Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

Sardaukar20 said:

Lol! "The most successful" 4.5 gen in the world? How actual many air to air kills have the Rafales scored in actual combat? Last I checked, it was still zero. The last time the Rafale fought in a proper air to air combat, it was a one-sided defeat. The best combat record for the Rafale is by the French Air Force bombarding third-world militaries in Libya and Syria.

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Plane is national instrument and a product.

As national instrument, it does everything France wants; shooting down things is only relevant when there's such need.

And as product, it is on a straight path to gather 2x national orders from abroad(when indian order will materialize).
This not just subsidized french air force to have force structure it couldn't hope to afford on its own("replacement" discounted deals), it also effectively paid for next gen fighter(which is why France can afford to effectively give middle finger to Germany now).

How indians got shot down is ultimately their own problem here. It would be a problem if they'd cancel the orders. But they only doubled down, so who cares.

Hi,
IAF doesn’t have anything on hand to buy for their ACC to touch and go in coming days,
when i say doesn’t IAF is not ready to have F18 super hornet for their ACC dont want to
go for mig35 sake either too many nations involved with Eurofighter planes, only option left
is frost of all to make up the missing jets which been taken out by PAF and of cource in coming
years to fly from Navy‘s ACC though I’m sure still won’t be able to get source code from France
for their own gadgets to hang with Rafales they can have su35 asap but in the mind of India made in
India their uttam and other upgrades will surpass su35
so due to pick and choose of restricted fighter jets around the world only option left with twin engine
till they get su57 is Rafale this time they need awacs with western equipments to go along with Rafale
and of cource pilot training to train like a maniac on these jets.
thank you

Second of sixteen small ASW-SWC ships on order, INS Androth, was . Photo is from previous sea trials.



Thirteen of the sixteen ships on order have been launched to date. Program should be wrapped by 2029.

Lethe said:

Second of sixteen small ASW-SWC ships on order, INS Androth, was

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. Photo is from previous sea trials.

View attachment 162087

Thirteen of the sixteen ships on order have been launched to date. Program should be wrapped by 2029.

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It is a small ship, according to Wikipedia, the displacement is around 900T and has no anti-ship missile or anti-air weapon.

Lethe said:

Second of sixteen small ASW-SWC ships on order, INS Androth, was

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. Photo is from previous sea trials.

View attachment 162087

Thirteen of the sixteen ships on order have been launched to date. Program should be wrapped by 2029.

Click to expand...

INS Androth in the Indian media. We can observe some closer details of the corvette. Complete with their signature jingoistic boasting.

As far as ASW capabilities, this ship is pretty miserable. Very short range and endurance thanks to its small size, very poor armament (RBUs and no other standoff capabilities!), and no aviation facilities for helicopters or drones. It's a glorified OPV with some better sensors, that's it. If they only had to face old Pakistani diesel-electrics, then it would be passable, barely. But against the Hangors entering service soon, they're very insufficient. And if they had to face Chinese (or Western) nuclear subs...

These are limited ships addressed to a specific requirement: ASW operations in shallow littoral waters. Their limited range and endurance reflects that intended basing and operating environment, while lack of aviation capabilities will be compensated by support from land-based MPAs. Conversely, their low cost enables that critical factor for ASW that is so often neglected: numbers and therefore availability and distribution of sensors. In that sense, these ships perform a similar function to China's 056A corvettes, but on a smaller scale and with greater sacrifices outside that core ASW mission. These deficits should be entirely unsurprising given that, as has been so brilliantly observed by many, India is not remotely in China's league either in terms of available budget or integrated technologies (e.g. lack of Yu-8 analogue). Nonetheless, there is a requirement for littoral ASW and these ships address that requirement. Frankly, it speaks well of the Indian Navy and its orientation to task that they are willing to devote resources to relatively unsexy projects such as this one.

P.S. will essentially serve as the anti-ship counterpart to these small ASW ships.

Lethe said:

In that sense, these ships perform a similar function to China's 056A corvettes, but at a smaller scale and with greater sacrifices outside that core ASW mission.

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They're in fact quite far apart. It's a relatively rare type these days.

056A is a proper multipurpose deep water combatant, which in Indian navy is more akin to what Kamorta does. Just relatively small.
These on the other hand are direct evolution of traditional seagoing (shallow water) sub chasers.

JimmyMcFoob said:

As far as ASW capabilities, this ship is pretty miserable. Very short range and endurance thanks to its small size, very poor armament (RBUs and no other standoff capabilities!), and no aviation facilities for helicopters or drones.

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It's exactly its mission - shallow water, point blank ASW in shitty muddy and highly unusual coastal environment, requiring special toolkit.
It especially refers to hf sonar and bomb throwers, as well as small caliber automatic rcws.

Perhaps by chance (these ships were born as usual - "we had this ship, we need direct replacement"), but those are very good and useful ships for a dangerously neglected role, as normal ASW is impossible in such circumstances, and coastal minehunters can very easily turn into prey when "mines" turn out more volatile.

Gloire_bb said:

They're in fact quite far apart. It's a relatively rare type these days.

056A is a proper multipurpose deep water combatant, which in Indian navy is more akin to what Kamorta does. Just relatively small.
These on the other hand are direct evolution of traditional seagoing (shallow water) sub chasers.

It's exactly its mission - shallow water, point blank ASW in shitty muddy and highly unusual coastal environment, requiring special toolkit.
It especially refers to hf sonar and bomb throwers, as well as small caliber automatic rcws.

Perhaps by chance (these ships were born as usual - "we had this ship, we need direct replacement"), but those are very good and useful ships for a dangerously neglected role, as normal ASW is impossible in such circumstances, and coastal minehunters can very easily turn into prey when "mines" turn out more volatile.

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Every Chinese ship class is one class above whatever India has in terms of armament and sensor suite. So, India's frigates are at the level type 056A in terms of armament and sensors. India's Destroyers are on the level of China's 054A frigates when you look at the kind of air defense/ASW sensors that they carry.

That is the key difference between China's navy and indian navy. Each Chinese ship is much more superior and capable.

Gloire_bb said:

They're in fact quite far apart. It's a relatively rare type these days.

056A is a proper multipurpose deep water combatant, which in Indian navy is more akin to what Kamorta does. Just relatively small.
These on the other hand are direct evolution of traditional seagoing (shallow water) sub chasers.

It's exactly its mission - shallow water, point blank ASW in shitty muddy and highly unusual coastal environment, requiring special toolkit.
It especially refers to hf sonar and bomb throwers, as well as small caliber automatic rcws.

Perhaps by chance (these ships were born as usual - "we had this ship, we need direct replacement"), but those are very good and useful ships for a dangerously neglected role, as normal ASW is impossible in such circumstances, and coastal minehunters can very easily turn into prey when "mines" turn out more volatile.

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India is expecting the PAF submarine force to operate in muddy river mouths and mangroves forests?

The SSKs would sit outside major ports and if those are as silted up as you describe then they'll never be able handle significant vessels. You are going endanger submarines to sink flatbottom riverine vessels?

For these Indian vessels to be worth even their cheap prices, it needs to operate where the prize vessels -- major commercial shipping -- are operating and where the subs are waiting for them and those sail towards and from open ocean.