US Military News, Reports, Data, etc.


nobody appears to care here (LOL) so I'll be brief

Today at 7:59 AM

an interesting week starts in DC:

"With a Dec. 8 deadline rapidly approaching for either extending federal funding in some way or triggering a partial government shutdown, the House next week will advance a temporary patch, according to a senior aide, and try to provide money through Dec. 22.

That will give Congress more time to craft a second patch, the aide said, to operate the government through January.

While the moves, if successful, would keep the Pentagon running at last year’s levels, they are far from Republican hopes of handing Trump about $634 billion in fiscal 2018 funding for the military’s regular operations, $85 billion above last year.

..." etc.:
Trump's call for military buildup hits bump in Congress
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"For now, it appears congressional leaders are looking to punt the issue for two more weeks, passing a 14-day continuing resolution to give them time to try and find a longer compromise deal."
This week in Congress: December’s first shutdown deadline
6 hours ago
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Hendrik_2000

Brigadier
Well so many of our friend here considered US is the gold standard when it come to Weapon development . Nobody question their reliability or effectiveness. With well oiled media to back it up It is no wonder. Well the truth is something else

Did American Missile
Defense Fail in Saudi Arabia?



By
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DEC. 4, 2017

The official story was clear: Saudi forces
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a ballistic missile fired by Yemen’s Houthi rebel group last month at Saudi Arabia’s capital, Riyadh. It was a victory for the Saudis and for the United States, which supplied the Patriot missile defense system.

“Our system knocked the missile out of the air,” President Trump said the next day from Air Force One en route to Japan, one of the 14 countries that use the system. “That’s how good we are. Nobody makes what we make, and now we’re selling it all over the world.”

But an analysis of photos and videos of the strike posted to social media suggests that story may be wrong.

Instead, evidence analyzed by a research team of missile experts appears to show the missile’s warhead flew unimpeded over Saudi defenses and nearly hit its target, Riyadh’s airport. The warhead detonated so close to the domestic terminal that customers jumped out of their seats.

trajectory3-Artboard_3.jpg

Estimated trajectory of warhead

Trajectory of missile body

The warhead appeared to explode near an airport terminal.

RIYADH NORTH

This side is 38 miles. Airport

Missile

defense

The missile body

landed downtown.

Satellite image from DigitalGlobe via Google Earth
Saudi officials did not respond to a request for comment. Some U.S. officials cast doubt on whether the Saudis hit any part of the incoming missile, saying there was no evidence that it had. Instead, they said, the incoming missile body and warhead may have come apart because of its sheer speed and force.

The findings show that the Iranian-backed Houthis, once a ragtag group of rebels, have grown powerful enough to strike major targets in Saudi Arabia, possibly shifting the balance of their years-long war. And they underscore longstanding doubts about missile defense technology, a centerpiece of American and allied national defense strategies, particularly against Iran and North Korea.

“Governments lie about the effectiveness of these systems. Or they’re misinformed,” said Jeffrey Lewis, an analyst who led the research team, which shared its findings with The New York Times. “And that should worry the hell out of us.”

The Missile
Shooting down Scud missiles is difficult, and governments have wrongly claimed success against them in the past.


country-map-Artboard_1.png


Est. launch

location

Arabian Sea

The missile, seen in this video released by the Houthis, is believed to be a Burqan-2, a variant of the Scud missile used throughout the Middle East. It traveled about 600 miles.

Saudi and American officials have accused Iran of supplying the Houthis with the missile, a charge that Tehran denies. A recent United Nations report found evidence that the missile had been designed and manufactured by Iran, according to a Security Council diplomat. Reuters first
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the U.N. findings.

mute

Mr. Lewis and the other analysts, based mostly at the Middlebury Institute of International Studies in Monterey, Calif., were skeptical when they heard Saudi Arabia’s claim to have shot it down.

Governments have overstated the effectiveness of missile defenses in the past, including against Scuds. During the first Gulf War, the United States claimed a near-perfect record in shooting down Iraqi variants of the Scud.
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found that nearly all the interceptions had failed.

Had it failed in Riyadh as well? The researchers scraped social media for anything posted in that area and time frame, looking for clues.

The Debris
The pattern of missile debris littering Riyadh suggests missile defenses either hit the harmless rear section of the missile or missed it entirely.


Just as the Saudis fired off missile defenses, debris began to fall in downtown Riyadh. Video posted on social media captured one particularly large section, which landed in a parking lot next to the Ibn Khaldun School.


Other videos show scraps that fell at a handful of other locations clustered in a roughly 500-yard area along a highway.

Saudi officials said the debris, which appears to belong to a downed Burqan-2, showed a successful shootdown. But an analysis of the debris shows that the warhead components – the part of the missile that carries the explosives – were missing.

composite-Artboard_1.jpg
 
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Hendrik_2000

Brigadier
(cont)
The missing warhead signaled something important to the analysts: that the missile may have evaded Saudi defenses.

The missile, in order to survive the stresses of a roughly 600 mile flight, was almost certainly designed to separate into two pieces once near its target. The tube, which propels the missile for most of its trajectory, falls away. The warhead, smaller and harder to hit, continues toward the target.

burqan2-Artboard_1.jpg

Burqan 2-H

Engine

Missile body

Warhead was missing

from debris

This would explain why the debris in Riyadh only appears to consist of the rear tube. And it suggests that the Saudis may have missed the missile, or only hit the tube after it had separated and begun to fall uselessly toward earth.

Some U.S. officials said there was no evidence the Saudis had hit the missile. Instead, the debris may have broken up under the pressures of flight. What the Saudis presented as evidence of their successful interception may have simply been the missile ejecting its tube as intended.

The Location of the Explosion
A blast 12 miles away at Riyadh’s airport suggests the warhead continued unimpeded toward its target.


At around 9 p.m., about the same time debris crashed in Riyadh, a loud bang shook the domestic terminal at Riyadh’s King Khalid International Airport.

“There was an explosion at the airport,”a man said in a video taken moments after the bang. He and others rushed to the windows as emergency vehicles streamed onto the runway.

Another video, taken from the tarmac, shows the emergency vehicles at the end of the runway. Just beyond them is a plume of smoke, confirming the blast and indicating a likely point of impact.

A Houthi spokesman said the missile had
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.

There’s another reason the analysts think the warhead flew past the missile defenses. They located the Patriot batteries that fired on the missile, shown in this video, and found that the warhead traveled well over the top of them.

Saudi officials have said that some debris from the intercepted missile landed at the airport. But it is difficult to imagine how one errant piece could fly 12 miles beyond the rest of the debris, or why it would detonate on impact.

crosscut-Artboard_1.png

The warhead passed over the Saudi missile defense unit.

Estimated trajectory of warhead

Estimated trajectory

of missile body

Missile defense

Trajectories estimated by David Wright, Union of Concerned Scientists
The Impact
Smoke and ground damage suggest the warhead struck near the airport’s domestic terminal.


Imagery of the emergency response and a plume of smoke also reveal information about the nature of the impact.

A photo of the plume taken from a different location on the tarmac appears consistent with plumes produced by similar missiles, suggesting the explosion was not an errant piece of debris or an unrelated incident.

transparent.png

Riyadh airport


transparent.png

Daraya, Syria

By identifying buildings in the photo and video, Mr. Lewis’s team was able to locate the spots from which the images were taken, revealing the precise location of the plume: a few hundred yards off of runway 33R, and about a kilometer from the crowded domestic terminal.

satellite-image-720.jpg

King Khalid

International Airport

Emergency vehicles seen on runway

Dark areas indicate

ground damage

from vehicles

Domestic

terminal

Direction of

missile

NORTH

Image courtesy of
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The blast was small, and satellite imagery of the airport taken immediately before and after the blast is not detailed enough to capture the crater from the impact, the analysts said.

But it does show ground damage from the emergency vehicles, supporting the finding that the warhead hit just off the runway.

While the Houthis missed their target, Mr. Lewis said, they got close enough to show that their missiles can reach it and can evade Saudi defenses. “A kilometer is a pretty normal miss rate for a Scud,” he said.

Even the Houthis may not have realized their success, Mr. Lewis said. Unless they had intelligence sources at the airport, they would have little reason to doubt official reports.

“The Houthis got very close to creaming that airport,” he said.

Laura Grego, a missile expert at the Union of Concerned Scientists, expressed alarm that Saudi defense batteries had fired five times at the incoming missile.

"You shoot five times at this missile and they all miss? That's shocking,” she said. “That's shocking because this system is supposed to work.”

Analysis by Melissa Hanham, Jeffrey Lewis, David Schmerler and Nate Taylor of the Middlebury Institute of International Studies, and David Wright, Union of Concerned Scientists. James Acton of the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace and Laura Grego of the Union of Concerned Scientists reviewed the analysis.

Rick Gladstone contributed reporting. Additional work by Neil Collier, Derek Watkins, Barbara Marcolini and Rob McDonagh.
 
Yesterday at 9:55 PM
nobody appears to care here (LOL) so I'll be brief

Today at 7:59 AM


"For now, it appears congressional leaders are looking to punt the issue for two more weeks, passing a 14-day continuing resolution to give them time to try and find a longer compromise deal."
This week in Congress: December’s first shutdown deadline
6 hours ago
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"As of Monday, President Trump and congressional leaders were at an impasse on the 2018 federal budget and teetering on the brink of a government shutdown. The deadlock, in part, centers on how much to raise budget caps for the defense and non-defense sides of the budget."
CBO: Trump military buildup would cost taxpayers an extra $683 billion
8 hours ago
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TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
TerraN_EmpirE possible recognize AH-64D or a E some differences visibles o_O

AH-64 with Skis for Alaska
The Easiest way t Tell is if it's in an army that has not gotten the E model yet.... :p

I don't know of a easy tell, most of the changes are internal between the two. more powerful engines, upgraded transmission, Avionics.
I mean they were even going to call it the Block III AH64D until the last minute. Many E Models are built from D models
The only changes I have seen visible in the outer hull are small bumps at the front of the gunners position. but those might also be on late D models to, There is also an added annena blade on spine of the tail behind the Rotor mast. And there is a structure on the tail I have never seen this on AH64A or AH64D models but there is a fairing in the same spot on the WAH64D
AH-64E_3-e1493907353327.jpg AH-64E_Apache-Guardian-0006.jpg
Guardian
Westland_apache_wah-64d_longbow_zj206_arp.jpg
Westland Apache Longbow ( note the triangular fairing on the tail found on WAH64D) JGSDF_AH-64D_20120108-02.JPG
AH64DJP
Boeing_(Hughes)_AH-64D_Apache.jpg
AH64D (minus the Longbow radar) in Netherlands flight Demonstration livery
 

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
The Easiest way t Tell is if it's in an army that has not gotten the E model yet.... :p

I don't know of a easy tell, most of the changes are internal between the two. more powerful engines, upgraded transmission, Avionics.
I mean they were even going to call it the Block III AH64D until the last minute. Many E Models are built from D models
The only changes I have seen visible in the outer hull are small bumps at the front of the gunners position. but those might also be on late D models to, There is also an added annena blade on spine of the tail behind the Rotor mast. And there is a structure on the tail I have never seen this on AH64A or AH64D models but there is a fairing in the same spot on the WAH64D
View attachment 43812 View attachment 43816
Guardian
View attachment 43814
Westland Apache Longbow ( note the triangular fairing on the tail found on WAH64D) View attachment 43815
AH64DJP
View attachment 43817
AH64D (minus the Longbow radar) in Netherlands flight Demonstration livery
Thank you and face palm for the troll before :rolleyes: :D

The 2nd normaly commissioned end 2018 with 3 Burke !
 
Thank goodness... It may sound like a cool Idea but practically moving the Space assets from the USAF and USN to a new body was just going to be a mess of Bureaucracy without need.
well Rogers: Space Corps Inevitable, Will be Approved in Next Few Years
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The creation of a new service focused on space is “inevitable” and will happen within the next few years, the lawmaker leading the movement said. Rep. Mike Rogers (R-Ala.) said the evolution of the space mission out of the Air Force and into its own service will happen and needs to be faster than the time it took for the Air Force to evolve from the Army Air Corps. “We don’t have 26 years for this. But it’s going to happen. It’s inevitable,” Rogers said Saturday at the Reagan National Defense Forum, according to
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. Rogers led the effort to create the “Space Corps,” getting it into the House-passed version of the Fiscal 2018 National Defense Authorization Act. However, the language died in the Senate. Rep. Adam Smith (D-Wash.), ranking member of the House Armed Services Committee, told reporters on Nov. 30 the idea was well thought out, and it will be revisited. The measure died because the Senate was “not included in the discussions” and did not play a part in the initial formulation. The Defense Department and Air Force
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the move.
 

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Well so many of our friend here considered US is the gold standard when it come to Weapon development . Nobody question their reliability or effectiveness. With well oiled media to back it up It is no wonder. Well the truth is something else

Did American Missile
Defense Fail in Saudi Arabia?
Interesting read.o_O


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"BS "or try do propaganda Cheerleaders you need to know this country use Patriot PAC-2 which is not a true ABM despite it the ratio is decent in more in article don't mentioned the missile/SAM !
 
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TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
well Rogers: Space Corps Inevitable, Will be Approved in Next Few Years
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Right now it just makes far more sense to leave things as they are. There are a number of Military Space policy elements That need to be organic to the USAF, USN and the more holistic MDA. adding a Star corps without a mission other than maintaining the existing mission is just a whole new layer of Bureaucracy and infighting.
 
Right now it just makes far more sense to leave things as they are. There are a number of Military Space policy elements That need to be organic to the USAF, USN and the more holistic MDA. adding a Star corps without a mission other than maintaining the existing mission is just a whole new layer of Bureaucracy and infighting.
what's that new avatar?
LEL
 

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