09III/09IV (093/094) Nuclear Submarine Thread

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
Ha just because you dont understand doesn't mean it doesn't exist, remember last time you said china dont have shaft-less pumpjet?View attachment 44106
I'm not sure what the fact that SQUID is NOT being deployed by China in the SCS has ANYTHING to do with rim drive. It sounds like having lost the current argument, you are trying to divert the conversation into something you think you can actually win. I'm glad you realize your current claims about SQUID being deployed are totally groundless with no merit of any kind. As for rim drive, it is widely believed (and not just by me) that rim drive is unlikely to be on the upcoming generation of SSN/SSBN, or at the very least that there is currently no evidence for it. This was an error perpetuated by various people with shabby standards who mistakenly believed that in that particular video where Admiral Ma was showing off his new wares, he somehow stated that rim drive would be on the new subs. He said no such thing. You posting a video still from a CCTV source (as if many or even most Chinese TV sources have any kind of authority or credibility in these matters) does nothing to change the situation, unfortunately for you. :)
 

azesus

Junior Member
Registered Member
CCTV is China's official bureaucratic news network so it's like they are telling you they have it without showing to you, I just brought it up to show you have a past record of being wrong about your claims that you dont understand at least I cite something and you 're just talking about nothing and have to straw man twisting my words
 

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
CCTV is China's official bureaucratic news network so it's like they are telling you they have it without showing to you, I just brought it up to show you have a past record of being wrong about your claims that you dont understand at least I cite something and you 're just talking about nothing and have to straw man twisting my words
Your ability to understand the nuances of an argument seems to be rather limited. I and others have said that Admiral Ma did not predict or claim that rim drive would be on China's upcoming generation of nuke subs. This fact is literally UNASSAILABLE and remains true regardless of the type of propulsion that actually ends up on the 095 and 096. There is currently no evidence that rim drive is on or going to be on Chinese SSNs. Chinese TV, yes even state TV, is notorious for being inaccurate on the details of Chinese military technology.

None of this does anything to change the fact that you made a false claim about SQUID being deployed by China in the SCS.
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
Just becaue the video does not record Ma saying that China has rim driven propeller does not mean that it does not exist!
Video can be edited out
He did point out to the shrouded propeller next to him Then couple week latter they tested a permanent magnet motor on the submarine. Generally it is conventional type motor with permanent magnet on the rotor side but it could possibly be on the stator side. The news does not spell it out

As to the SQUID here the report they definitely experiment with it and it is so sensitive that they remove the report the next day after it was associated with anti submarine program in SCS.But the scientific paper is still available
It is no vapor ware and has solid physics foundation as attested by the british scientist
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China’s quantum submarine detector could seal South China Sea
b6kdhy.jpg

Tailed by a SQUID
Snaprender/Alamy Stock Photo

By David Hambling

On 21 June, the
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– a major upgrade to a kind of quantum device that measures magnetic fields. The announcement vanished after a journalist pointed out the invention’s
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: it could help China lock down the South China Sea.


“I was surprised by the removal,” says Stephen Chen of the South China Morning Post, who raised the issue. “I have been covering Chinese science for many years, and it is rare.”

Magnetometers have been used to detect submarines since the second world war. They are able to do this because they can measure an anomaly in Earth’s magnetic field – like one caused by a massive hunk of metal.

But today’s devices can only detect a submarine at fairly short range, so tend to be used to home in on the location once the sub has already been spotted on sonar.

Superconducting fix
You could widen their range if you had a magnetometer based on a superconducting quantum interference device, or SQUID. Superconducting magnetometers are exquisitely sensitive, but their promise has been limited to the lab. Out in the real world, they are quickly overwhelmed by background noise as minuscule as changes in Earth’s magnetic field caused by distant solar storms.

Given that level of sensitivity, you can forget about mounting such a sensor on an airplane, for example. The US Navy gave up work on superconducting magnetometers to pursue less sensitive but more mature technologies.

Learn more about quantum theory:
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The new magnetometer, built by Xiaoming Xie and colleagues at the
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, uses not one SQUID but an array of them. The idea is that by comparing their readings, researchers can cancel out some of the extra artefacts generated by motion. This “would be relevant to an anti-submarine warfare device”, says
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, who works on magnetic sensors.

Although the announcement concerning Xie’s work has been removed, several of the
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culminating in this breakthrough
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.

The achievement points to an airborne device that can detect submarines from several kilometres away rather than just a few hundred metres. This would be catastrophic for NATO submarines, which have been honed to run ever more quietly, using clever technology that prevents them from being heard or detected on sonar. Their magnetic signature is much harder to eliminate.

Noise problem
Could China soon have the most sensitive submarine detector in the world? No Western navies are known to have SQUID detectors.

Researchers estimate that a SQUID magnetometer of this type could detect a sub from 6 kilometres away, and Caplin says that with better noise suppression the range could be much greater.

Not everyone is convinced the Chinese magnetometer is ready for deployment. Cathy Foley at CSIRO, the Australian government research agency, says there are several difficulties with turning a SQUID into a sub-hunter – for example dealing with background magnetic noise. Nobody has yet solved all of these problems, although she says the rate of Chinese progress means they may well be first to succeed.

SQUIDs are only one of the ways that China has been upgrading its
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over the last few years. The
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, a string of submerged sensors, buoys and drone submarines, is thought to be close to completion. The project will help China extend its offshore surveillance zone.


Beijing has long wanted to change the rules of engagement in its waters. Earlier this year it
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requiring any foreign submarine to get approval before entering Chinese waters, and once there, to stay surfaced and display its national flag. “Can the Chinese make these systems work reliably while in motion in the air or underwater? We’ll be watching their progress closely,” says Foley.
 

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
Just becaue the video does not record Ma saying that China has rim driven propeller does not mean that it does not exist!
Video can be edited out
He did point out to the shrouded propeller next to him Then couple week latter they tested a permanent magnet motor on the submarine. Generally it is conventional type motor with permanent magnet on the rotor side but it could possibly be on the stator side. The news does not spell it out

As to the SQUID here the report they definitely experiment with it and it is so sensitive that they remove the report the next day after it was associated with anti submarine program in SCS.But the scientific paper is still available
It is no vapor ware and has solid physics foundation as attested by the british scientist
There is no ambiguity in the video. He did NOT mention anything about any rim drive in any Chinese sub.

As for the SQUID I have already said this could become a gamechanger for the PLAN. However, as I already said multiple times, it is in fact NOT being deployed in the SCS. That wall of text you posted does nothing to change this fact.
 

azesus

Junior Member
Registered Member
Dude read the both eng/chi subtitle in the picture I posted it said shaft less rim drive thats why I post it, I didn't make any argument I just post a picture and let the picture do the talking and you cant even understand that and conversely accusing me false argument? I didn't say nothing man, China is developing and perfecting SQUID right at time moment while you're wasting time keyboard warmongering
 

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
Dude read the both eng/chi subtitle in the picture I posted it said shaft less rim drive thats why I post it, I didn't make any argument I just post a picture and let the picture do the talking and you cant even understand that and conversely accusing me false argument? I didn't say nothing man, China is developing and perfecting SQUID right at time moment while you're wasting time keyboard warmongering
Yes I read the captions and I'm saying CCTV is not the gold standard of Chinese military news. Also, you didn't say "nothing", and you certainly didn't say China is "developing and perfecting" SQUID. What you actually said was:
View attachment 44100
China are fielding SQUID in the south china sea
Which is clearly a false argument, because China is in fact NOT "fielding" SQUID in the SCS.
 

azesus

Junior Member
Registered Member
How about ongoing fielding and perfecting jog with two little steps is china's culture way of doing things, its not black or white exclusive relations but hybrid grey fuzzy logic
 

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
How about ongoing fielding and perfecting jog with two little steps is china's culture way of doing things, its not black or white exclusive relations but hybrid grey fuzzy logic
Do you have any evidence that China is "ongoing fielding and perfecting jog with two little steps" in regards to SQUID, whatever you mean by that barely comprehensible statement? Of course you don't. You tried to falsely claim that China is fielding this immature system and hoping or assuming that I wouldn't call you out on it, but of course I was going to. And now you're trying so hard to walk back your false claim. Time to man up or go away.
 

azesus

Junior Member
Registered Member
Do you have evidence China "IS NOT" fielding SQUID? Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Jog with two little steps is Chinese way of saying helix spiral development. SQUID is not applicable on open ocean but perfect for choke point like SCS, undersea greatwall. We can both agree I will be doing the man up and you can do the go away
 
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