Ladakh Flash Point

Mohsin77 · Oct 29, 2021

Xsizor said:
Your attempts to discredit are getting amusing. I'm the one who bought in references to this exchange.

You brought a reference from 2016, when we're discussing the events of 2019. And the source you brought is citing my source.

Xsizor said:
That reference statement is a blanket one. Pravin Sawnhey is only among the multiple sources cited within that Reference (numbered 2).

Yes, and all the people cited in that quote are saying the same thing as the author, that's the point of a citation.

Xsizor said:
Again, READ the Article.

I did read the paper, and I told you that you are cherry picking parts of it and haven't actually understood it.

Xsizor said:
I did cherry pick - from very reputable sources. You may cherry pick opinions that goes against it from even more weighted sources and I'll gladly welcome it.And no, Pravin Sawnhey is not at all significant against the sources I have "cherry picked".

Why is he not significant? Your own author is using him to support his case lolz. And unlike your source (which is outdated) my source is actually in scope. It is from 2019 and discussing what happened in that event.

Xsizor said:
For somebody who is passionate about Pakistan and Muslims, your blind devotion to him is remarkable.

You're assuming I agree with everything Sawhney says. That's a silly assumption.

Xsizor said:
If you can't attack the content, attack the author.

That's exactly what you're doing. I'm not even attacking your author. I'm attacking the fact that you're using an out-dated source. I bet if the author of your paper was here right now, he would be agreeing with me, not you.

Xsizor said:
You are grasping at straws when you say that the article I cited is from 2016 while the topic is about 2019 conflict.

That's not "grasping at straws" that's just basic academic rigor.

Xsizor said:
Don't forget my assertion - Indian military didn't escalate because of Pakistani TNW and the deterrence it brings against conventional war.

Exactly, and if you want to support that assertion you need to provide a source from 2019 (like I have.)

Xsizor said:
What's concerning is you placing Pravin Sawnhey, a defence analyst over Pakistani Defence leaders.

He's repeating what Pakistan's defense leaders have said in the current environment (not from 2016)

Mohsin77 · Oct 29, 2021

ougoah said:
Who knows why India did not retaliate after Pakistan response in 2019. Maybe it just wasn't worth escalating or maybe they couldn't. Pakistan purposefully did not damage India except to make a point (and ignoring air combat aspect) since Pakistan gave India an out option as well. Smart. India supposedly did not damage Pakistan or Pakistani interests (claimed by one or many as such) and Pakistan had no real reason to disproportionately escalate here without wanting escalation pattern forming. It could have nothing to do with theatre nukes.

Fair enough, which is why I'm questioning the emphasis Xsisor is placing on theater nukes to underpin his entire argument. He has provided no actual source which claims that India didn't escalate in 2019 due to this one capability.

Xizor · Oct 29, 2021

Mohsin77 said:
You brought a reference from 2016, when we're discussing the events of 2019. And the source you brought is citing my source lolz.

Yes, and all the people cited in that quote are saying the same thing as the author, that's the point of a citation.

I did read the paper, and I told you that you are cherry picking parts of it and you haven't actually understood it.

Why is he not significant? Your own author is using him to support his case lolz. And unlike your source (which is outdated) my source is actually in scope. It is from 2019 and discussing what happened in that event.

You're assuming I agree with everything Sawhney says. That's a silly assumption.

That's exactly what you're doing. I'm not even attacking your author. I'm attacking the fact that you're using an out-dated source. I bet if the author of your paper was here right now, he would be agreeing me me, not you.

That's not "grasping at straws" that's just basic academic rigor.

Exactly, and if you want to support that assertion you need to provide a source from 2019 (like I have.)

I did read your paper, and I told you that you haven't understood it. You cherry picked parts of the article and misrepresented it.

He's repeating what Pakistan's defense leaders have said in the current environment (not from 2016)

Absolute bonkers. You are a piece of work indeed.

No, you don't understand the article. No, you don't understand how citations work. No, you didn't carefully read the article. No, your source isn't infallible or reliable or even reputable against the sources I've mentioned.

You may be sending anonymous love letters to Pravin Sawnhey but don't insist others do too. The sources I've mentioned stand heads and shoulders above PS. You may cite sources that are peers or above them - even from Indian Army.

What I understood in the exchange is that you still didn't grasp the subject of discussion. Your efforts are merely reduced to Pravin Sawnhey and defending his opinions.

Mohsin77 · Oct 29, 2021

Xsizor said:
Absolute bonkers. You are a piece of work indeed.

Great, more ad-hominem attacks.

99% of your posts are about trivial map related details etc.

Stick to that and leave technical matters aside. This is not your game.

Xsizor said:
No, you don't understand the article. No, you don't understand how citations work. No, you didn't carefully read the article. No, your source isn't infallible or reliable or even reputable against the sources I've mentioned.

You may be sending anonymous love letters to Pravin Sawnhey but don't insist others do too. The sources I've mentioned stand heads and shoulders above PS. You may cite sources that are peers or above them - even from Indian Army.

What I understood in the exchange is that you still didn't grasp the subject of discussion. Your efforts are merely reduced to Pravin Sawnhey and defending his opinions.

Stop crying, it's not going to salvage your argument.

Xizor · Oct 29, 2021

Mohsin77 said:
Great, more ad-hominem attacks.

99% of your posts are going back and forth on random trivial map related details etc.

Stick to that and leave technical matters aside. This is not your game.

Stop crying, it's not going to salvage your argument.

The guy who engages in passive aggressive ad-hominems feels hurt when given a dose of his medicine.

Still better than getting panties in a twist when hearing about something bad happening to Muslims in SA and ME. Your game is just religion and Pakistan. That defines you. I've yet to see some post that'd impress from you.

Mohsin77 · Oct 29, 2021

Xsizor said:
The guy who engages in passive aggressive ad-hominems feels hurt when given a dose of his medicine.

How am I "hurt" ?

You're the one constantly emoting.

And there's nothing "passive" about by aggression, lolz.

Xsizor said:
Still better than getting panties in a twist when hearing about something bad happening to Muslims in SA and ME. Your game is just religion and Pakistan. That defines you. I've yet to see some post that'd impress from you.

Your language here just proves your immaturity.

Like I said, stick to pointing out things on maps.

Leave technical analysis aside. It's beyond your capabilities.

Xizor · Oct 29, 2021

Mohsin77 said:
How am I "hurt" ?

You're the one constantly emoting.

And there's nothing "passive" about by aggression, lolz.

Your language here just proves your immaturity.

Like I said, stick to pointing out things on maps.

Leave technical analysis aside. It's beyond your capabilities.

"lolz"
- the guy who insists others are immature, judging by their language.

What are you 18? You aren't all that you think you are. "Technical analysis (?)" isn't your forte but certainly " theological analysis".

Come back with better stuff than Pravin Sawnhey's opinions. It's a pity sight.

Mohsin77 · Oct 29, 2021

Xsizor said:
"lolz"
- the guy who insists others are immature, judging by their language.

What? I can't laugh now? You're the one making me laugh.

Xsizor said:
What are you 18? You aren't all that you think you are.

Me? You're the one talking about "panties".

Xsizor said:
"Technical analysis" .... " theological analysis".

I have varied interests and discuss many subjects. Nothing wrong with that.

Xsizor said:
Come back with better stuff than Pravin Sawnhey's opinions. It's a pity sight.

Don't worry, I'm not going anywhere.

Cyclist · Oct 29, 2021

Xsizor said:
"Theater nuke nation" is my tagging to define a Pakistan whose nuclear force makeup is composed of small nuclear weapons in IRBM and cruise missiles.

A lot of Pakistanis heap praises on this person Pravin sawnhey ( in the comments) because apparently he is well balanced. Sure, he is different from other Indian YouTube defence analysts but I won't take his word for what the Indian Army's strategy and decision making path.

I'm merely stating this - Indian military is very cognizant of the threat posed by Pakistani Nukes and its readiness to use it in battle. Pakistan indeed need nukes to defend itself from India. For a particularly poor country with even shoddier MIC, Pakistan was ready to go all the way in creating nukes after the Indians tested them. Pakistan's nuclear posture only has one major target - India. Sure, my wording may make Pakistan look weak but that's not my intention. Objectively, Pakistan's conventional strength is very considerable too.

An ever growing India ( economy, military, diplomacy etc) is a guarantee. But a Pakistan that'd keep up with India isn't. Nukes will defend that country.

Sorry to interrupt, the beginning of your problem is here, Xsizor. You assume that Pakistan can not keep up with India and you guarantee that ever growing of India. Why are you so sure?

Big population does not mean a guarantee, example Japan with powerful economy, military and diplomacy too. Pakistan is quite respected in the majority Muslims nations. Please correct me if I am wrong, don't forget the history how majority Hindu population was conquered by Muslims sultanate (which now reside in Pakistan).

twineedle · Oct 29, 2021

Cyclist said:
Sorry to interrupt, the beginning of your problem is here, Xsizor. You assume that Pakistan can not keep up with India and you guarantee that ever growing of India. Why are you so sure?

Big population does not mean a guarantee, example Japan with powerful economy, military and diplomacy too. Pakistan is quite respected in the majority Muslims nations. Please correct me if I am wrong, don't forget the history how majority Hindu population was conquered by Muslims sultanate (which now reside in Pakistan).

By the time the British started involving itself in the subcontinent, there were no major Muslim powers in South Asia. Most of modern India was controlled by the marathas, while the northwest was dominated by the Sikh Empire until the mid nineteenth century. Maps made by the British themselves show this.

Don't see how that is relavent to this discussion.

Ladakh Flash Point

Mohsin77

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Mohsin77

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Xizor

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Mohsin77

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Xizor

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Mohsin77

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Xizor

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Mohsin77

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Cyclist

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twineedle

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