Discussing Biden's Potential China Policy

Josh Luo said:

Well I have more question than answers now. The Tibetans I interacted with told me that they insisted their Han Chinese colleagues and family members to respect the Dalai Lama as a the living God, but they are just as grateful toward "Grandpa Xi 习爷爷" for building roads, railroads, and increasing welfare spending in Tibet. So I can still sense that there's unresolved conflict over the Dalai Lama and Tibetan Government in Exile. However, these Tibetans are willing to accept the status quo as long as they can maintain their current prosperity. Since the unresolved conflict over the Dalai Lama could be managed, I wonder why similar religious conflict cannot be managed in Xinjiang. Is Wahhabism from Saudi Arabia and Egypt the only causes?

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It is always the Han Chinese need to respect them but never the other way around, just typical. Who told you Tibetans didn't try to revolt and cause chaos. Hu Jintao put down a revolt in 89 and was promoted to Chairman due to his decisive actions. In 2008, another revolt was prevented by quick actions. Consequently, Tibet was given preferential treatment and handouts to modernize and improve living standard. However, handouts shouldn't be forever as it is unfair to many other Chinese.

Beside Tibet doesn't have only one living god. Tibet has multiple living gods. It is not just Dalai Lama and Panchen lama but many other lamas. Nyingma, Shakya, Kagyu and Gelug and Bon all command many following. You also forgot that many Tibetans used to be serfs(slaves) and were exploited. Many of these serfs and their descendants still fear the lama and would be willfully subject themselves to exploitation.

As for XJ, these people hacked and murdered over 200 Han Chinese including women and children and continued to kill over a thousand Han Chinese and other minorities and even their own. What do you expect the Chinese government going to do. Han Chinese were fleeing XJ and fear for their lives just a few years ago. Many people just have short memory how desperate the situation in XJ was and blindly accepted the Western media misinformation.

KYli said:

As for XJ, these people hacked and murdered over 200 Han Chinese including women and children and continued to kill over a thousand Han Chinese and other minorities and even their own. What do you expect the Chinese government going to do. Han Chinese were fleeing XJ and fear for their lives just a few years ago. Many people just have short memory how desperate the situation in XJ was and blindly accepted the Western media misinformation.

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A few people did that. Not all Uyghur people. A person's character can only be determined by their own actions, not those of others who happen to share an ethnic group.

gadgetcool5 said:

A few people did that. Not all Uyghur people. A person's character can only be determined by their own actions, not those of others who happen to share an ethnic group.

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Did the Chinese government put every Uyghur people into the vocational schools? The answer is clearly no. There might be 1 million Uyghur people that went to vocational schools and most of them were only there for a few weeks to a few months. So the Chinese government didn't try to punish an ethnic group. It is only trying to modernize the poor region and poverty alleviation by providing them with skills, languages, roads and railway.

Josh Luo said:

Well I have more question than answers now. The Tibetans I interacted with told me that they insisted their Han Chinese colleagues and family members to respect the Dalai Lama as a the living God, but they are just as grateful toward "Grandpa Xi 习爷爷" for building roads, railroads, and increasing welfare spending in Tibet. So I can still sense that there's unresolved conflict over the Dalai Lama and Tibetan Government in Exile. However, these Tibetans are willing to accept the status quo as long as they can maintain their current prosperity. Since the unresolved conflict over the Dalai Lama could be managed, I wonder why similar religious conflict cannot be managed in Xinjiang. Is Wahhabism from Saudi Arabia and Egypt the only causes?

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Because most Tibetans were serfs (basically slaves). They are grateful for the CCP liberation from serfdom. Go read up the shit the Lama and Tibetan elites had done to their serfs prior to the liberation.

Why is anyone taking "liberal advice" on dealing with ethnic challenges seriously? American liberals have for over a century tried to uplift blacks from poverty, but they have actually made the situation worse.

Welfare queens, urban ghettos, being soft on crime, "restorative justice", etc. All this nonsense that American liberals like @gadgetcool05 and @Josh Luo support doesn't work. Their racial projects are complete failures and a perpetual drain on the economy.

Being tough on crime, tough on terrorism, etc by contrast does work.

azuazu said:

Simple; its because of the universal two-child policy introduced in 2016.

That means TFR is capped at 2. Uyghurs used to be around 3.2+, so the math checks out.

The bigger question is: why is the TFR for the people formerly under the one-child policy still dropping? Stop the press! Is there a Han Chinese genocide going on?

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There is no universal two children policy in Xinjiang. Rural minorities can have three children. Urban minorities can have two children. Rural and Urban Han can have two children now (used to be only one for urban Han). There used to be more stringent limit for minorities couples where both the husband and the wife worked for the state, but I don’t think there is one now.

What happened was the family planning policies for rural minorities were never enforced until recently. The only family planning ever enforced on minorities until recently was the one for minority public sector employees in cities.

So even now most Uyghur are still allowed to have more children than Han, and yet some in the West are crying Uyghur genocide.

voyager1 said:

Let me also point out that China's stance of "non-interference" is extremely extremely important if it wants to ascend as easy as possible. When a new superpower rises, the rest of the world naturally worries about the world order and its internal affairs, even more so when the new superpower has a different political system.

So, China having a non-interference policy on internal affairs makes its ascendancy much easier as the rest of the world wont have too much to worry. China must also set clear red lines about how it handles foreign policy so the rest of the world can predict. Yes, predictability is a major thing in international relations because noone wants to deal with a crazy country which changes its policies and can turn from ally to enemy without reason (Trump is a a good example to avoid).

You can see this in the "One-China" policy and with the Australia situation. The Australian sanctions at first were misunderstood in some countries due to no clear reasons described. This was addressed by the 14 demands where China explained in clear language the reasons of the sanction. In my opinion this was a point to the whole world actually. From ASEAN to EU to even USA in lesser degree, everyone now knows where the red lines are

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China's stance of "non-interference" is partially virtue signaling just as the NFU policy. So partially meaningless.
Would China withhold using nuclear weapons even if that was the last option to avoid suffering an conventional existential defeat?

KYli said:

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US is running out of time.

You want a semiconductor supply chain? It take at least 2 years to get a foundry built, after the site has been selected and all the environmental and community concerns addressed.

Residential housing and schools built for engineers and staff integrated? You need at least 5 years to go from green fields to a full up plant.

Where are you going to sell that SC? Oh wait, you might still need to ship to China for final assembly and sold.

China might not make 5nm chip, but they already have foundries and rest of the supply chain, and more importantly, market.

If this was 2017, I say Biden has a better than even chance of making it. It is 2021, and the bill is not even on the floor. For this thing to get passed, funding obligated, you are looking at 2022 at the earliest.

Guess what, China will have this shit figured out and on shelves by 2025, 2027 latest.

You had better hope the Chinese don't get ahead of you and make all this shit at "cabbage" prices, and make all this investment unrecoverable. You industry partners have to really weigh their option, this is the level of investment that can kill off a player or two.

MF'cker/TMD, DJT was a freaking godsend, the real Manchurian candidate.

steel21 said:

US is running out of time.
.

MF'cker/TMD, DJT was a freaking godsend, the real Manchurian candidate.

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For us foreigners outside of America ...

It is really hard to understand what is happening inside America.

I would like to just ask one question.

If the world has two supply chains, in semiconductor manufacturing, one serving the China market and one centered/serving the America market, would that be a satisfactory outcome of this so-called tech war?

Honestly, no one knows what the answer would be if we ask the Americans.