevant way.
Beijing: "Thank you, we have now pencilled in a date for your annexation."
On the contrary, they would then have created the goodwill foundation for negotiation of the terms of reunion. If China has to get its military hands dirty, Beijing will dictate to the ROC the final terms.
 

zgx09t

Junior Member
Registered Member
It's not even funny how naive and clueless these ITers are when it comes to two powers jockeying for regional dominance in East Asia.
Taiwan is like a woman in a threesome, with two big dudes taking turns to ravage her.

Americans won't die for you. What happened was you did get, still getting and will get more and more mainland punishments when US stirs shit up pretending they would come trotting to your rescue. NO they won't. Under Trump, they pushed the envelope but didn't dare to cross the red line. For they know China will back up her words with the real violence and destruction. Both House and Senate passed NO binding laws on Taiwan-US relations. Strategic clarity? More like we don't know how many here in US are buying it, so let's stay with the same old ambiguity thing, but keep talking shit up so some would believe it if repeated enough. Lee Tung-hui was real die-hard pro-independence guy. He didn't dare to run for the final dash in 96. Why? US reined him in, seeing the real war coming. Tsai Ing-wen is pretty lame compared to Lee Tung-hui. TIers, if you don't have balls to get it done in 96, forget about it in 2021, or forever for that matter. There's no way out for ITers trapped in a fantasy lala land hoping some rich daddy would come and rescue you when hot metals fly. It gets lamer and lamer every day with every reasoning and attempt to justify to stay and linger on what you don't have, cannot afford and yet fantasize with made up day dreaming words and diplomatic window dressings. Pathetic.
 

supersnoop

Junior Member
Registered Member
Just in case the absurdity of the DPP government was in doubt

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Their portrayal of the HK National Security Law as some kind of attack on rights is kind of laughable when you see they passed their own law in 2019, nearly a year earlier than HK.

I will leave it at that since this thread always gets dicey. However, I did originally mention this in the context of the political undercurrent guiding the TW defence strategy.
 

Mr T

Senior Member
Unpopular war(especially if it'll be felt that dog is getting wagged by its tail) probably won't be fought.
That's been a long-standing attack line against the various US-orientated military alliances since the start of the Cold War. The US is decadent, it's morally weak, it's isolationist, it doesn't care about you, it will abandon you when you most need it - you should make friends with us instead.

If Taiwanese are foolish to thinking that the US will help then the same applies to Japan, the ROK, Middle Eastern states and Baltic states.

This is why, for example, eastern European countries(actual NATO countries) are so serious about getting US boots on the ground(read - in the harm's way).

It's more about symbolism to show that NATO is a unified alliance rather than using Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia as an expendable buffer against Russia. It's not a ploy to get Americans dead and then the rest of the population angry. If Russia thought there was a chance the US wouldn't help then it would avoid bases where American personnel were stationed or warn off Washington so they had a few hours to pull out their personnel.

Snoop, if you want to have a discussion about Taiwanese politics feel free to send me a DM and I'll reply. I'll just observe that international indexes that show how democratic a territory are normally show Taiwan ranking much higher than HK (and obviously mainland China). Try the Economist Intelligence Unit's index - last time Taiwan was 31st (on a par with Beligum) whilst HK was 75th. There are others as well.
 
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Gatekeeper

Colonel
Registered Member
Guys I know he wouldn't read this. Nor is he intelligent enough to debate this.

Bit for the rest of us in the REAL world. His post showed how he lives in a different world from the rest of us.

I think you mean the DPP has the CCP to thank for going in hard on the HK Opposition in the run up to the Taiwanese elections. Even if the US government had not said anything, Taiwanese would have still be worried about what they saw happening in a territory that had been "guaranteed" autonomy.

See how his mind bending abilities have twisted This? China has not changed anything in Hong Kong. Despite the best efforts of the condoms, and foreign forces to force a change, and illicite a reaction from China. For over a year, they've been killing and burning people. Disrupt the ordinary lives of civilians. And yet the only troops you see on the street is PLA troops with road sweeping equipment sweeping the roads. Unlike that in the U.S. just one day of riots, out comes 25,000 troops. And yet in his head, China is the bad guy? And China couldn't guarantee basic autonomy!

The US military operates on the assumption that its members are willing to lay down their lives to serve their country overseas. Similarly NATO and the US' other defence pacts also require US military personnel accepting they may die to protect other people. If the US President orders an intervention over an invasion of Taiwan, those sailors, pilots and marines will do their duty. They're not going to crack out legal textbooks and question whether their orders are necessary on the basis there is no formal defence treaty.

See how this got twisted to basic soldier functionaries. No one was questioning the bravery of the U.S. marines and their duty to die for their country.

So please stop with your mind gymnastics please. Every post I see on this subject is about the bravery of the politicians to act upon their 'promised' to defend a far off land that no longer hold strategic value to them, and where defending said 'promised' would certainly means enormous loss of life on the scale of Korea and Vietnam.

Beijing: "Thank you, we have now pencilled in a date for your annexation."

Again, you are living in a world you wish to live instead of the reality we all live in. Basically, in our reality, you can't possibly annexed something that belongs to you. You should go and educate yourself and then come back and tell us all about it instead of showing yourself as ignorant of the fact. And quoting the economist intelligent unit! Gee give me strength. No wonder you thinking is all lobbed sided!
 
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azretonov

Junior Member
Registered Member
Taipei has the most difficult decade ahead. The traditional and long time US allies are more suspicious of her intents now, than they ever did since the WWII. Apart from their treaty alliances, the Americans are in conflict of interests with their NATO allies over a number of topics, as well. If Germany or France is having trouble with the US over more basic and so-called traditional topics such as Russia and Iran, what guarantee is there for Taiwan?

At this point Taiwan needs a more favorable position to for a soft reunification as it is inevitable. From a position of strength such as their unique type of industries, which is quite crucial for both China and the global suppy chain, they can strike a bargain over some topics. But this is a time sensitive matter and the sole advantage of Taiwan is fading away as the time goes by.

TBH, I don't really see the point drawing even a rough comparison between Hong Kong and Taiwan in a deterministic manner and, try to get a decisive result . Those cases are hardly alike and, I don't know if anyone here actually do the reading on China from the western scholars but since the handover of Hong Kong, the western perspective have been generally deterministic as if there was some prophecy on CCP's demise by the Hongkongers hands. As early as 2003, you can find scholars advising the contemporary western governments to use the so-called opportunities in Hong Kong. Apparently some Hongkongers took these sort of advices to the heart and picked the wrong course of action. In comparison the Chinese security forces had been less than aggressive than their European counterparts in their contemporary incidents.
 

tamsen_ikard

Junior Member
Registered Member
Taipei has the most difficult decade ahead. The traditional and long time US allies are more suspicious of her intents now, than they ever did since the WWII. Apart from their treaty alliances, the Americans are in conflict of interests with their NATO allies over a number of topics, as well. If Germany or France is having trouble with the US over more basic and so-called traditional topics such as Russia and Iran, what guarantee is there for Taiwan?

At this point Taiwan needs a more favorable position to for a soft reunification as it is inevitable. From a position of strength such as their unique type of industries, which is quite crucial for both China and the global suppy chain, they can strike a bargain over some topics. But this is a time sensitive matter and the sole advantage of Taiwan is fading away as the time goes by.

TBH, I don't really see the point drawing even a rough comparison between Hong Kong and Taiwan in a deterministic manner and, try to get a decisive result . Those cases are hardly alike and, I don't know if anyone here actually do the reading on China from the western scholars but since the handover of Hong Kong, the western perspective have been generally deterministic as if there was some prophecy on CCP's demise by the Hongkongers hands. As early as 2003, you can find scholars advising the contemporary western governments to use the so-called opportunities in Hong Kong. Apparently some Hongkongers took these sort of advices to the heart and picked the wrong course of action. In comparison the Chinese security forces had been less than aggressive than their European counterparts in their contemporary incidents.


Actually its the opposite. Taiwan has the easiest decade ahead, especially for DPP and its supporters. China is at its most dangerous period now. Why? Because China is now getting closer to surpassing US. It is still weaker than the west and thus US feels it must act now to suppress China with all it has. China is also not yet strong enough to overpower through this pressure coming from the west.

It is why Taiwan is getting so much support and attention from the west. Taiwanese themselves feel this is the time to go for independence cause if they wait longer, China will be too strong in the future and even the west won't dare to support them in a war. That's why Taiwan independence has so much popular support. Its now or never for them.

Even a few years back, the feeling in the US was to avoid war with China over Taiwan. Now the mood is that if they can force China to back down without war then that's good but if there is war, that's even better cause they still have chance to beat China down now.

China must use all its diplomatic skills to tough it in the next decade to suppress Taiwan independence and western desire to go all out. They must cajole the west to remain soft. Once China develops its military much further and also surpasses US gdp then this period of danger will pass.
 

Gatekeeper

Colonel
Registered Member
Actually its the opposite. Taiwan has the easiest decade ahead, especially for DPP and its supporters. China is at its most dangerous period now. Why? Because China is now getting closer to surpassing US. It is still weaker than the west and thus US feels it must act now to suppress China with all it has. China is also not yet strong enough to overpower through this pressure coming from the west.

It is why Taiwan is getting so much support and attention from the west. Taiwanese themselves feel this is the time to go for independence cause if they wait longer, China will be too strong in the future and even the west won't dare to support them in a war. That's why Taiwan independence has so much popular support. Its now or never for them.

Even a few years back, the feeling in the US was to avoid war with China over Taiwan. Now the mood is that if they can force China to back down without war then that's good but if there is war, that's even better cause they still have chance to beat China down now.

China must use all its diplomatic skills to tough it in the next decade to suppress Taiwan independence and western desire to go all out. They must cajole the west to remain soft. Once China develops its military much further and also surpasses US gdp then this period of danger will pass.

I'm not necessary disagreeing with you. And no doubts there are people in high place in Taiwan and US are thinking this right now.

BUT, the question is what's the long term? Just because you declared UDI, it doesn't mean it's going to be the end of the matter. And that's where Taiwan is caught in a bind. Because it can't escape the fact of geography and history. China, and it's people all feel the injustices committed by the western and Japanese forces over the island. And it us because of this that China will never relinquish claims on Taiwan. Heck. Even Taiwanese themself, those on KMT still acknowledged their are part of China, indeed officially Taiwan still claim Mongolia!

So declaring UDI means Jack sxxt. Really
 

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