09III/09IV (093/094) Nuclear Submarine Thread

[GreenestGDP]

... ...
And the VLS picture you post is a fan CGI, not official, and it is depicting the Navy's shipborne universal VLS (on 052D / 055A)...

It is heavily speculated that 093B or whatever it's called, has VLS, as part of its small dorsal hump, ... ...

NOTE:
My 2 cents observation ... ...
IMHO, ... ...


Using the present Golden Rule of PLA watching:

If PLA is developing the # ( N ) generation weapon system, then ...
PLA will release lots of unofficial pictures and information on the ( N minus 2 ) generation weapon system on Chinese internet.

Meanwhile the opfor pundits will discuss the ( N minus 2 ) generation weapon system as if they are PLA cutting edge weapon systems.

For example:

If one is willing and able to dig through the Chinese internet,
such as (

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

), ...
One will find there are plenty of unofficial pictures and info on 093-G, and
maybe a few 095 sub, because at present, PLA is working on 097 submarine.

I am a PLA fan who is willing to dig, but unable to ... ...





------------------------------------------------------

Actually 093-G is the official designation, not 093-B according to PLAN * 81.

Is G = Gao = High ?? ... ...
or G = Gxxxx ... beside Gao, ... what other Pinyin words are possible ??


To refresh and facilitate our next discussion on 093-G.

Almost 4 years ago, on South China Sea, 093-G, ... ...




Do you think someone PS this picture ??

Does it seem to have a dorsal hump ?

 

[Blitzo]

NOTE:
My 2 cents observation ... ...
IMHO, ... ...


Using the present Golden Rule of PLA watching:

If PLA is developing the # ( N ) generation weapon system, then ...
PLA will release lots of unofficial pictures and information on the ( N minus 2 ) generation weapon system on Chinese internet.

Meanwhile the opfor pundits will discuss the ( N minus 2 ) generation weapon system as if they are PLA cutting edge weapon systems.

For example:

If one is willing and able to dig through the Chinese internet,
such as (

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

), ...
One will find there are plenty of unofficial pictures and info on 093-G, and
maybe a few 095 sub, because at present, PLA is working on 097 submarine.

I am a PLA fan who is willing to dig, but unable to ... ...


View attachment 21051


------------------------------------------------------

Actually 093-G is the official designation, not 093-B according to PLAN * 81.

Is G = Gao = High ?? ... ...
or G = Gxxxx ... beside Gao, ... what other Pinyin words are possible ??


To refresh and facilitate our next discussion on 093-G.

Almost 4 years ago, on South China Sea, 093-G, ... ...

View attachment 21049


Do you think someone PS this picture ??

Does it seem to have a dorsal hump ?

I am well aware of the trends in PLA watching, and sometimes fan pictures may come close to what the real thing may look like.
But in this case, I am just pointing out that the picture of the VLS in question is fan produced and not official, and we do not know if the weapons they depict are/or will be integrated into the actual universal VLS.

The designation of the 093 with the hump is also still somewhat in the air; it has been called both 093B and 093G. There is no consensus yet.

The picture of the submarine you've posted is an 039 song I believe. It obviously is not an 093, and it does not have a hump.

At present we have had no clear pictures of the new 093s with humps.

 

[GreenestGDP]

... ...
The picture of the submarine you've posted is an 039 song I believe. It obviously is not an 093, and it does not have a hump.

At present we have had no clear pictures of the new 093s with humps.

LoL ... ...

What did cause you to state that the picture on my previous post definitely is not 093-A or 093-G, and in fact could be 039 Song ?

What are the tell--tale signs ?

 

[Jeff Head]

What did cause you to state that the picture on my previous post definitely is not 093-A or 093-G, and in fact could be 039 Song ?

What are the tell--tale signs ?

Let me count the ways.

The shape of the bow.

The shape of the sail.

The distance between the sail and the bow.

The location of the dive planes.

The extension on the back of the sail.

These are all very obvious things.

Green...you really need to do a LOT more learning about PLAN vessels and equipment before you post the kinds of clear mistakes like the ones above. Or...ask other posters before doing so.

But when you post things like that...particularly in the manner you did seeming to try and correct a long term poster here...well, it just comes off badly for you.

Here are clear pictures of the Song class and the Type 093.

Song SSK (Type 039)





Type 093 SSN

 

[GreenestGDP]

... ...
Green...you really need to do a LOT more learning about PLAN vessels and equipment before you post the kinds of clear mistakes like the ones above. Or...ask other posters before doing so.

But when you post things like that...particularly in the manner you did seeming to try and correct a long term poster here...well, it just comes off badly for you.... ...

Jeff,

1):
Many thanks for the feedback.
Firstly, in addition to my writing style, ... ...
I think there were clear misunderstandings on your part.

*** I am definitely -- NOT attempting to show Blitzo up.
It has always been my intention to learn from Blitzo.

And in the future, I shall improve the wording that I use.

If you notice, ... I generally preface my post with this note ... ...

NOTE:
My 2 cents observation ... ...
IMHO, ... ...

or I am no expert ...

Which I should have done on my post # 473.


2):
Secondly, ... ...
It was always my original intention to learn from Blitzo and
other knowledgeable posters by posting this below ... ...

... ...
What did cause you to state that the picture on my previous post definitely is not 093-A or 093-G, and in fact could be 039 Song ?

What are the tell--tale signs ?

Hopefully, Blitzo is NOT offended by any of my posting.
Blitzo if you did get offended, then I sincerely apologize to you.


3):
Many thanks for enlightening me and postings
the 4 pictures of 039A and 093 subs.

After reading your post, I did a crash course to improve my basic knowledge on these 2 type of subs.


After studying your pictures and those other pictures that I googled on the net,
I start to notice the differences between 039A and 093 subs and 093G sub.
But, I am definitely not an expert.
Far from it, and in the future being human, ...
I will probably make a similar mistake again by
not using the proper wording on my post.

Because of the crash course above, ... ...
Look what I found ... ...

 

[GreenestGDP]

Between these 2 diagram below ... ...


Diagram #1





Diagram #2





Comprehensively, ... ...
Does anyone know what are the significant differences between
Ducted Propulsion system on diagram #1 versus diagram #2 ??

Especially, in terms of noise suppression and under water top speed ?

 

[danielchin]

Actually 093-G is the official designation, not 093-B according to PLAN * 81.

Is G = Gao = High ?? ... ...
or G = Gxxxx ... beside Gao, ... what other Pinyin words are possible ??

actually G = Gai (modified)

 

[kwaigonegin]

Between these 2 diagram below ... ...

Comprehensively, ... ...
Does anyone know what are the significant differences between
Ducted Propulsion system on diagram #1 versus diagram #2 ??

Especially, in terms of noise suppression and under water top speed ?

The technical term is shrouded propulsor. There are pros and cons to either one depending on the usage. Generally speaking shrouded props are better for low speed littoroal type duties while open propulsor are better for high speed. Generally speaking the shroud dampens shock wave propagation, reduce cavitation at certain speeds and also creates pressure on the flow of water into the screws if the opening is wider on the front. Sort of like a tunnel effect.
It also offers some protection from debris as well.

There are tons of research papers on the pros and cons online.

The one I'm interested in is rim driven propulsor. There are many advantages to it however the engineering is much more complicated especially on a sub.

 

[Blitzo]

Jeff,

1):
Many thanks for the feedback.
Firstly, in addition to my writing style, ... ...
I think there were clear misunderstandings on your part.

*** I am definitely -- NOT attempting to show Blitzo up.
It has always been my intention to learn from Blitzo.

And in the future, I shall improve the wording that I use.

If you notice, ... I generally preface my post with this note ... ...




Which I should have done on my post # 473.


2):
Secondly, ... ...
It was always my original intention to learn from Blitzo and
other knowledgeable posters by posting this below ... ...



Hopefully, Blitzo is NOT offended by any of my posting.
Blitzo if you did get offended, then I sincerely apologize to you.

Of course, no offence taken at all.

It's probably just worth knowing what are fan pictures and which (if any) may be reflective of actual developments that may be occurring.

Specifically, at present, we do not know what 095 will look like, and the only photos we have of 093B/093G are very blurred ones over the last few years, posted here:

https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/pl...ar-submarine-thread.t6883/page-46#post-367832

 

[mr.bean]

Between these 2 diagram below ... ...


Diagram #1

View attachment 21066



Diagram #2

View attachment 21067



Comprehensively, ... ...
Does anyone know what are the significant differences between
Ducted Propulsion system on diagram #1 versus diagram #2 ??

Especially, in terms of noise suppression and under water top speed ?

These two pictures may or may not resemble the next generation Chinese submarines, but damn they do look nice!