PLA Anti-Air Missile (SAM) systems


Japhethsdecendent

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If stingers were effective against mass attacks SA would have just used them instead
Its not that simple. Firstly you are not going to have troops on alert all the time in your borders unless you are prepared for something. Iran and their proxies caught the saudis off guard and attacked from an unexpected direction. Your logic is because saudi arabia didn't use stinger that stinger can't down drones and cruise missiles? Someone better inform the US about this lol. Stinger is used on the avenger system and the forthcoming stryker shorad variant that may also use aim-9x.
 

Sleepyjam

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Its not that simple. Firstly you are not going to have troops on alert all the time in your borders unless you are prepared for something. Iran and their proxies caught the saudis off guard and attacked from an unexpected direction. Your logic is because saudi arabia didn't use stinger that stinger can't down drones and cruise missiles? Someone better inform the US about this lol. Stinger is used on the avenger system and the forthcoming stryker shorad variant that may also use aim-9x.
I didn’t say they can’t shoot down drones and missiles don’t put words in my mouth. Drone or missile attacks can come from any direction there shouldn't be any unexpected directions. Facts speak for themselves if they are not used then they are not used for a good reason.
 

Japhethsdecendent

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I didn’t say they can’t shoot down drones and missiles don’t put words in my mouth. Drone or missile attacks can come from any direction there shouldn't be any unexpected directions. Facts speak for themselves if they are not used then they are not used for a good reason.
Then I guess china wasted it's time with FN-6/ FN-16. What were they thinking? S-200-400 haven't been able to sanitize the syrian skies from drones many times and chinese systems seem based on those designs so I guess they can't deal with it either? You have to look at the system for what it is and not make silly statements like "there shouldn't be unexpected directions". There shouldn't be drone swarms but that's life isn't it? There is no indication stinger was present at the time if this attack and failed to do it's job. The times patriot is oriented in the right direction it has intercepted many targets in combat. Those are the main facts here. It sounds like you are saying that stinger can shoot down drones, but that it's not used by the saudis so its not good? Using such simplistic logic yj-27 radar is in syria but f-22/35s have been flying and bombing in syria so the chinese radar must be garbage? See how silly these statements are without context?
 

Sleepyjam

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Then I guess china wasted it's time with FN-6/ FN-16. What were they thinking? S-200-400 haven't been able to sanitize the syrian skies from drones many times and chinese systems seem based on those designs so I guess they can't deal with it either? You have to look at the system for what it is and not make silly statements like "there shouldn't be unexpected directions". There shouldn't be drone swarms but that's life isn't it? There is no indication stinger was present at the time if this attack and failed to do it's job. The times patriot is oriented in the right direction it has intercepted many targets in combat. Those are the main facts here. It sounds like you are saying that stinger can shoot down drones, but that it's not used by the saudis so its not good? Using such simplistic logic yj-27 radar is in syria but f-22/35s have been flying and bombing in syria so the chinese radar must be garbage? See how silly these statements are without context?
SA don’t use FN-6/FN-16 and it’s not the stinger so it’s a irrelevant point of distraction. You are saying Chinese missiles are based on s200 - s400? Where is your proof? There are definitely debates about patriot’s actual capability and if you don’t expect drones to change directions inflight you get screwed lol. Who knows if yj27 detected those jets or not, being able to detect and shooting them down are two different things.
 

Japhethsdecendent

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SA don’t use FN-6/FN-16 and it’s not the stinger so it’s a irrelevant point of distraction. You are saying Chinese missiles are based on s200 - s400? Where is your proof? There are definitely debates about patriot’s actual capability and if you don’t expect drones to change directions inflight you get screwed lol. Who knows if yj27 detected those jets or not, being able to detect and shooting them down are two different things.
The point is china decided stinger was a good capability and developed something similar, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Patriot has seen the most combat of all these systems and has been successful much of the time, the other still haven't proven themselves. Look what happened to pantsir, it looked fine on paper. Chinas sams are like china's flankers, they clearly had an inspiration from other systems. You can claim they are better, but so far its just a claim. S-400 has given out some stats as to it's radar performance but I don't know about hq9.
 

Sleepyjam

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The point is china decided stinger was a good capability and developed something similar, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Patriot has seen the most combat of all these systems and has been successful much of the time, the other still haven't proven themselves. Look what happened to pantsir, it looked fine on paper. Chinas sams are like china's flankers, they clearly had an inspiration from other systems. You can claim they are better, but so far its just a claim. S-400 has given out some stats as to it's radar performance but I don't know about hq9.
How is FN6 an imitation of stinger besides both being MANPADs any proof to back it up? As for the Patriot missile
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What does it have to with pantsir? First you claim Chinese missiles are based on s200-400 With no proof now you say you don’t know about hq9. What do SAMs have to do with Chinese flankers?
 

Japhethsdecendent

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How is FN6 an imitation of stinger besides both being MANPADs any proof to back it up? As for the Patriot missile
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What does it have to with pantsir? First you claim Chinese missiles are based on s200-400 With no proof now you say you don’t know about hq9. What do SAMs have to do with Chinese flankers?
Fine you listen to journalists that tell you what you want to hear, whatever the patriot has done it has done it and the army have had plenty of tests and insights into it's performance in combat. You think when chinese wonder missiles do whatever they do there won't be some that squeak through or debris after? If patriot is such garbage why were the chinese stealing details about it's radar? Why can't you just admit china copies things? You think j-11 looks like su-27 by coincidence, or hq9 just so happens to look like s-300? If another country had a weapon and china comes out with one after that looks similar or basically the same it probably drew inspiration from it it's common sense. The wiki for fn-6 compares it to stinger but doens't say its directly designed from it but I don't feel like looking further. Back to anything relevant what is the stated radar performance? We can't even begin to infer how it would do against an f-35 if we don't have general radar characteristics.
 

ougoah

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How do you know sm-3/6 can't intercept ballistic missile targets? The test targets are said to replicate a similar threat. Even if the pk is only like 50% it's better than nothing.
I said they are effective against most ballistic missiles but not the latest Russian and Chinese ones that either use HGVs, MIRVs, and decoys. They may be able to intercept something but they're definitely less effective than against lower altitude and shorter ranged ballistic missiles. The point was BMD depends on who you're defending against. China's got effective BMD against India for example but Chinese BMD may as well not exist if it were up defending against Russian and US first strikes.
 

ougoah

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FN-6 and Stingers are not designed to do much more than harass slow and terrain hugging fighters/attackers and helicopters. Now smaller cheaper UAVs that just somehow happen to be within range like quadcopter recon types. Why are you guys talking like they're used to intercept missiles/bombs?

Manpads are useful missiles but they're not for intercepting fast moving targets.
 

Sleepyjam

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Fine you listen to journalists that tell you what you want to hear, whatever the patriot has done it has done it and the army have had plenty of tests and insights into it's performance in combat. You think when chinese wonder missiles do whatever they do there won't be some that squeak through or debris after? If patriot is such garbage why were the chinese stealing details about it's radar? Why can't you just admit china copies things? You think j-11 looks like su-27 by coincidence, or hq9 just so happens to look like s-300? If another country had a weapon and china comes out with one after that looks similar or basically the same it probably drew inspiration from it it's common sense. The wiki for fn-6 compares it to stinger but doens't say its directly designed from it but I don't feel like looking further. Back to anything relevant what is the stated radar performance? We can't even begin to infer how it would do against an f-35 if we don't have general radar characteristics.
The author was not a mere journalist, he is director of the East Asia Nonproliferation Program. I never made claims about the performance of Chinese missiles unlike you did with the patriot. I never claimed anything about j11 and su27 so dont lie. How is hq9 based s-300 care to provide proof or evidence? How are they similar or basically the same? Lol so you said fn6 imitated stinger but provides no proof and can’t find evidence even on wiki.
 

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