Discussing Biden's Potential China Policy

siegecrossbow said:

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He is an old guy who is tired of giving politically correct answers (as most old people are) and he isn't planning to run for 2nd term so no reason to play the domestic audience

Everyone knew it was a stupid question including the reporter,

but it was asked for sound bites not anything constructive

I know Biden isn't what he used to be in his younger years, but damn it he seems to be hitting the right targets from the looks of it

Release pressure on Russia (as their are fault lines in Rusu-China relationship but you have to exploit them), getting the Asian partners to cooperate to counter China (back in the day before Biden it seemed that US was retreating from Asia and was going towards an isolationist policy in the process making the countries vary of counting on US) but Biden rightfully understood
Asian control= Superpower

As long as he doesn't act like a bully, compromise, give carrots (if we have some carrots left... ), unite the nation behind a bogyman China

He still has a chance to curtail China in Asia

and he should realize except for UK and France no one in Europe would go towards an all out economic war with China so don't expect that from them or you'll lose all of the support you built with em over the years

Bigboii said:

I know Biden isn't what he used to be in his younger years, but damn it he seems to be hitting the right targets from the looks of it

Release pressure on Russia (as their are fault lines in Rusu-China relationship but you have to exploit them), getting the Asian partners to cooperate to counter China (back in the day before Biden it seemed that US was retreating from Asia and was going towards an isolationist policy in the process making the countries vary of counting on US) but Biden rightfully understood
Asian control= Superpower

As long as he doesn't act like a bully, compromise, give carrots (if we have some carrots left... ), unite the nation behind a bogyman China

He still has a chance to curtail China in Asia

and he should realize except for UK and France no one in Europe would go towards an all out economic war with China so don't expect that from them or you'll lose all of the support you built with em over the years

Click to expand...

Where are the Russo-China fault lines that the US can exploit? Everyone has been scratching the head. Seriously, enlighten us.

And which Asian countries are you counting in your bag? Ok, Japan for one, but that one has long been under occupation. Australia counts as half - they're too far and light weight. Who else? Name one.

All I see are words which means nothing to which the pundits not even speaking directly about China said was Biden's problem with this trip. Words are cheap which means he can sound tough all he wants. You think the G7 are going to actually spend $40 trillion on non-allied developing countries just so in the hopes they're not loyal to China? $40 trillion in the next 15 years(?) is money they can use for themselves. If they didn't need China why make such a fuss over China's so-called economic coercion when they can cut-off all relations right now? The West is bluffing hoping China thinks it's going to be left behind in order to make China surrender completely to the West. It's cheaper than $40 trillion going to war with China where they will get everything they want... if China loses. Better odds than believing they're going to buy loyalty of countries they chose to ignore all this time because they served no important strategic value to them until they got paranoid over what China was up to giving these countries they didn't see fit of their attention before China came along.

weig2000 said:

Where are the Russo-China fault lines that the US can exploit? Everyone has been scratching the head. Seriously, enlighten us.

And which Asian countries are you counting in your bag? Ok, Japan for one, but that one has long been under occupation. Australia counts as half - they're too far and light weight. Who else? Name one.

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India, Taiwan, Japan, SK, US, Australia if you manage to create a NATO (easier said than done especially in Asia) that's a mean group of allies to counter any big power

not to forget if you give carrots/stick to small countries of South east Asia (stick being sanctions, threatening the visas of workers in case Philippines, debt bullying (to smaller countries suffering from debt issues) through IMF,WB etc, etc (a superpower of decades has more sticks than one can envision), carrots of trade agreements (as US is still a lifechanging market for countries to have access to especially smaller countries), infrastructure building, easier terms through the existing global financials systems like IMF, WB etc, EU preferential trade agreements

A concentrated effort in SEA, EA can potentially hold the door

Despite whatever front Russians put they wont like any foreign power even looking at central Asia but they realize working with China is way more beneficial than working against it but if US can somehow lift sanctions, leave Russia to its fate, ask Europe to cooperate

Maybe just maybe they wont be to hot to work with China as they are right now knowing its the only way left to counter the existing power structure that is actively against Russian interests/Putin

but tbf I think its more of a gamble than sure fire strategy like in Asia

Bigboii said:

I know Biden isn't what he used to be in his younger years, but damn it he seems to be hitting the right targets from the looks of it

Release pressure on Russia (as their are fault lines in Rusu-China relationship but you have to exploit them), getting the Asian partners to cooperate to counter China (back in the day before Biden it seemed that US was retreating from Asia and was going towards an isolationist policy in the process making the countries vary of counting on US) but Biden rightfully understood
Asian control= Superpower

As long as he doesn't act like a bully, compromise, give carrots (if we have some carrots left... ), unite the nation behind a bogyman China

He still has a chance to curtail China in Asia

and he should realize except for UK and France no one in Europe would go towards an all out economic war with China so don't expect that from them or you'll lose all of the support you built with em over the years

Click to expand...

You are falling into the narrative trap. The US and its "friends" always talk a big game, but when the time comes for action you suddenly see them dispersing with these "niceties"

The US thinks that it can bluff China by making itself appear stronger than it actually is.

Dont worry though, China aint buying it. Tiger Yang himself accurately said directly to Blinken's face:

"US isn't qualified to speak from a position of strength"

Btw Russia-China relationship is fine and it is actually planned on improving it more on the immediate future. Just some weeks ago Russian officials themselves confirmed that.

Bigboii said:

India, Taiwan, Japan, SK, US, Australia if you manage to create a NATO (easier said than done especially in Asia) that's a mean group of allies to counter any big power

not to forget if you give carrots/stick to small countries of South east Asia (stick being sanctions, threatening the visas of workers in case Philippines, debt bullying (to smaller countries suffering from debt issues) through IMF,WB etc, etc (a superpower of decades has more sticks than one can envision), carrots of trade agreements (as US is still a lifechanging market for countries to have access to especially smaller countries), infrastructure building, easier terms through the existing global financials systems like IMF, WB etc, EU preferential trade agreements

A concentrated effort in SEA, EA can potentially hold the door

Despite whatever front Russians put they wont like any foreign power even looking at central Asia but they realize working with China is way more beneficial than working against it but if US can somehow lift sanctions, leave Russia to its fate, ask Europe to cooperate

Maybe just maybe they wont be to hot to work with China as they are right now knowing its the only way left to counter the existing power structure that is actively against Russian interests/Putin

but tbf I think its more of a gamble than sure fire strategy like in Asia

Click to expand...

Where do I even start....

India, last year's incident and this year's covid already proved that China don't need to worry about them.

Taiwan, not a country. Any country that want to recognize Taiwan and kiss the China market goodbye and eat nukes.

Japan, already in quad. And an American satrapy, but unfortunately biggest trade partner is China. So basically stuck between a hard place and a harder place.

SK, same as japan.

Australia, who cares, what power do they have? O ya and depends on China for its wealth again.

Most of SEA is basically completely dependent on China for economic survival. Biggest trading partner and all that, with US no where to be seen. Most of them on very friendly terms as well, or Thailand, Cambodia, Laos, Brunei.

If you ask a country to do something for you, you need to give it benefits, other than sticks, US got no carrots

No country want to go to IMF or world Bank anymore. It's the real debt trap!

voyager1 said:

You are falling into the narrative trap. The US and its "friends" always talk a big game, but when the time comes for action you suddenly see them dispersing with these "niceties"

The US thinks that it can bluff China by making itself appear stronger than it actually is.

Dont worry though, China aint buying it. Tiger Yang himself accurately said directly to Blinken's face:

"US isn't qualified to speak from a position of strength"

Btw Russia-China relationship is fine and it is actually planned on improving it more on the immediate future. Just some weeks ago Russian officials themselves confirmed that.

Click to expand...

China can easily screw Japan's economy. As for korea, China needs to contain korea's shipbuilding which is a national security risk for China.

Bigboii said:

India, Taiwan, Japan, SK, US, Australia if you manage to create a NATO (easier said than done especially in Asia) that's a mean group of allies to counter any big power

not to forget if you give carrots/stick to small countries of South east Asia (stick being sanctions, threatening the visas of workers in case Philippines, debt bullying (to smaller countries suffering from debt issues) through IMF,WB etc, etc (a superpower of decades has more sticks than one can envision), carrots of trade agreements (as US is still a lifechanging market for countries to have access to especially smaller countries), infrastructure building, easier terms through the existing global financials systems like IMF, WB etc, EU preferential trade agreements

A concentrated effort in SEA, EA can potentially hold the door

Despite whatever front Russians put they wont like any foreign power even looking at central Asia but they realize working with China is way more beneficial than working against it but if US can somehow lift sanctions, leave Russia to its fate, ask Europe to cooperate

Maybe just maybe they wont be to hot to work with China as they are right now knowing its the only way left to counter the existing power structure that is actively against Russian interests/Putin

but tbf I think its more of a gamble than sure fire strategy like in Asia

Click to expand...

Why not also throw in vietnam, thailand, singapore, cambodia, malaysia, etc into your NATO pact LOL. This sounds like a reddit post on r/worldnews or r/hongkong of how the ccp will be ruin soon. The reality is most countries have their own intrest and do not follow the orders of the US anymore as the US is not the sole economic/military/technology/culturial leader anymore in this modern world.

Bigboii said:

India, Taiwan, Japan, SK, US, Australia if you manage to create a NATO (easier said than done especially in Asia) that's a mean group of allies to counter any big power

not to forget if you give carrots/stick to small countries of South east Asia (stick being sanctions, threatening the visas of workers in case Philippines, debt bullying (to smaller countries suffering from debt issues) through IMF,WB etc, etc (a superpower of decades has more sticks than one can envision), carrots of trade agreements (as US is still a lifechanging market for countries to have access to especially smaller countries), infrastructure building, easier terms through the existing global financials systems like IMF, WB etc, EU preferential trade agreements

A concentrated effort in SEA, EA can potentially hold the door

Despite whatever front Russians put they wont like any foreign power even looking at central Asia but they realize working with China is way more beneficial than working against it but if US can somehow lift sanctions, leave Russia to its fate, ask Europe to cooperate

Maybe just maybe they wont be to hot to work with China as they are right now knowing its the only way left to counter the existing power structure that is actively against Russian interests/Putin

but tbf I think its more of a gamble than sure fire strategy like in Asia

Click to expand...

I can clearly tell you don't understand the regional dynamics in Asia, which I specifically mean East Asia and Southeast Asia.

I'll leave Taiwan out. Taiwan is legally part of China. Most countries in the region don't mess around with China on Taiwan. China will go any distance on Taiwan. Taiwan has like 42% of its exports to mainland China; without mainland China, it would have a very large trade deficit. There are real red lines on Taiwan, everyone knows it, even the US.

I wouldn't count South Korea in. Besides being by far SK's largest trading partner (larger than the US and Japan combined, the next two largest export markets), China holds real security cards on SK. It has refrained from supporting NK militarily against SK other than serving as NK's de-facto security guarantor. SK understands this very well and has been very careful in dealing with China on security matters.

All right, I forgot India. I'll give you credit to bring it up. But seriously, India really doesn't belong to the real Asia where the booming economies, trades, investments, tourism and supply chains are tightly integrated. Although India has long borders with China, but those areas are remote parts of China and are far from the Chinese population and industrial centers. They're far closer to Indian population centers. China holds significant advantages over India in these areas militarily, and border conflicts will affect India far more than China. Put simply, India has no real leverage over China, now that they have banned all Chinese apps. I trust Indian politicians are smart enough to not want to be someone else's paw and cannon folder, in a game that is hopelessly stacked against them. Oh, they'll be recuperating in the next few years from their screw-ups in dealing with COVID19 and other general incompetence.

Who else?

Ok, I'll give you credit for not counting Vietnam in your column. There were some time in the recent past, when many Americans loved to call Vietnam "ally" whenever competition with China was brought up in the conversation. I think most of them now understand the reality in the ground, after the US putting some feelers out to the Vietnamese and were duly turned down.