PLAN Carrier Strike Group and Airwing

Re: My trip to the US Navy Reserve Fleet in Bremerton, WA

Well Bush did lead the war to Iraq....... They should of done it like how the PLAN does it, no people... maybe PLAN carrier will be name Mao Zedong... but i think it will be Beijing or Shanghai....

Re: Anti-Carrier Trump Card

bd popeye said:

Thank you Jeff...A couple of years ago I spoke to some kids at Pt Loma HS in San Diego as a Vietnam vet about this very subject. On that occasion I was allowed to set the record straight.

Click to expand...

Thank you Popeye. MIlitarily Vietnam was a clear US victory...politically it was an abject defeat for the U.S. that allowed S. Vietnam to fall, and has reverberated in the area ever since and contributed to the current geo-political situation in the area that is now experiencing the rapid rise of the PRC economically and politically, and the significant buildup of the PLAN.

It will be interesting to see how the relationship between Vietnam and China plays out in these circumstances.

Re: Anti-Carrier Trump Card

adeptitus said:

...the Soviets had sent the first man to the moon.

Click to expand...

Excuse me?

adeptitus said:

...The arguement over winning or losing the Vietnam war is mostly irrevelent.

Click to expand...

Not for the millions of human beings in the area (Vietnam, Cambodia, etc.) that suffered and died as a result of the loss of South Vietnam.

The bottom line is...it happened. The US political heriarchy lost its will and we lost an ally in the process when we did not respond to an abject treaty violation. Those particular ouitcomes reverberate in that particular area to this day, and play on the current geo-political situation. A number of countries, understandably wonder, in the event of any major trouble...will the US be there for the long haul?

To me that is the critical political issue of our time in the region and in the current geo-political circumstance. How the Philippines, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, etc. ultimately answer that question in their ow mind will determine the future landscape of the entire region.

Re: Anti-Carrier Trump Card

I'll say this, the only US Navy surface combat vessel with no TLAMs is the FFG-7 Perry Class, but it is armed with Harpoons,torperdoes and versions of the SM1 and SM2.

Click to expand...

Raven..according to my son who is on active duty in the USN the Navy wants to eventually get rid of the FFG's and repace them with still more DDG's. Also in the future USN LCS will come into play.

Many USN FFG's are deployed on drug interdiction missions.

As for the orignal topic of an Anti-carrier trump card..Is there really one? Not right now. The best bet the PLAN would have, as I have said before, is the Song class sub. But the USN is working on better methods of decteing these boats with the contracting of a Swedish diesel boat.

Re: Anti-Carrier Trump Card

bd popeye said:

The best bet the PLAN would have, as I have said before, is the Song class sub.

Click to expand...

Or the new Yuan or Kilos.

...and only then if the US Navy happened to run into where they were hiding and waiting. Those diesel electrics are excellent litoral water vessels...but on the high seas east of Taiwn where the CBGs would be operating, they are too slow to keep up with the CBGs and if they tried to go up to any higher speed operations, I believe they would be found and killed IMHO.

So, the USN will have to stay out to sea a good ways, which will work fine for carrier aircraft ops, and they will have to do a heck of a job with ASW subs, vessels, and aircraft, cleaning the path of the CBG of any lurking diesel electrics on the high seas.

That will be the key and I believe the USN will be able to saturate the ASW environment enough in front of the path of the carrier to do so. Do you think such an effort would currently discover the modern diesel electrics?

Re: Conventional CVs

Raven said:

I have been fortunate to have been to NAS Oceana where much of the Atlantic fleet is based. It is only then can one see how much of Naval Flight Operations is done just to prepare the men and women of the US Navy and Marine Corps to launch and land on the carriers.

Click to expand...

I have seen those landings as well. Extremely impressive. When with the family, we would sometimes just stop on the side of the highway to watch those F-14s come in.

Re: What will the 1st PLAN Carrier Battle Group (CBG) look like?

I have been fortunate to have been to NAS Oceana where much of the Atlantic fleet is based. It is only then can one see how much of Naval Flight Operations is done just to prepare the men and women of the US Navy and Marine Corps to launch and land on the carriers.

Click to expand...

Raven I was in the USN for 20 years. I was an "airdale" Served on 5 carriers and major NAS's & squadrons. I've been telling members of this forum about how hard the US Navy trains. One member said it was "BS" and just US exxagerating how much the USN trains..Oh really? Some really have no clue. If anyone could experience 10 days at sea on a USN CVN watching the whole ship work... Espeically the flight deck. They would be in awe period. Having a CV is one thing. But operating one in a efficent manner takes time i.e. experience and lots of training!

bd popeye said:

Having a CV is one thing. But operating one in a efficent manner takes time i.e. experience and lots of training!

Click to expand...

Amen popeye...as evidenced, even after more than a decade, by the dismal number of sorties the Russians are capable of with their one carrier...and it is a larger one like Varyag.

I do not believe they perform hardly any night time activity...compared to 24 hour operation capability on the decks of US carriers.

Here's a pic of some night time ops...I am sure with which you are very familiar...

Re: My trip to the US Navy Reserve Fleet in Bremerton, WA

sumdud said:

But what did Bush do that was spetacular? Enough to get a shipe named after him so quickly?

Click to expand...

This is BUSH41. The 41st president, the current Bush's father. My guess is it had to do with his role in the first Iraq war. Huge coalition, huge success as to the aims of that coalition.

For many Americans, it finally shook of the spectre of the Vietnam War and the political failure (it was NOT a military defeat) that caused the loss there.

But that's just my opinion...probably just as much, if not more so, it could be purely political.

Re: My trip to the US Navy Reserve Fleet in Bremerton, WA

I'm just wondering, how many more helicopters than 4500 and how many more planes than 3000 should have been lost in order for us to be able to say it was a military loss, compared to north vietnamese high tech losses? Also, how much money was spent in that war by US and how much by north vietnamese?