Coronavirus 2019-2020 thread (no unsubstantiated rumours!)

[Temstar]

Recognizing WHO-approved vaccines means (at this point) just additionally recognizing Sinopharm and Sinovac, lol (Maybe Covishield if not authorized with AZ).
I guess for the US, it means recognizing AZ as well.

Will be interesting if the Canadian federal government changes its own stance. I believe their refusal to give any sort of reduced quarantine to Sinovac and Sinopharm users was politically motivated as the PM said "allied vaccine policy" in a speech. Maybe an US-led attempt to try to sideline the purchase and acceptance of Chinese vaccines?

What's interesting is the provincial governments have been okay with WHO vaccines for their vaccine passport systems (previously posted the Ontario government website)
BC:

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Quebec:

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Now that US has done it everyone else will be under pressure to do it too, regardless of their own feelings on this. Otherwise they will be pushing Chinese (and all the other countries using Chinese vaccine) business and money towards the US.

 

[AndrewS]

Variants will pop up faster than you can make vaccines, especially vaccines that only target a single antigen lol, so the disease is already endemic. Why force vaccines on everyone for an endemic disease that grows stronger with every failed mass vaccination campaign? Again, total fail from team vaccine.

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But what is even more interesting is the fact that new escape variants are emerging, obviously driven by selection pressure and the inability of these junk vaccines to stamp out the disease. Its obvious that the mass vaccination campaign is actually making the disease MORE virulent and possibly MORE deadly by artificially upping the selection pressure. Truly, team vaccine is not only failing to stop the pandemic, but is now making it worse by their own actions. What will team vaccine do when the public, reeling from the vicious lies spread by big pharma, refuses to take the cocktail of booster shots every 6, sorry every 3 months?

Total.

Failure.

It's clear that you don't even have a basic understanding of how the human immune system works.

The virus DOES NOT grow stronger with more vaccinations. It actually forces the virus to use different antigens, which are by nature less infectious, but able to evade existing immunity. And there are only a finite number of proteins that a virus can use to successfully compromise cells.

I suggest you do not make another comment on vaccines until you have a basic understanding of macrophages, T-cells, B-cells, the complement system, the lymph system and neutrophils.

 

[KYli]

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[Bellum_Romanum]

This is misinformation. You can voluntarily refuse the vaccine. Under Joe Biden's executive order, you can choose to get tested once a week instead of getting the vaccine. You won't be fired if you get tested weekly, which is very reasonable. There is not mandate.

This is misinformation and fearmongering. Who the fuck is demanding children to be vaccinated when FDA has not approved vaccines for children <12 years old yet?

The vaccine has FDA Full Approval, it is NOT "experimental and investigational" anymore.

Through clinical trials, we discover:

1. Drug safety in patients
2. Drug efficacy against disease
3. Dose-Response relationship
4. Adverse events and risks

This vaccine is no longer experimental. Stop making up bullshit. You can reasonably argue that there is lack of long-term safety clinical trial data or the Phase III trial was accelerated due to the Public Health emergency, but you cannot say that is "experimental" it has full FDA approval, so it's not experimental. It also has high quality rigorous short-term RCT data on safety/efficacy.

First off, there is no vaccine mandate. You can opt out and refuse the vaccine and take weekly COVID tests instead. Stop calling it a "Mandate", nobody is forcing you to take the vaccine.

Why are you so focused on infection, but not risk reduction of severe disease and death?

You are implying that you better off un-vaccinated (with or without COVID), compared to vaccinated (with or without COVID). There is no scientific proof for this. If there is, please feel free to share.

Our understanding about the novel virus has shifted since it's a new unknown virus that has never been seen before in humans, so policies will naturally adjust to updated scientific understanding.

Thank god nobody is forcing you take the vaccine, you can go get weekly COVID testings instead. Under Joe Biden's executive order, you are not forced to take the vaccine, you can opt out and get COVID tests once a week. Why is it not surprising that you anti-vaxxers are misunderstanding executive orders and scientific articles? You guys don't read?

As with influenza vaccines, you don't target every variant in existent (over 150 influenza variants), you only need to target the top 4 most prevalent and dominant variants. You have a fundamental misunderstanding of how vaccines works. You don't need to target every mutate that exist, only the variants that is most prevalent and dominant and most likely to infect the most number of humans. The goal of vaccines isn't eradication.

Why are you suggesting "lol". Why don't you provide scientific citation that targeting only a single antigen is more likely to generate lethal variants.

The disease is endemic in animal host population, so regardless of human mass vaccination, the virus is already endemic in bats, deers, dogs, cats, civets, pangolins, mice, gorillas, etc...

...because vaccines reduce hospitalization, severe disease, and most importantly, DEATH, which is completely absent in your analysis. Variants are endemic in animal hosts, so its pointless about fear-mongering about human-generated variants because SAR-CoV-2 virus thrive and mutates in bats, deers, dogs, cats, civets, pangolins, mice, gorillas. It's virtually impossible to stop variants whether in human or animal host population, so it's not even a factor to justify not vaccinating people, assuming that your assertion that variants grow more virulence, which remains unseen.

Again, 10X reduction in severe disease, hospitalization, and DEATH is a total success from team vaccine. Your analysis absolutely ignores the protection against Death, and you fearmongering about non-existent variant threat (ignoring the humongous animal host population) and fearmongering about side-effects (ignoring that vaccines have significantly lower side-effects compared to COVID).
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It cannot be understated how anti-vaxxers misrepresent information, fail to understand even the most basic presidential proclaimations, fail to read and provide scientific evidence to support their argument, and just stubbornly spread misinformation and malicious falsehoods. You have a fundamental misunderstanding of how vaccines work and biology work.
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Escape variants are also generated by animal host population, so stop fearmongering about vaccine-caused variants, when it's only a small fraction of the total human+animal host population.

What is even more interesting is how "junk" vaccines significantly reduce hospitalization and death, while YOUR strategy would exponentially increase hospitalization and death.


You are missing the forest for the trees. Again, escape variants are also generated by animal host population, so stop fear mongering about vaccine-caused variants, when it's only a small fraction of the total human+animal host population.


The pandemic will stop when hospitalization and death drops down to a "socially acceptable" level. The goal isn't to eradicate infections, which you and I agree, is impossible since it's an endemic disease.

Your solution of accepting the virus only works if hospitalization and deaths drop significantly. You can't end the pandemic by having so much death and hospitalization. That makes no sense.



They are free to refuse to take booster shots, because there is no vaccine mandate in the United States. Joe Biden said you can refuse to take boosters or vaccines, you go get a weekly COVID test instead. There is no mandate in the US.

That was an epic point by point rebuttal to one of our friend's concerns on covid-19 vaccines and it's supposed unscientific rigour which have been shared, used and disseminated to a lot of people all over the world.

I know our friend has a lot of concerns that are being shared by people that are not necessarily anti-vaccines per se but have been or become reluctant to partake with these new vaccines due to lack of long term phase III trials as you pointed out on your rebuttal post. And am glad that you're taking the time and enough patient to actually answer his concerns, incorrect information, assumptions on these vaccines and it's overall safety and efficacy of use towards the public. Kudos to you sir. Please stick around and don't get yourself too heated because it would be a loss for this forum if you happen to fall into the landmines some of our colleagues have found themselves into permanently.

 

[KenC]

“The calculation results show that the COVID-19 epidemic in the United States has a high probability of beginning to spread around September 2019,”

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[bajingan]

I am not an anti vacc, i have taken second dose of pfizer, but honestly the possibility of having to take boosters every 6 or even 3 months doesn't excite me too much
and i suspect even many pro vacc people feel the same way as i do

 

[Dolcevita]

No, but you have been reported for spreading misinformation.


Vaccine proponents has been very clear that vaccines do not prevent 100% all infection.

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doctor said

“The primary thing you want to do is that if people get infected, prevent them from getting sick, and if you prevent them from getting sick, you will ultimately prevent them from getting seriously ill,” Fauci said at

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Monday.

Alleviate and reduce. Perhaps,


PREVENT them from getting sick? MEH
This coming from the expert? Another MEH
Disinformation. YES

 

[Phead128]

I am not an anti vacc, i have taken second dose of pfizer, but honestly the possibility of having to take boosters every 6 or even 3 months doesn't excite me too much
and i suspect even many pro vacc people feel the same way as i do

Yes, I took my second dose of Pfizer, and went to urgent care and emergency room for chest pain (suspected myocarditis). I have a $1800 bill for that visit. I probably won't be getting a booster for a long time, since I am early 30's and wear mask everywhere I go....or maybe I'll wait like 12 mons to get a Delta-specific booster.

But if you are elderly, immunocompromised, or comorbid, I recommend getting a booster. For us vaccinated younger folks, a booster isn't absolutely necessary since we have resilient T-cell and B-cell secondary immune response. We will get infected and get asses kicked but we won't be put on a ventilator or need oxygen in a hospital.

 

[solarz]

Yes, I took my second dose of Pfizer, and went to urgent care and emergency room for chest pain (suspected myocarditis). I have a $1800 bill for that visit. I probably won't be getting a booster for a long time, since I am early 30's and wear mask everywhere I go....or maybe I'll wait like 12 mons to get a Delta-specific booster.

But if you are elderly, immunocompromised, or comorbid, I recommend getting a booster. For us vaccinated younger folks, a booster isn't absolutely necessary since we have resilient T-cell and B-cell secondary immune response. We will get infected and get asses kicked but we won't be put on a ventilator or need oxygen in a hospital.

Damn, no insurance?

Amazing, the vaccine did more damage to you than the actual "disease" yet you still defend it as the solution to the pandemic.

Some people's minds cannot be changed, even when the evidence is in his own body.

Ridiculous.

Nobody knows what will happen if you get infected. You could fight it off after a few weeks, or you could end up in the ICU.

Worse yet, you will likely infect your loved ones: your wife, your parents, your children.

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[solarz]

Its been almost 2 years. Everyone knows what happens if you get infected actually. 99% of the time its nothing (especially with high PCR cycles inflating case counts).

That's a blatant lie. Reported.