China's Defense/Military Breaking News Thread


bobsagget

New Member
Registered Member
It is rather frustrating to live with . I mean i remember as a kid old nam vets saying in 03 that we were going to loose iraq and a stan . Well look what happens 10 trillion dollars later. One thing the pro war crowd thinks of is what happens if we win ? We will have destroyed a nation thats 33 percent of global manufacturing out put a nation of 1.4 billion people spread across an area the size of conus with a language very few americans are fluent in. Now if i know one thing from chinese history is after the last occupation and century of humiliation they would rather cease to exist than to bow to a western state. If afghanistan and iraq was bad for insurgency, imagine millions of angry educated chinese who also likely have skilled trades folk en mass. The type of folk who can make 100 lbs of c4 cut up sewer pipe and a cap and make an efp out of it. Fact is we have nowhere near enough people to occupy or run china, let alone the political logistics of administrating it. Even if we won it would destroy us
It's a shame that most Americans absolutely do not share this view (at least non Chinese-American Americans). The trajectory of the forces in play indicate that war is an inevitability. Kinetic war, not the propaganda and political/slandering war which the US has been waging for some time and China is slow to start in reciprocating (mostly because it's focused on the more tangible warfares).

Like Zhangjim mentioned, it is the time as we currently stand upon, that the vast majority of US citizens are ignorant on China in an intentional, planned direction. Whereas Chinese are just ignorant about the US (outside of the fact it is extremely adversarial to China) because Chinese people are kept rather busy and are much more apolitical overall. The US still has an overall lead in technology but the gap has been closing tremendously fast through the last decades. Decades are less than a blink of an eye in civilisation cycles/ages. More westerners believe in some inherent "exceptionalism" or "superiority" perhaps owing to centuries of colonial derived industrial and economic dominance. That's not to say there is no contribution to that in terms of leadership, organisation, and "tribal" unifying forces such as Christianity. But China is eclipsing the west in technology. The evidence is abundant if one cares to search. But the problem is right there, one does not care to understand the true nature of things. No one has built a complete understanding of anything remotely complex or nuanced (experts cannot know and understand all there is to in their field) let alone all things, but it appears to me that in this grand scheme of things, those at the top are always brought down by "virtue" of lofty positions.

It is therefore extremely unfortunate that humanity actually finds itself at this position. With our natural behaviour as it is and has been since our evolution into this form and all that baggage which come with, combined with our relatively newly acquired technological means of destruction at a scale primitive humans did not have, perhaps the reason we've come this far despite being that magical combination of violent, lacking in empathy, greedy, mistrustful, untrustworthy, and proud. I am fortunate enough to have lived in, learned, experienced, built some deep understanding of how both "sides" think, feel, operate, and truly I would happily be judged on my firm belief that western culture is the more toxic, deceitful, and counter to mutual peace/prosperity of the two. I know this in my heart of hearts and while Chinese people and culture is nothing near perfect or even any ideal, it is far more open to simply existing with "the flow of things"... well compared to the west at least. Any future conflict that arises out of this would be brought around by the west feeling that China is about to "unseat" it as a global hegemon, which the US has been since it more or less dictates the world order and has commanded just about every piece of resource on our little planet.
It is rather frustrating to live with . I mean i remember as a kid old nam vets saying in 03 that we were going to loose iraq and a stan . Well look what happens 10 trillion dollars later. One thing the pro war crowd thinks of is what happens if we win ? We will have destroyed a nation thats 33 percent of global manufacturing out put a nation of 1.4 billion people spread across an area the size of conus with a language very few americans are fluent in. Now if i know one thing from chinese history is after the last occupation and century of humiliation they would rather cease to exist than to bow to a western state. If afghanistan and iraq was bad for insurgency, imagine millions of angry educated chinese who also likely have skilled trades folk en mass. The type of folk who can make 100 lbs of c4 cut up sewer pipe and a cap and make an efp out of it. Fact is we have nowhere near enough people to occupy or run china, let alone the political logistics of administrating it. Even if we won it would destroy us.

I find that many people in the west hold racist ideas towards most asians at a subconscious level like painfully bad fucking Vietnam era stereotypes.
these are
1. The chinese cannot innovate or create they can only steal and copy. This gets thrown around whenever something new and impressive comes out of china . “It’s stolen USA made it first were better.” Issue is in this case “inventing” is either running a one off design and testing program or solving the general concept without developing production capacity. Just because one knows theoretically what tiddy feels like does not mean they have the capacity to aquire the tiddy. This is a rather crass way of saying industrial logistics matter. (Ex lack of ship building indistry lack of high performance explosives and tungsten.)
2. Chinese products are inferior. Magically chinese buildings will crumble like a castle built of sand at the beach the damn will fall the tanks will rust and disintegrate in front of our eyes. Clear absurdity . The chinese make some good kit i know this because i have purchased leapers optics , olight, and miltec. Fact is the shits good and they make a huge fucking profit even with low sales cost(That means in a war economy china can afford to produce new material at a lower cost per individual and endure it longer).. Folks will say yeah but the usa currently has the high tech lead ( keep in mind this gap is shrinking). The issue here is a flaw driven by the modern usa’s obsession with wonderwaffe. Part of this is a left over from cold war propaganda started in the 80s -2000s. The usa had to hype up the release of new tech at the time to bolster the morale of forces who were often times looking at vastly superior performance soviet kit until the 80s. While a majority of this kit has performed very well it is fundamentally getting long in the tooth and many are without proper replacement . What this means is that china can observe the potential of our legacy based platforms and counter design their solutions. Also one must remember the tigger did not win ww2 it was the Sherman and t34 and im no math genius but im pretty sure china has a large enough population to sustain some pretty nasty losses.

3.The end of history. Nothing dumber or more hubristic has ever been said. I an sure the Greeks, Persians, Hindu India, Imperial China and The United kingdom figured they would last till the sun burned from the sky. The issue here is americans assume because the USSR collapsed that neoliberal ( Tbh were an oligarchy but i digress) politics was the superior form of government for all time . I doubt i need to explain too much as to the mental problems this mindset causes .
4. Chinese are cowards. This ones born out of americans viewing asians in particular their men as effeminate and weak. Unless your a pork eating beer chugging crusader for christ who has broken more than 10 bones and has picked up an equal amount of stds you aint a real man. This leads to many americans thinking the chinese would be an easily demoralized force prone to surrender. No clue why anyone who has read about the korean war would ever think this.

5. China has no modern war experience and limited institutional knowledge. This is commonly said when someone is trying to push back against the fact Chinese levels of training are approaching the West’s. We have not fought any real opposition since 03 and 03 was a coalition force with nato plus extras. (i am unsure how many of our allies would be willing to attack a nuclear nation.) Fact is though this is not really an advantage at all if anything its become a clear disadvantage , recruitment numbers are low as the younger generation fears being shipped off to die or be trumatized in another forever war ( Thats before you get to the fact 86 percent of military age youth are considered unfit for service due to obesity,psych or criminal reasons.) The constant state of war has also spread our forces thin on places we cannot withdraw our obligations from (Gee what colonial powers had this happen?) That makes it hard for us to concentrate forces. But there are still more issues from constant war many of our troops are already demoralized the suicide and drug od rate climbs as inadequate mental health and health services are provided. You need healthy bodies and healthy minds to fight a war. Healthy bodies and minds are created during peace not continued exposure to violent barbarity. All we have shown for 20 plus years was that we could operate in permissive battle spaces against fucking ngo terrorist groups. No shit its easy to stack bodies when you have an ac130 on call and your opfor doesn’t even have fucking manpads.

sorry for any errors and odd formatting as this was sent from my phone.
- Ramblings by bumfuck uncle
 

bobsagget

New Member
Registered Member
It's a shame that most Americans absolutely do not share this view (at least non Chinese-American Americans). The trajectory of the forces in play indicate that war is an inevitability. Kinetic war, not the propaganda and political/slandering war which the US has been waging for some time and China is slow to start in reciprocating (mostly because it's focused on the more tangible warfares).

Like Zhangjim mentioned, it is the time as we currently stand upon, that the vast majority of US citizens are ignorant on China in an intentional, planned direction. Whereas Chinese are just ignorant about the US (outside of the fact it is extremely adversarial to China) because Chinese people are kept rather busy and are much more apolitical overall. The US still has an overall lead in technology but the gap has been closing tremendously fast through the last decades. Decades are less than a blink of an eye in civilisation cycles/ages. More westerners believe in some inherent "exceptionalism" or "superiority" perhaps owing to centuries of colonial derived industrial and economic dominance. That's not to say there is no contribution to that in terms of leadership, organisation, and "tribal" unifying forces such as Christianity. But China is eclipsing the west in technology. The evidence is abundant if one cares to search. But the problem is right there, one does not care to understand the true nature of things. No one has built a complete understanding of anything remotely complex or nuanced (experts cannot know and understand all there is to in their field) let alone all things, but it appears to me that in this grand scheme of things, those at the top are always brought down by "virtue" of lofty positions.

It is therefore extremely unfortunate that humanity actually finds itself at this position. With our natural behaviour as it is and has been since our evolution into this form and all that baggage which come with, combined with our relatively newly acquired technological means of destruction at a scale primitive humans did not have, perhaps the reason we've come this far despite being that magical combination of violent, lacking in empathy, greedy, mistrustful, untrustworthy, and proud. I am fortunate enough to have lived in, learned, experienced, built some deep understanding of how both "sides" think, feel, operate, and truly I would happily be judged on my firm belief that western culture is the more toxic, deceitful, and counter to mutual peace/prosperity of the two. I know this in my heart of hearts and while Chinese people and culture is nothing near perfect or even any ideal, it is far more open to simply existing with "the flow of things"... well compared to the west at least. Any future conflict that arises out of this would be brought around by the west feeling that China is about to "unseat" it as a global hegemon, which the US has been since it more or less dictates the world order and has commanded just about every piece of resource on our little planet.
You know speaking about “ I would happily be judged on my firm belief that western culture is the more toxic, deceitful, and counter to mutual peace/prosperity of the two.”. There is an easy thought test i made. Imagine an advanced and non hostile alien soecies shows up with great tech and power overmatch. Keep in mind they have done nothing hostile and only participate in reciprocal free market trade. Now imagine how a countries population would react to it and the country itself. China honestly would likely not give a flying fuck beyond being happy their territorial borders were being respected. Meanwhile i cannot imagine my own country not loosing its god damn mind because of religion, fear of not being number 1, and paranoia about any sort of unified governance.
 

ACuriousPLAFan

Senior Member
Registered Member
It is rather frustrating to live with . I mean i remember as a kid old nam vets saying in 03 that we were going to loose iraq and a stan . Well look what happens 10 trillion dollars later. One thing the pro war crowd thinks of is what happens if we win ? We will have destroyed a nation thats 33 percent of global manufacturing out put a nation of 1.4 billion people spread across an area the size of conus with a language very few americans are fluent in. Now if i know one thing from chinese history is after the last occupation and century of humiliation they would rather cease to exist than to bow to a western state. If afghanistan and iraq was bad for insurgency, imagine millions of angry educated chinese who also likely have skilled trades folk en mass. The type of folk who can make 100 lbs of c4 cut up sewer pipe and a cap and make an efp out of it. Fact is we have nowhere near enough people to occupy or run china, let alone the political logistics of administrating it. Even if we won it would destroy us.

I find that many people in the west hold racist ideas towards most asians at a subconscious level like painfully bad fucking Vietnam era stereotypes.
these are
1. The chinese cannot innovate or create they can only steal and copy. This gets thrown around whenever something new and impressive comes out of china . “It’s stolen USA made it first were better.” Issue is in this case “inventing” is either running a one off design and testing program or solving the general concept without developing production capacity. Just because one knows theoretically what tiddy feels like does not mean they have the capacity to aquire the tiddy. This is a rather crass way of saying industrial logistics matter. (Ex lack of ship building indistry lack of high performance explosives and tungsten.)
2. Chinese products are inferior. Magically chinese buildings will crumble like a castle built of sand at the beach the damn will fall the tanks will rust and disintegrate in front of our eyes. Clear absurdity . The chinese make some good kit i know this because i have purchased leapers optics , olight, and miltec. Fact is the shits good and they make a huge fucking profit even with low sales cost(That means in a war economy china can afford to produce new material at a lower cost per individual and endure it longer).. Folks will say yeah but the usa currently has the high tech lead ( keep in mind this gap is shrinking). The issue here is a flaw driven by the modern usa’s obsession with wonderwaffe. Part of this is a left over from cold war propaganda started in the 80s -2000s. The usa had to hype up the release of new tech at the time to bolster the morale of forces who were often times looking at vastly superior performance soviet kit until the 80s. While a majority of this kit has performed very well it is fundamentally getting long in the tooth and many are without proper replacement . What this means is that china can observe the potential of our legacy based platforms and counter design their solutions. Also one must remember the tigger did not win ww2 it was the Sherman and t34 and im no math genius but im pretty sure china has a large enough population to sustain some pretty nasty losses.

3.The end of history. Nothing dumber or more hubristic has ever been said. I an sure the Greeks, Persians, Hindu India, Imperial China and The United kingdom figured they would last till the sun burned from the sky. The issue here is americans assume because the USSR collapsed that neoliberal ( Tbh were an oligarchy but i digress) politics was the superior form of government for all time . I doubt i need to explain too much as to the mental problems this mindset causes .
4. Chinese are cowards. This ones born out of americans viewing asians in particular their men as effeminate and weak. Unless your a pork eating beer chugging crusader for christ who has broken more than 10 bones and has picked up an equal amount of stds you aint a real man. This leads to many americans thinking the chinese would be an easily demoralized force prone to surrender. No clue why anyone who has read about the korean war would ever think this.

5. China has no modern war experience and limited institutional knowledge. This is commonly said when someone is trying to push back against the fact Chinese levels of training are approaching the West’s. We have not fought any real opposition since 03 and 03 was a coalition force with nato plus extras. (i am unsure how many of our allies would be willing to attack a nuclear nation.) Fact is though this is not really an advantage at all if anything its become a clear disadvantage , recruitment numbers are low as the younger generation fears being shipped off to die or be trumatized in another forever war ( Thats before you get to the fact 86 percent of military age youth are considered unfit for service due to obesity,psych or criminal reasons.) The constant state of war has also spread our forces thin on places we cannot withdraw our obligations from (Gee what colonial powers had this happen?) That makes it hard for us to concentrate forces. But there are still more issues from constant war many of our troops are already demoralized the suicide and drug od rate climbs as inadequate mental health and health services are provided. You need healthy bodies and healthy minds to fight a war. Healthy bodies and minds are created during peace not continued exposure to violent barbarity. All we have shown for 20 plus years was that we could operate in permissive battle spaces against fucking ngo terrorist groups. No shit its easy to stack bodies when you have an ac130 on call and your opfor doesn’t even have fucking manpads.

sorry for any errors and odd formatting as this was sent from my phone.
- Ramblings by bumfuck uncle
From your points, I can infer that there are 3 kinds of Americans (and Westerners in general) which are actually eager and willing to go to war against China:

Kind #1 - Those who really thought that war is "fun-&-exciting" like Modern Warfare, Battlefields or CSGO, where they could just rush B, massacre as many enemy forces as they want, take multiple gunshots without dying, and without suffering from any war-related PTSDs.

This kind of Americans (and Westerners in general) are the least worrying. They usually are the first ones to run in the opposite direction when sh1t does hit the fan.

Kind #2 - Those who despise China and the Chinese people thanks to constant Sinophobic brainwashing by the West, and truly believe that by going to war with China, they are somehow doing God's work, and that they would "save and liberate those poor and oppressed Chinese from the evil SeeSeePee".

This kind of Americans (and Westerners in general) are certainly worse than kind #1, but still largely managable and can be turned around if their mindsets could be rectified in time.

Kind #3 - Those who actually hate China and the Chinese people to the very core, viewing China and the Chinese people as existential threats to them, and would very love to see the Chinese civilization state being wiped from the surface of the earth at any costs, even if the whole world is scorched by nuclear hellfire as a result.

This kind of Americans (and Westerners in general) are the most worrying. They themselves represent the most dangerous and lethal threat to the continuity and surivival of the humanity.

Unfortunately, the biggest problem we are facing right now is that the proportions of Americans (and Westerners in general) who are in the kind #2 and kind #3 categories have been growing exponentially larger, especially in the past few years.

This is what scares us, both Chinese and non-Chinese, the most. Why? Because the US, on its own, has the capability to end the whole world as we know it.
 
Last edited:

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
It is rather frustrating to live with . I mean i remember as a kid old nam vets saying in 03 that we were going to loose iraq and a stan . Well look what happens 10 trillion dollars later. One thing the pro war crowd thinks of is what happens if we win ? We will have destroyed a nation thats 33 percent of global manufacturing out put a nation of 1.4 billion people spread across an area the size of conus with a language very few americans are fluent in. Now if i know one thing from chinese history is after the last occupation and century of humiliation they would rather cease to exist than to bow to a western state. If afghanistan and iraq was bad for insurgency, imagine millions of angry educated chinese who also likely have skilled trades folk en mass. The type of folk who can make 100 lbs of c4 cut up sewer pipe and a cap and make an efp out of it. Fact is we have nowhere near enough people to occupy or run china, let alone the political logistics of administrating it. Even if we won it would destroy us

The US is a damned nation no matter what path it chooses.

There is no path towards redemption for the US. It's amazing how the ignorant sheeple actually understand (or rather, misunderstand) just about everything.

I think there is a path towards peace if no nukes are used and one side clearly has enough of an upper hand that such a war is de-escalated. The US has simply no ability to administer China. China has some limited ability to administer the US (these are derived simply from population sizes) but has little desire and no experience in administering very foreign nations and cultures. MAD means these are all moot. Chinese terrorism is pretty unimaginable though. Chinese people are generally not motivated by the concept of holy war. The Americans are also not despite being far more political than Chinese are and have far more parts of their culture become extremely politicised. Chinese are conformists.

Anyway this is super off topic now and continued long enough.
 

bobsagget

New Member
Registered Member
The US is a damned nation no matter what path it chooses.

There is no path towards redemption for the US. It's amazing how the ignorant sheeple actually understand (or rather, misunderstand) just about everything.

I think there is a path towards peace if no nukes are used and one side clearly has enough of an upper hand that such a war is de-escalated. The US has simply no ability to administer China. China has some limited ability to administer the US (these are derived simply from population sizes) but has little desire and no experience in administering very foreign nations and cultures. MAD means these are all moot. Chinese terrorism is pretty unimaginable though. Chinese people are generally not motivated by the concept of holy war. The Americans are also not despite being far more political than Chinese are and have far more parts of their culture become extremely politicised. Chinese are conformists.

Anyway this is super off topic now and continued long enough.
I would counter the claim china has had no experience in controlling high risk areas they had patrols entering a stan since 16 i think . They showed up there enough to hit major western news outlets
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Jj888

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I would counter the claim china has had no experience in controlling high risk areas they had patrols entering a stan since 16 i think . They showed up there enough to hit major western news outlets
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Why are americans so obsessed with other nations like Afghanistan located half way round the world that have little economic & military impact on their homeland?

look within at your homeless people, your crumbling infrastructure, your wall street billion dollar disappearing acts, throwing billions at Ukraine…

yet china securing its borders with its borders need your pentagon ok?
 

Soldier30

Junior Member
Registered Member
A promo video of China's new Wing Loong 3 UAV was shown at AirShow China 2022. The video shows the alleged future combat work of the Wing Loong 3 UAV. According to Chinese media, the Wing Loong 3 drone can carry 16 missiles and bombs, and it will also be equipped with a new PL-10E air-to-air missile. The UAV is made according to the scheme similar to the UAV General Atomics MQ-9A/B USA. Wing Loong-3 is equipped with a turboprop engine and has a flight range of up to 10 thousand km. The maximum takeoff weight of the UAV is 6200 kg with a payload of up to 2300 kg. The flight duration reaches up to 40 hours.

 

Chilled_k6

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PLA standoff with Australian, Japanese and US destroyers using EM capabilities in the Spratly Islands.
One defence figure, speaking to the ABC on the condition of anonymity, said the Chinese military closely tracked the vessels and showed a "significant increase in tactical acumen and use of EM (electronic warfare) capabilities"."They (the Chinese) are being less overt, apathetic vis-a-vis their usual actions, behaviours and methodologies," the ADF figure claimed.
Based on this quote, wonder if the Western navies had some of their equipment jammed.
 

sunnymaxi

Senior Member
Registered Member

Hysterical Laughter Memes - The Funniest Post
 

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