The Q-5, J-7, J-8 and older PLAAF aircraft
- Thread starter adeptitus
- Start date
In fact I have no concrete numbers, at best rough estimates based on older data, in fact I need to check and re-count them but overall as it seems, the PLAAF is indeed retiring J-7/8s quite soon and expanding the J-10C/J-16 units.
Need to check.
Now I'm confused ... this image clearly shows some very old Q-5 but I never saw a 70x0x serial number?
Scramble Magazine does not not list it in their "CHINESE SERIAL SYSTEM" and after some search I did not find anything too.
Can anyone help me out what unit this is?
(Image via @航空新视野-赤卫 from Weibo)
Scramble Magazine does not not list it in their "CHINESE SERIAL SYSTEM" and after some search I did not find anything too.
Can anyone help me out what unit this is?
(Image via @航空新视野-赤卫 from Weibo)
Excelent photo! The 50th Air Division - 7xx0x.
About the photo: The 28th Division (in the distance: 2xx9x) and the 50th Division's (in the foreground: 7xx0x) Q-5 aircrafts prepare for the parade in 1984. The honor of the 35th anniversary of the founding of the People's Republic of China.
Another time - the same point of view:
About the photo: The 28th Division (in the distance: 2xx9x) and the 50th Division's (in the foreground: 7xx0x) Q-5 aircrafts prepare for the parade in 1984. The honor of the 35th anniversary of the founding of the People's Republic of China.
Another time - the same point of view:
Indeed, we've got it ... 50th Air Division; and I made a stupid typo!
I guess it's up to debate just how much benefit there is from doing recon by high speed/high altitude plane.
The US had the SR-71 yet they chose the subsonic U-2 over it and retired the Blackbird.
The US also has F-15, comfortably faster than F-16, yet it's the latter that's the carrier of recon pods, not the former.
Israeli AF uses recon pods both on their F-15 and F-16.
Today, when a recon pod like DB110 is credited with 80 nautical mile range at useful resolution, there might be fairly few situations when overflying at well over mach 2 is needed. Indeed, who knows if flying at mach 2 causes enough vibrations that a recon pod can't stabilize the camera as well as it could at subsonic speed. So maybe effective range for decent image quality then drops to just a few dozen nautical miles.
Speed is probably always a plus up to a certain point. When it comes at a cost of range, loiter time, maintenance, availability or image quality - then who knows just how worthwhile it all is.
Now, a completely unrelated question to the recon issue that you made me think of.
I am aware that lots of people think J-8 is the fastest fighter plane China has. I've tried actually finding a source for that that's either a website of some government entity (CATIC, CASIC etc?). Or a photo of a manufacturer's brochure from an airshow. Can anyone help?
Actually, I did find this one brochure photo of F-8T but the photographer didn't manage to capture the important parts... is there ANY other, complete image of that brochure, anywhere on the internet?
Please note that I am not discussing whether J-8 is indeed the fastest or not, or how fast it might/should be. I am merely looking for sources.
Notice that I didn't say that J-8 is the fastest bird in PLAAF. I said that it is the fastest in clean configuration and is optimized for high speed performance in a way that neither the flanker nor the J-10 is.
SR-71 is not retired because the USAF doesn't want high speed reconnaissance plane but rather because it is very expensive and difficult to maintain compared to other aircraft. If high speed recon is useless then they wouldn't have bothered with SR-72. That said, J-8 is easy and cheap to maintain.
That is a good question. Should China develop its own high-speed interceptor aircraft or not?
The J-8II was basically that. A dedicated interceptor. And the J-11, while it replaces it for most roles, it not an interceptor but a fighter.
It makes less sense for China to have interceptors than Russia I guess. Since the geography and disposition of threats is totally different.
But still something to consider if the threat situation changes and Chinese engine technology provides the necessary advancements.
The SR-71 was basically replaced in the reconnaissance role with satellites. That is why you do not see any modern high altitude reconnaissance platforms anymore. While cost of upkeep was an issue it was not the only one. And now that SpaceX has reduced the cost of launch a huge amount I think satellites will improve in capabilities faster than something like the SR-72 would provide. The U-2 has an advantage over the SR-71 in that it is basically a glider. Satellites typically are in low orbits and make high velocity passes over targets. The time between passes can be large, and the opposition might use these gaps to move without you being able to spot them. A high endurance glider like the U-2 can handle this task better i.e. provide a moving picture of the target. The SR-71 or mythical SR-72 would not.
The U-2 is finding itself replaced with robotic platforms like Global Hawk. China has Soar Dragon. Plus advanced reconnaissance satellites. So I do not see much chance of this niche being available to a platform like that of a successor to the J-8II.
I think the interceptor role is the only one which might still make sense.
The J-8II was basically that. A dedicated interceptor. And the J-11, while it replaces it for most roles, it not an interceptor but a fighter.
It makes less sense for China to have interceptors than Russia I guess. Since the geography and disposition of threats is totally different.
But still something to consider if the threat situation changes and Chinese engine technology provides the necessary advancements.
The SR-71 was basically replaced in the reconnaissance role with satellites. That is why you do not see any modern high altitude reconnaissance platforms anymore. While cost of upkeep was an issue it was not the only one. And now that SpaceX has reduced the cost of launch a huge amount I think satellites will improve in capabilities faster than something like the SR-72 would provide. The U-2 has an advantage over the SR-71 in that it is basically a glider. Satellites typically are in low orbits and make high velocity passes over targets. The time between passes can be large, and the opposition might use these gaps to move without you being able to spot them. A high endurance glider like the U-2 can handle this task better i.e. provide a moving picture of the target. The SR-71 or mythical SR-72 would not.
The U-2 is finding itself replaced with robotic platforms like Global Hawk. China has Soar Dragon. Plus advanced reconnaissance satellites. So I do not see much chance of this niche being available to a platform like that of a successor to the J-8II.
I think the interceptor role is the only one which might still make sense.
Last edited:
