China Flanker Thread II

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Totoro

Major
VIP Professional
can someone point out to me other rwr and maw sensors on those j16 images? i can see the pair of each on the tail sting (and there should be another pair on the other side of the tail sting) but where are the other sensors? namely the ones for the front hemisphere?
 

Franklin

Captain
Are you guys sure this is a production plane ? Because the numbering seems odd, 1612. Shouldn't it be 112 meaning batch 1 and plane 12 ? We didn't see 1503 with the J-15 it was 101 to 104.
 

chuck731

Banned Idiot
There is indeed no longer a pitot !!!

Deino

It appears to me there are now a pair of smaller pitot on the fuselage just behind the Radom, directly ahead the stowed refueling nozzle, and below what appear to be formation lights. Very likely there would be another matching pair on the other side.

F-15 has a similar arrangement of 2 pitot tubes on either side of forward fuselage.
 
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Deino

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Are you guys sure this is a production plane ? Because the numbering seems odd, 1612. Shouldn't it be 112 meaning batch 1 and plane 12 ? We didn't see 1503 with the J-15 it was 101 to 104.

I understand and even share Your concers - esp. since it would mean a production batch of only 9 aircraft (1619) at a maximum - and maybe You are correct that it is not a true serial but a LRIP- or pre-serial with 16 for J-16, the 1 = pre-serial block and finally number 2 = second aircraft.

Regarding the 102 & 103 serials we saw on the J-15, these numbers are no production serial numbers but simply modex numbers like the three digit numbers used by all US Navy birds.

Deino
 

chuck731

Banned Idiot
Does that mean the pitot tube is replaced by an array of static pressure measuring points from which pressure height, speed and angle of attack are calculated?

Static pressure sensors still needs some device that look like a pitot tube to raise them out of boundary layer next to the plane's skin to get a good clean reading.
 

Totoro

Major
VIP Professional
prototypes were usually labeled with 0, as far as i can tell.

batch 1 could mean preproduction batch, standardized, but not yet mass produced. but if all goes well, we could see first mass produced airframes by the end of the year and perhaps first regiment forming by the end of 2015.
 

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
Also we know that there are at least two prototypes '1601' & '1603' ... and by the way since it is based on a proven airframe at least aerodynamic testing can be cut considerably.

Deino

That is correct, with the number designations changing from J-11- J-15, J-15s, J-16, the novice might assume that each of these designators were for a completely different aircraft, and they absolutely are not, but are all variants of the SU-27, so these pre-production aircraft would be more accurately designated as "test articles" rather than prototypes such as the J-20 proto-types which are currently being developed. Even the addition of canards on the J-15, would simply qualify it as another "variant" say the F-15c as oppose to the F-15e.

Now granted that there are electrical, plumbing, structural changes that require a great deal of engineering and fabrication, not to mention "purpose driven" avionics changes, in the US that would be handled as an STC, or "supplemental type certificate" accompanied by a few pages of changes in the Dash-1 and the aircraft log book reflecting operating changes, and weight and balance, and a flight test program to make sure you didn't acquire any "bad habits".

These observations are born out by the batch production, as we are able to re-tool for whichever version we need to produce next, as I continue to state= "A Flanker, is a Flanker, is a Flanker", and I have little doubt the Chinese birds are likely built to a more rigid standard. The Mig-29s I have been close to, seemed rather "crude", and the Indians are complaining that the Pak-Fa prototypes are a little rough as well???? so, I love the Chinese Flankers, and I like the J-15 the best of all, they are each going to be very capable aircraft.
 

delft

Brigadier
Static pressure sensors still needs some device that look like a pitot tube to raise them out of boundary layer next to the plane's skin to get a good clean reading.
You can correlate the pattern of a sufficient number of static pressure measurements with the air density, the angle of attack and the speed as measured by conventional instruments as our old friend the pitot tube and so determine speed and angle of attack with those static pressure measurements with the help of a proper computer program. It is the influence of the shape of the aircraft on the flow that makes this possible. As we are only interested in static pressures we can measure at the bottom of the boundary layer. This was clear half a century ago but the necessary computing power was lacking so no-one tried it at the time.
 

A.Man

Major
CCTV is talking about J-16

[video=youtube;A_Pulinl13U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_Pulinl13U[/video]

Transcript in Chinese

主持人 水均益:

  大家晚上好,欢迎您收看新闻频道正在直播的《环球视线》,我是水均益。

  我们首先来把视线锁定一组照片,现在你看到的呢,这些照片是近日国内网站知名军事论坛上,关注度相当高 的,歼-16换装后的真容。与早前出现的1601号原形机相比,这次曝光的1612号歼-16,有着明显的改进之处,值得关注的是,具备三代半战机特征,被称为是现在航空兵的全能战士的歼-16,还入选了世界著名航空专业杂志国际飞行,被评为是2014年度,世界战斗机综合新能第八名。外媒普遍 把歼-16看作是中国版的苏-30,然后歼-16凭借技术上的后发优势,站立直逼最先进的F-15。毫无疑问,中国的歼-16是一个狠角色,那么歼-16究竟有哪些强大的作战性能,如何来解读歼-16特别能挂,特别能看,特别能飞等等这样一些特点,歼-16怎样与歼-20实现高低搭配这样的一个作战模式,今天我们特别请来的是,我们的特约评论专家,也是军事专家杜文龙先生 一起来给我们作一个解读。首先歼-16简单给我们讲一讲,是一个什么类型的飞机?

  专家观点:歼-16是空中进攻全能队员

  特约评论员 杜文龙:

  歼-16是一个战斗轰炸机,或者是歼击轰炸机,东西方叫法不一样,如果按照暗斗轰炸相结合来评估,它就是一个战 场上,或者是未来空中进攻的全能对飞什么都能干,以前我们讲比如说歼击机只能夺取空中优势去摧毁对方的这种 歼击机,人自己的战斗轰炸机、让自己的轰炸机进而更加安全,那么从现在看一个平台只干一件事,投入上,有点 奢侈,如果一个平台既能够对空,又能够对地,又能够对海,就可以把它的综合效益,发挥到最大,对方空中优势 ,我可以去夺取,如果有海上目标,陆上有目标,还可以在出航过程中,进行攻击,所以总的感觉,综合作战性能 有了巨大得越升。

  主持人:

  我们这有一个图版,这个是根据我也给观众朋友介绍了,歼-16是入选了世界战斗机性能综合排名的前十名,你看我们型号里面有F-22,有F-35A、苏-35,然后歼-16,这个入选是不是很难啊,入选的理由是什么呢?

  专家观点:歼-16入选理由是雷达加武器

  杜文龙:

  入选有很多的条件在里边,一般像国外评审,这种所谓的战斗机有很多,比如说火控、机动、武器,代加上可 靠性,但是从我们一般人观察呢,实际上入选最核心的理由,是眼睛加拳头,也就是说雷达加机载武器,这个是最 核心的部分。

  主持人:

  也就是说歼-16真正入选的原因是因为它的雷达?

  杜文龙:

  雷达和机载武器,这个照片上很明显,首先在机头上没有空速管,就是平时我们看的磁刀没了,说明它的雷达 性能绝不一般,他可以把空速管的功能,在雷达之中可以体现出来,所以从这一点看,它的雷达一定是一种新雷达 ,跟以往的雷达不一样。

  主持人:

  这恰恰是我们的后发优势。

  杜文龙:

  的确,如果有这种雷达,按照一般网友的评估叫有源相控阵,如果是这有的话,就具备对多目标的攻击能力, 而且对地面目标,对空中目标,对海面目标可以通过模式的转换,来进行精确的分辨和连续的跟踪。另外你从这个 照片上可以看到,前起落架是双轮,说明重型战斗机,它的载重量决不一般,按照目前它的整个的外 形。

  主持人:

  前起落架是双轱辘。

  杜文龙:

  是双轮,你要是从这个角度看,就是它起飞到着陆过程中,它所承受的重量非常大,就意味着特的最大起飞重 量,和一般的歼击机相比有巨大的上升空间,所以有人计算,如果比照苏-30,它的载弹量应该是八到十吨,所以很多网友在1601那号机上,下面扔了41枚就是250公斤 的炸弹。

  主持人:

  这是一种简单的猜测,还是合理的推测呢?

  杜文龙:

  这应该是一种猜测,你看像下雹子一样,如果一台战斗机要攻击目标,决不会用这种方式去攻击,你比如说它 对远距离目标,防区外目标使用空对地或者是空对海的导弹进行攻击,如果对地面目标进行攻击,它一次不会投掷 这么多,有可能对不同的目标有不同的投掷。

  主持人:

  又不是B-52,用不着弄那么多的炸弹。但是说到这一点,很多的网友军事迷都说,其中有一个特点,刚才我上来也跟大家 念了,就是歼-16有一个特点,特别能挂,也就是说有很多的各种各样的武器,因为他空间比较充裕,我们看到它肚子底下的那 种感觉,也这不是歼-16刚才您也提到了真正的看家本领之一,到底能挂多少武器?

  专家观点:歼-16机载武器型谱齐全

  杜文龙:

  应该从国产战斗机,基本的战斗能力来看,歼-16是到目前为止,各种记载武器型谱最齐全的机种。也就是说呢,他对空对空武器,空对地武器有多种多样,有 人猜测,他至少有像苏-30系列差不多,至少应该有十到十二个挂点,因为这个挂点,严格的说,不是现在有多少,就一定是多少,有的 地方可以加装,你说这个地方有空余,而且从结构强度也够,他可以通过这种挂架,进行重新的安装,另外现在有 很多的武器挂架是复合挂架,别看一个点,这一个点一般只挂一种弹,以前的老挂架,现在一个点这个点上边可以 挂一个,左边右边都有,就是大家看到的是一串,葡萄一样的这种形状,所以从这一点看,他无论是近程的空对空 的格斗弹,中距的拦射弹,再加上空对地的导弹,空对海的导弹,以及对地精确制导的炸弹,都应该是它的选择, 也就是说现在,空军装备的所有这个精确制导的武器,都是它的合理选项。

  主持人:

  其实我们说起来,歼-16它也就是一个三代半,并不是说世界上最先进的战斗机媲美,比如说F-35等等这样的飞机,但是对于我们中国国防建设来讲,很多人说,他实际上是一个重要系列的一个环节,因为考 虑它可以和,比如说歼-20,实现一种作战模式上的一种高低搭配,这方面跟我们解读一下?

  杜文龙:

  如果和歼-20进行高低搭配,它的基本角色就是一个炸弹卡车的角色,你比如说歼-20夺取制空权和制海之后,那个目标就需要有人攻击,就是最重的拳头要打上去,要把对方的空中目标和水中目 标打掉,靠再战能力最强的那个平台,这个平台从目前看,歼-16是一个非常好的角色。刚才我们讲过,十吨到十二吨载弹量,如果对目标进行多个轮次的攻击,就意味着对目 标的毁伤能力会大幅度提高,如果不是一架飞机,是一个完整的战斗编队,比如说有四架、六架甚至 更多的歼-16,在这个时候进行攻击,那么这个所形成的作战能力,十架就是一百吨弹,如果再向上算,一百架是多少吨弹 ,就是从这个能力来看呢,这个他所投掷的这种武器,还决不是没有制导的普通航弹,是具备导引能力的,具备精 确打击能力的防区外武器。

  主持人:

  是不是我们通常所说的老美的那种精确制导。

  杜文龙:

  从炸弹是精确制导炸弹,这个都是范围并不是太远,可能要进入对方的防空火力圈,如果使用空对地导弹,或 者是空对海导弹,那么这个距离,你想近一点的30公里,中一点的50公里,远一点的100多公里,就意味着 可以不进入地方的防空火力圈对目标进行攻击,那么如果有歼-20把对方的东西全部打掉,那就好办了,它就可以密集的使用这种短射程,或者是短投掷距离的武器,发起密集 的饱和性的火力打击。

  主持人:

  从整个歼-16到现在,以后这个代号也变了1601变成1612了,整个它会对我军的空中,以及海上的纵深打击能力, 有一个什么样的助推,他在未来中国军队整个系列里面会扮演一个什么样的角色?

  专家观点:歼-16将成为海空安全卫士

  杜文龙:

  我想他应该是中国海空安全的卫士的角色,因为刚才您讲的1612什么意思的,现在我们也搞不清楚,我们 猜16歼-16,12有可能是第12架飞机。

  主持人:

  会不会是第12版呢?因为是改进型的。

  杜文龙:

  这个版数可能改不了那么多版,如果从1601算起,现在比如说1612可能就是第二架,以后我们看到比 如说1630、1650,可能第30架或者是50架战斗机,所以从这个角度看,今后在中国海空军,他所装备 的这个数量,一定不会太小,有了这种既能对空、又能对海,又能对地的飞机,我们在海空安全方面又多了一个保 护,又多了一个围墙。

  主持人:

  这应该说对于中国国防力量的一个非常大的一个充实。非常感谢杜先生给我们做的一个非常专业和详尽的解读 。我们《环球视线》稍候继续。

《环球视线》 20140225 “全能战士”歼-16 改后曝光引关注

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A.Man, you've been around far long enough to know that you need to give at least a summary in English of an all Chinese article like this.
 
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