Chinese semiconductor industry


Skywatcher

Captain
TSMC is building a 5nm fab in Arizona. By the time it's built they'll be fabbing at either 3nm or 2nm in Taiwan.
They aren't that dumb as to put a leading edge factory in a country with a known history for industrial espionage.
It's a giant scam (the US and Arizonian taxpayers will undoubtedly be on the hook for the vast majority of that $12 billion).

Remember TSMC Nanjing? When it was launched in 2014, 16nm was cutting edge, but upon operation in 2018, not so much.
 

quantumlight

Junior Member
Registered Member
Where will the US sell all those chips? Losing the Chinese market before other markets can be grown means less money for R&D for a debt burden companies and nations.. By then China should have some capabilities in sub 10nm and pretty good production capacity in 14nm. That should be good enough for low to medium end devices.

I don't see India becoming the place to sell hundreds of billions of semi conductor chips any time soon, especially if China and Pakistan can keep the pressure up so India has too over spends on military. The other markets are already saturated by US connected design, only thing that will happen is that their bottom line will shrink and so their R&D base.

Then the question is can the US produce a big enough next generation of Semi conductor designers domestically, given their 350 million population vs Chinas 1400 million. Because if the talent pool isn't replenished generational knowledge will erode away. Kind of like the US hasn't really made any big infrastructure project the last couple of decades that I know of. Can the US still do it?
They want to have own supply of rare earths stockpiled and fully non-China tech and chip supply chain before going kinetic action against China... this is the Small Yard, Tall Fence strategic decoupling that Biden admin was talking about

The Tiawan issue is US trying to provoke China to do reunification by force to justift a broader war againsy China, if China doesnt act in the meantime the US uses Tiawan to help it create independent tech supply chain whilsts depriving China from the processor chips/fabs...

Its a win win for US no matter if China does this or that
 

weig2000

Senior Member
Thanks.

Looks like one of those Nothing-Burgers.

They want a strategy. They do not mention who is going to invest the money.

Is the private company, are they all going to invest to build this American centric supply chain and maintain its commercial viability?

Or is the government going to do it? I think US government should do it. After all, they printing all the money to make it happen.

:)

It is just one of those many delusional ideas, such as D10, T12, Russia-join-China-containment, Vietnam-join-US-military-agiainst-China-on-Taiwan etc. that these people have been throwing around, in the vain hope that one of them will stick.
 

localizer

Colonel
Registered Member
They want to have own supply of rare earths stockpiled and fully non-China tech and chip supply chain before going kinetic action against China... this is the Small Yard, Tall Fence strategic decoupling that Biden admin was talking about

The Tiawan issue is US trying to provoke China to do reunification by force to justift a broader war againsy China, if China doesnt act in the meantime the US uses Tiawan to help it create independent tech supply chain whilsts depriving China from the processor chips/fabs...

Its a win win for US no matter if China does this or that
It is just one of those many delusional ideas, such as D10, T12, Russia-join-China-containment, Vietnam-join-US-military-agiainst-China-on-Taiwan etc. that these people have been throwing around, in the vain hope that one of them will stick.


US corporations want both subsidies and access to the Chinese market.

We shall see how things play out. Maybe US corporations are so worried that they're willing to send the US armed forces to take down Chinese competitors.
 

WTAN

Junior Member
Registered Member
TSMC is building a 5nm fab in Arizona. By the time it's built they'll be fabbing at either 3nm or 2nm in Taiwan.
They aren't that dumb as to put a leading edge factory in a country with a known history for industrial espionage.
You are right........the USA does the most Industrial Espionage in history.
Remember the Toshiba and Intel case. The Americans basically held Toshiba hostage and forced Toshiba to transfer all its Semiconductor IP to Intel for free.
Unfortunately even with this headstart Intel was so incompetent that they are now behind TSMC and Samsung.
Intel is now probably seeking some kind of illegal Tech bailout/transfer by the US Government from TSMC.
I would not be surprised if the US Govt used similar tactics against TSMC through sanctions and illegal coercion to transfer its Semicondcutor IP to Intel for peanuts.
 

KYli

Senior Member
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Top U.S. Senate Democrat directs lawmakers to craft bill to counter China​

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer said on Tuesday he has directed lawmakers to craft a package of measures to counter China’s rise, capitalizing on bipartisan hardline sentiment on Beijing in Congress to strengthen the U.S. tech sector and counter unfair practices.

Schumer said at a weekly press conference that he has directed committees to craft a bipartisan bill based on legislation he proposed last year seeking funding of $100 billion to spur research in key tech areas, from artificial intelligence to quantum computing and semiconductors.

This year’s package would target investment in U.S. manufacturing, science and technology, supply chains and semiconductors, Schumer said, adding he intends to have a bill on the Senate floor by “this spring”.

“Today on our caucus call I directed the chairs and members of our relevant committees to start drafting a legislative package to out-compete China and create new American jobs,” Schumer said at the press conference.

As part of the package, senators are also looking at providing emergency funding to implement bipartisan semiconductor programs included in last year’s National Defense Authorization Act, which sets overall U.S. military spending and the Pentagon policies backed up by that spending.


“I want this bill to address America’s short-term and long-term plan to protect our semiconductor supply chain and keep us No. 1 in AI (artificial intelligence), 5G (next generation communications network), quantum computing, biomedical research, storage, all of these things are part of the bill,” Schumer said.

The legislative drive comes as Republican China hawks have stepped up pressure on Democratic President Joe Biden to stick to his Republican predecessor Donald Trump’s hardline policies on Beijing.

The Biden administration has said it is conducting a review of China programs and promised a tough but more multilateral approach to Beijing.

The announcement also comes as some U.S. automakers have slowed production due to a shortage of semiconductor chips, scarce in part due to a pandemic-era boom in consumer appetite for more cell phones and computers.


The Semiconductor Industry Association welcomed Schumer’s announcement and urged Biden and Congress to invest “boldly” in domestic semiconductor manufacturing and research.

“Doing so will help keep the United States on top in this foundational technology, while also strengthening America’s economy, job creation, national security, and critical infrastructure,” SIA CEO John Neuffer said in a statement.

Under the prior legislation that the bill would be modeled on, the $100 billion in funding would be funneled over 5 years through a new technology directorate to be installed at the National Science Foundation. Under that proposal, an additional $10 billion would be set aside for technology hubs.

A bipartisan group of U.S. lawmakers plans to meet with Biden at the White House on Wednesday to discuss supply chain issues, including semiconductor chips, Reuters reported.
 

Oldschool

Junior Member
Registered Member
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Top U.S. Senate Democrat directs lawmakers to craft bill to counter China​

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer said on Tuesday he has directed lawmakers to craft a package of measures to counter China’s rise, capitalizing on bipartisan hardline sentiment on Beijing in Congress to strengthen the U.S. tech sector and counter unfair practices.

Schumer said at a weekly press conference that he has directed committees to craft a bipartisan bill based on legislation he proposed last year seeking funding of $100 billion to spur research in key tech areas, from artificial intelligence to quantum computing and semiconductors.

This year’s package would target investment in U.S. manufacturing, science and technology, supply chains and semiconductors, Schumer said, adding he intends to have a bill on the Senate floor by “this spring”.

“Today on our caucus call I directed the chairs and members of our relevant committees to start drafting a legislative package to out-compete China and create new American jobs,” Schumer said at the press conference.

As part of the package, senators are also looking at providing emergency funding to implement bipartisan semiconductor programs included in last year’s National Defense Authorization Act, which sets overall U.S. military spending and the Pentagon policies backed up by that spending.


“I want this bill to address America’s short-term and long-term plan to protect our semiconductor supply chain and keep us No. 1 in AI (artificial intelligence), 5G (next generation communications network), quantum computing, biomedical research, storage, all of these things are part of the bill,” Schumer said.

The legislative drive comes as Republican China hawks have stepped up pressure on Democratic President Joe Biden to stick to his Republican predecessor Donald Trump’s hardline policies on Beijing.

The Biden administration has said it is conducting a review of China programs and promised a tough but more multilateral approach to Beijing.

The announcement also comes as some U.S. automakers have slowed production due to a shortage of semiconductor chips, scarce in part due to a pandemic-era boom in consumer appetite for more cell phones and computers.


The Semiconductor Industry Association welcomed Schumer’s announcement and urged Biden and Congress to invest “boldly” in domestic semiconductor manufacturing and research.

“Doing so will help keep the United States on top in this foundational technology, while also strengthening America’s economy, job creation, national security, and critical infrastructure,” SIA CEO John Neuffer said in a statement.

Under the prior legislation that the bill would be modeled on, the $100 billion in funding would be funneled over 5 years through a new technology directorate to be installed at the National Science Foundation. Under that proposal, an additional $10 billion would be set aside for technology hubs.

A bipartisan group of U.S. lawmakers plans to meet with Biden at the White House on Wednesday to discuss supply chain issues, including semiconductor chips, Reuters reported.
What a bunch of bull.
The ones that's threatening US dominance is Taiwan and Korea. China is not even on the radar
 

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