Discussing Biden's Potential China Policy


styx

Junior Member
Registered Member
they are so weak internally that they have to find imaginary external enemies to continue to have power. America finished its propulsive energy trust me. And its a big problem for the world, because china doesn't want america's role in international relations.
 

caudaceus

Junior Member
Registered Member
> "China’s debt has more than doubled, from 141 percent of GDP in 2008 to over 300 percent in 2019."

This must be the total debt described here

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China is big on non-financial corporates debt, yet is smaller in other sectors compared to the US. My theory is that this is caused by weak equity financing in China compared to the US. So corporates in China raised funding from debt while in the US they raised from selling equities. On the other hand, the Chinese saving rate is huge close to 40% while the US is generally below 10%, therefore a lot of saving money to be spread. So ultimately it's just a difference in the way the money allocated (saving vs equity).

P.S. Total debt almost always used to describe China, no other countries ever used it in the media. My conspirative mind believes that this is just another psyops.
 

BoraTas

Junior Member
Registered Member
P.S. Total debt almost always used to describe China, no other countries ever used it in the media. My conspirative mind believes that this is just another psyops.
It is. Total debt used to be something only people with interest in economics heard of. Now it is everywhere. Also, they don't mention that most of their favourite countries are even more indebted by the same metric.
 

steel21

Junior Member
Registered Member
> "China’s debt has more than doubled, from 141 percent of GDP in 2008 to over 300 percent in 2019."

This must be the total debt described here

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

China is big on non-financial corporates debt, yet is smaller in other sectors compared to the US. My theory is that this is caused by weak equity financing in China compared to the US. So corporates in China raised funding from debt while in the US they raised from selling equities. On the other hand, the Chinese saving rate is huge close to 40% while the US is generally below 10%, therefore a lot of saving money to be spread. So ultimately it's just a difference in the way the money allocated (saving vs equity).

P.S. Total debt almost always used to describe China, no other countries ever used it in the media. My conspirative mind believes that this is just another psyops.
Yup, and then when they list US debt, it usually does not list future defined benefits obligations like Social Security and Medicare.

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caudaceus

Junior Member
Registered Member
It is. Total debt used to be something only people with interest in economics heard of. Now it is everywhere. Also, they don't mention that most of their favourite countries are even more indebted by the same metric.

Actually, I am very interested to learn the meaning of those numbers. What does it mean to have 50%, 100% or 200% of debt?
What are the impacts?
Why do China Vietnam, Hong Kong, Korea and Singapore can have more than 100% debt on non-financial corporates yet their economy is relatively good? Argentina has much lower debts yet their economy isn't in good condition?
 

AssassinsMace

Brigadier
Alarmism Undermines American Strategy, true
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Was Vietnam ten feet tall? Is North Korea ten feet tall? The US lost or was too afraid even with their more advanced everything over them. If the US was a person, it would have deep serious psychological problems. It doesn't matter what excuse the US makes. They couldn't or were too afraid of the challenge imposed by smaller countries. Yeah if everything worked perfectly the US would win but reality differs showing how the smallest and most backward of countries can beat the US. When will the US realize their own racism is a national security threat. They hype themselves up as so superior and then when they lose to an inferior, it psychologically screws them for decades. Do Chinese claim they're ten feet tall? No. So who's the one not in touch with reality? Can a person with mental problems be fixed overnight? So it's the US just telling itself that China is not ten feet tall is like people with low self-esteem that have to look in the mirror talking to themselves like their image is another person giving them support and a pep talk.

 

horse

Junior Member
Registered Member
Actually, I am very interested to learn the meaning of those numbers. What does it mean to have 50%, 100% or 200% of debt?
What are the impacts?
Why do China Vietnam, Hong Kong, Korea and Singapore can have more than 100% debt on non-financial corporates yet their economy is relatively good? Argentina has much lower debts yet their economy isn't in good condition?
1. According to that rich guy Ray Dalio, if a country owes most of it debts in own currency to it own people, then a financial crisis regarding that debt is unlikely to impossible. This is not really his idea, it is just an observation, and logically if a Japanese corporation owes a lot to a Japanese bank, the Japanese government can step in and sort it all out. The level of debt by itself, tells us not too much about insolvency of the country.

Is the country's debt mostly in its own currency is a key question to know.


2. What is important is the ability to pay it back, as long as there is ability to service the debt and keep the economy growing, then the debt is good.

The idea of capitalism is the pooling of capital. Shares can be issued or they can get a loan.


3. The Marxist theories about debt are interesting. But that is really just a theoretical exercise, until a financial crisis hits. Knowing Marxist theories does not help one in their trading or investment decisions, so I do not do much of that. Just listen to the gold bugs once in a while, and always listen to the rich people. There is a reason why they are 1) rich, and 2) stay rich.
 

horse

Junior Member
Registered Member
Actually, I am very interested to learn the meaning of those numbers. What does it mean to have 50%, 100% or 200% of debt?
What are the impacts?
Why do China Vietnam, Hong Kong, Korea and Singapore can have more than 100% debt on non-financial corporates yet their economy is relatively good? Argentina has much lower debts yet their economy isn't in good condition?
4) China does not have a debt problem, they needed to invest (ie take on debt) to keep the economy growing. Also, Chinese debt creation apparently mostly from basis of the savings of the Chinese people. The Chinese people I find are cheap, therefore everyone has some savings. People in America and Canada, it is said the majority lives pay cheque to pay cheque, which is an alien concept to a Chinese, because Chinese people are cheap.


5) America problem best way to describe it is that they have a money problem. There is not enough money in the system to do what they want. At this point, they print the money to do what they want.

This is a different problem. This is not really a debt problem. The debts of America can be solved by money printing, but that is not what is going on here. The money printing is just to stay afloat until things turn around.

That is the bet. Traditionally the money printing debases the currency, which in turn lowers the standard of living for the country. America has to kick their economy into gear before the currency debases. This will be a multi-year struggle maybe a decade or more. Will they do it? Hard to say.

It is still about the people.
 

2handedswordsman

Junior Member
Registered Member
The Marxist theories about debt are interesting. But that is really just a theoretical exercise, until a financial crisis hits. Knowing Marxist theories does not help one in their trading or investment decisions, so I do not do much of that. Just listen to the gold bugs once in a while, and always listen to the rich people. There is a reason why they are 1) rich, and 2) stay rich.
Marxist critique theories are about the falses and theocracy of capitalist "economics". For example, printing 2,3 trillion out of thin air to buy real wealth steel, cement, working force etc (Biden's plan) seems logical and there's no problem with it, but Marxist critique of these phenomena is...theoretical excercise....Nice perception mate LOL
 

horse

Junior Member
Registered Member
Marxist critique theories are about the falses and theocracy of capitalist "economics". For example, printing 2,3 trillion out of thin air to buy real wealth steel, cement, working force etc (Biden's plan) seems logical and there's no problem with it, but Marxist critique of these phenomena is...theoretical excercise....Nice perception mate LOL
It is.

This is how it works with the Marxists.

They make their analysis. Then that is it.

No one listens. Nothing ever changes. And we still do not know what to do with our money exactly (many people in that boat), and we still do not know when the system will crack.

Compare the Marxists to the gold bugs, there will not be much difference, even though they coming from opposite ideological extremes.

The Marxist make their analysis, and it dies right there. That means that is a theoretical exercise.
 

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