Hong-Kong Protests

Mr T

Senior Member
In regards to the national security laws, yes.

That's not the way that judges work. They're supposed to independently interpret and apply the law. If judges are just supposed to do what the CCP says, there's no point having court cases. The CCP could just hand down edicts convicting and sentencing people.

Is that genuinely what you want? You couldn't argue for having judges for propaganda value unless you were seeking to promote disinformation about how "fair" HK's justice system was when cases were decided beforehand.

The fact that my example of that one journalist being able to walk free

I would need to know the name of the journalist to check, but are you sure that it was even a Commonwealth/non-HK resident judge that was involved in the case? Generally they tend to be involved in the appeal courts rather than the courts of first instance.

Personally I expect the big fishes like Jimmy Lai will just get a lenient sentences

It depends whether you consider anything short of a 5-10 year jail sentence lenient. I'm not aware of him being convicted of anything previously, which would make it a first time offence - that normally leads to lighter sentencing. Also if he's cleared of fraud I wouldn't be surprised if a judge decides the "breach" of the national security law was trivial and therefore didn't require a harsh sentence.

It's up to the judge(s) to decide.

for me judges in HK fall only on 2 category, either they pro-government or pro-opposition.

I mean, you clearly think that judges are there to serve the government and not decide cases on their merits. If that was the case in Hong Kong then most of those investors would have left by now, because even putting criminal cases aside if they came into dispute with HK regulators or officials in a civil case they'd have no chance of winning.

You can't have it both ways. You can't try to claim to bankers that judges will decide their cases fairly and it's only the "bad people" who will automatically lose.

foreign judges shouldn't exist in the first place

As I said, that's the fault of the Chief Executives for appointing them. You should write a letter to Xi Jinping and demand he fire Carrie Lam for appointing any.

since western-style democracy also know this occurrence, and their executive branch and governing party will always elect judges that are supportive to their causes

The UK government doesn't appoint judges that serve its interests. There's an independent body that deals with recruitment of judges. Indeed, when there were political grumblings about judges being biased about the government and perhaps Supreme Court justices should have US-style confirmation hearings (just to screen the judges, not appoint them) there was a shocked response and the idea was quietly binned.

The current HK government now should just pick judges that are as biased as it can be to further our causes

So it's never been about foreign judges being biased, has it, it's about them being independent and sometimes not doing what the HK government wants.

How about this example. You obviously know Meng Wanzhou's case in Canada. Now, how would you have felt if the Canadian courts had gone "ok, the Canadian government wants extradition to take place, so we're going to dismiss her appeal quickly", dealt with the case in just one month and put her on a plane to the US?

Would you not mind because Canada has the right to do what Canada wants, even if it involves prominent Chinese citizens?
 

Gatekeeper

Brigadier
Registered Member
Seems like not even HK legislators know what the political system in HK is. Seems like they just take what they see from US/UK and assume that's how HK should work.

Yes, but even then they got it wrong. As Regina Ip said the three rights these condoms demanded doesn't exist in the UK either. And with it the great put down when she said. You studied in the UK. What kind of studying did you do? Lol!

So not only do they not know the political system in HK, it looks like they don't know about UK either, even after attending university there. I think he should demand his university tuition fees back. Lol
 

Gatekeeper

Brigadier
Registered Member
That's not the way that judges work. They're supposed to independently interpret and apply the law. If judges are just supposed to do what the CCP says, there's no point having court cases. The CCP could just hand down edicts convicting and sentencing people.
I mean, you clearly think that judges are there to serve the government and not decide cases on their merits.

So all that fuzz Trump did putting forward Amy and Brett as supreme court judge is really not a political appointees then.

What kind of mind gymnastics did this conjure up in your head?

As I said, that's the fault of the Chief Executives for appointing them. You should write a letter to Xi Jinping and demand he fire Carrie Lam for appointing any.

So the fact Judges have to be a barrister first, and the selection of Judges come from this small gene pool got nothing to do with it in the alternate world you live in.

And the fact even this small gene pool most of them studied in England and belong to the Bar associations in the UK, with oath taken to uphold laws from the U.K. got nothing to do with it.

Just what kind of mind gymnastics variety is this, the Nelli Kim variety?
 

Gatekeeper

Brigadier
Registered Member
Let's remind ourselves that these "peaceful" demonstrators according to some members here. (This kind of remind me of Trump calling people with rifles very good people) what they did to the city, terrifying the hell out of the populace.

But, like Trump, you never hear him ever condemn the lawlessness going on. Instead all you hear is CCP this and CCP that.

It makes you wonder What planet does he live in.

 

Equation

Lieutenant General
HK Church wants to set foreign policy. WTF.

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Zen have been encouraging Hong Kong residents to take an anti government thinking. For a religious leader it is conflicting towards the teachings of God where he should be preaching forgiveness and love in building a harmonious society. Whether the Pope will give Pompeo an audience is entirely up to the Pope to decide if it's fitting to do so, considering Pompeo have been focus in driving an anti China crusade, and is probably not going to be the State Secretary on 20 Jan, 2021. Zen is basically a white worshipping anit Communist idiot. I bet he molested a few little boys in his long career.
 

lgnxz

Junior Member
Registered Member
They're supposed to independently interpret and apply the law.
Haha well that's what your western propaganda supposed to tell. I have no idea how UK' system is implemented and literally have zero interest in learning/discussing it; UK has no power in effecting hong kong anymore, most people's concern about the foreign's interference within hong kong comes from america anyway. Regarding america, they seem to love their typical 'do as I say, not as I do' motto, while everyone already knows that their judges are heavily politized and easily lobbied, with the score being 6-3 for the republican as of now in their supreme court. Despite your avoidance in replying to the america example and admitting that yes, US's judicial system is just as partisan as my idea, I doubt I'll see you cry afoul with america's judicial system as you did with your 'ccp takeover of hk' narrative though, strange isn't it? :rolleyes:
If that was the case in Hong Kong then most of those investors would have left by now
Yet the evil big scary china with their evil big scary mainland judges have no such problems in attracting businesses and investors alike. The government isn't stupid, there's distinction between civil and criminal case, a national security law dealing with independence movements and mere investors having trouble in trying to get a government's contract.
how would you have felt if the Canadian courts had gone "ok, the Canadian government wants extradition to take place, so we're going to dismiss her appeal quickly", dealt with the case in just one month and put her on a plane to the US?
I expect canada fully kowtowing to america's demand, the whole thing being dragged to be this long is just mere theatrics, or waiting for the correct timing from their boss down south. Thus I actually chuckle a bit given that you seem to believe that canada is completely impartial in handling that case. When the time comes, reciprocal actions will as expected be done from china' side, as usual. It will perhaps push Ren Zhengfei and his huawei further into the edge, going full revenge mode on the whole fiasco. As you can see, I have no problem with partisan judges from the other side, I'm not as hypocritical.
 

Gatekeeper

Brigadier
Registered Member
Is it little wonder how the populace in the west get a different view of the same story from Hong Kong. Take the disqualification of the 4 traitors. We know from the signed letters that these 4 and others are actively seeking to destroy Hong Kong and damage China in the process by seeking foreign governments to apply sanctions and other helps to put pressure on the central government.

Yet, the Guardian reported their traitorous actions as merely an "unpatriotic" conduct under the new law. Isn't it laughable, it is trying to lead readers to believing these traitorous acts are subjective, and purely because China said so.

Talk about a hatchet job. job done.



Hong Kong politicians face pro-democracy exodus

As Beijing tightens its grip, opposition groups fear that their support base is dwindling

Emma Graham-Harrison

Sat 14 Nov 2020 18.07 EST

Hong Kong’s battered pro-democracy opposition faces a bleak political future after a week that saw the entire bloc resign from the city’s legislature to protest at the ousting of four members for “unpatriotic” conduct under a new law

Rest of the article:

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