Military situation in the sino-indian border

Yesterday at 8:39 PM

Jura said:

42 minutes ago

actually this one is going to be last:

one: I assume the disputed area is "the Doklam area near the Bhutan tri-junction" (quote is from

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I saw posted in previous page here), which I assume is

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which I approximately marked above

two: I assume

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is shown in purple in the map in the bottom of
Jigme Khesar Strict Nature Reserve

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officially looking webpage:

three:
using the map from #2, I approximately marked in red the town of Yadong, and the road to the interior of China, and in green the China-India border:

it should be obvious the tri-junction IS in that Nature Reserve

Click to expand...

later I realized there was one thing I should know:

where is the China/Sikkim/Bhutan tri-junction ACCORDING TO THE CHINESE CLAIM please?

it's approximately at
27° 19' 38" N; 88° 55' 17" E
according to google:

plawolf said:

China doesn't want to be the ones to fire the first shot, and that does limit is options.

Currently I think China is playing for time as it has more important matters to deal with regarding Korea and the G20.

Firstly, it does not want to have to deploy resources to the Indian boarder when it might need them in Korea if Trump does anything stupid.

The Indians are no match for China militarily, but China cannot afford to take them lightly either.

A boarder war with India will require the PLA to deploy not insignificant proportions of its Air Force and air defence assets to ensure victory.

Secondly and more importantly, as a principle, China does not believe in going to war half heartedly.

Unlike some countries, shooting off some cruise missiles is not considered an effective or appropriate military response.

When it comes to direct military engagements, the general trend the PLA has set is they either go big or they don't bother.

China has a well documented history of showing extreme patience and restraint in not using military force when it might have a valid excuse to do so. But if someone is stupid enough to push China into taking military action, they PLA tend to ensure its response is harsh enough to not be forgotten in a hurry.

It was over 50 years since China had to last teach this lesson to India.

I am sure China does not wish to have to give another lesson just yet. However, it also knows that what India has done so far does not yet warrant the kind of military response it feels is worthwhile to endure the inevitable western biased condemnations for.

So it bids its time by only issuing protests, while waiting for either the Indians to ultimately back down, or cross a line not even the biased western media can spin to heap all the blame on China, at which point China will act swiftly and decisively, as it did in 62.

Click to expand...

China's poor PR campaign capabilities sure hurt its image and it is difficult for China to project its side of the story. China should definitely pour more money and resources into developing its PR caabilities at international forums. Right now, whenever i see a debate or some arguments on television \,the person representing the Chinese side simply doesn't have the Charisma/fluency/charm etc to properly state the views of the Chinese side. Simply stating and sticking to facts alone is not enough, there has to be some sort of cheerful openness and charm. I just can't pinpoint it, but they usually come off as clumsy.

Yodello said:

China's poor PR campaign capabilities sure hurt its image and it is difficult for China to project its side of the story. China should definitely pour more money and resources into developing its PR caabilities at international forums. Right now, whenever i see a debate or some arguments on television \,the person representing the Chinese side simply doesn't have the Charisma/fluency/charm etc to properly state the views of the Chinese side. Simply stating and sticking to facts alone is not enough, there has to be some sort of cheerful openness and charm. I just can't pinpoint it, but they usually come off as clumsy.

Click to expand...

I know right? I mean seriously, people on this forum can defend China better in the Western media than China's own ministers. Its almost as if they are hiring bad PR people on purpose.

OT
Re the discussion over the last few pages:
China wants a railway connection to Egypt eventually. When Israel belatedly decided that it wanted a modern rail system using standard gauge it went to the most competent rail builders in the World - their Chinese friends. China is greatly involved in the Israeli railway system. Also Netanyahu goes to Beijing about as often as he goes to Washington and nearly as often as he goes to Moscow.
China is not going to sacrifice its relations to Israel because of Israeli relations to India.

sanblvd said:

I know right? I mean seriously, people on this forum can defend China better in the Western media than China's own ministers. Its almost as if they are hiring bad PR people on purpose.

Click to expand...

They should stop the government apparatchiks from giving interviews and going to forums. PRC government needs to hire private PR firms to provides good ads and also train the official representatives. It's as if bad PR has become synonymous with the PRC government

China insiders are coming to realization israel is no friend, it secretly engaging in Washington's China containmentbgame underneath. it supply alot weaponries to India that's direct detrimental to China. For example,
The 8000 anti tank missiles Israel supplied to India are targeting specifically against Chinese New tanks at Tibet. It poses significant threat.

The comment I clipped out is not just one Israel viewpoint, it represents the typical and representative of Israel conservative viewpoints.

On economic front, it try to close tie with China .

Just like majority of those countries, south Korea, Singapore, Australia economically engaging with China but politically hedging with US.

I am not a bit surprise if all the military Israel group are anti China. Again, I am talking about the Israel conservative group.

Returning the favor, I think China would supply whatever Iran needed to combat Israel.

tidalwave said:

Just like majority of those countries, south Korea, Singapore, Australia economically engaging with China but politically hedging with US.

Click to expand...

South Korea doesn't has a choice. It isn't an independent country. As for the others: their elites have been treated by US at least from their student time and it is difficult to change the habit of a life time but you see the tide turning.

it's actually an interesting topic, I'm going to follow it

as I expected, my question from
Today at 6:19 AM

Jura said:

Yesterday at 8:39 PM

later I realized there was one thing I should know:

where is the China/Sikkim/Bhutan tri-junction ACCORDING TO THE CHINESE CLAIM please?

it's approximately at
27° 19' 38" N; 88° 55' 17" E
according to google:

Click to expand...

got ignored; now I spent my lunch break looking for an answer ...

first the situation according to google map (LOL if you didn't believe even that, you should perhaps quit reading at this point):


borders highlighted in red; the direction to Chinese interior shown; the trijunction; the mountain; the river

... now, using the same view as above, and reportedly the Chinese claim:

(I found it through wiki inside
EXCLUSIVE: China releases new map showing territorial claims at stand-off site

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and checked through images.google.com it's all over Internet, so be sure to tell me if you thought it's a fake: I expect nobody will tell me anything so I'll assume this is some official Chinese map)

... I drew the "new" lines, of course approximately:


for the "new" tri-junction to be at

(which is the answer to my question EDIT Today at 6:19 AM "where is the China/Sikkim/Bhutan tri-junction ACCORDING TO THE CHINESE CLAIM please?")

it would require not only China-Bhutan "new" border (in purple in the map above), but also
"new" India-Bhutan border (in yellow in the map above), with Bhutan forfeiting in both cases, plus
it's obvious this area is in
Jigme Khesar Strict Nature Reserve

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it's ... hard to fathom

***
new question now:
where does the road being built by China in the above area would end please?

tidalwave said:

China insiders are coming to realization israel is no friend, it secretly engaging in Washington's China containmentbgame underneath. it supply alot weaponries to India that's direct detrimental to China. For example,
The 8000 anti tank missiles Israel supplied to India are targeting specifically against Chinese New tanks at Tibet. It poses significant threat.

The comment I clipped out is not just one Israel viewpoint, it represents the typical and representative of Israel conservative viewpoints.

On economic front, it try to close tie with China .

Just like majority of those countries, south Korea, Singapore, Australia economically engaging with China but politically hedging with US.

I am not a bit surprise if all the military Israel group are anti China. Again, I am talking about the Israel conservative group.

Returning the favor, I think China would supply whatever Iran needed to combat Israel.

Click to expand...

Lets put it this way, this is not an Israel issue, this is a Western issue, all Western nations oppose China to some extend, China in their eye is not a legitimate government because its officially communist.

Unofficially and unspokenly there is also the race issues, for better or worse, we are living in a world order that has been created and dominated by Caucasian people, and the thought that an actual independent Asian power not under their control is going to challenge them chills them to the bones.

Every action that China take will be magnified to a unfair degree, this is especially true for the negative ones, but on the other hand, the Western nations have no capability to fight as they had fought 100 years ago, over time they lost their fighting spirit, got soft and political correct, they are a race that is dying from within as their birth rate declines, as a result they don't have the guts to challenge China head-on, that is why they reluctantly have to cooperate and trade with China, but deep inside they feel strong sense of revoltion so that's why they are always doing little things like criticize China on human rights, support all of China's enemy covertly, but never has the guts to actually attack China.

With this being said, China understands exactly what I'm talking about and they are taking it in strides by not overreacting to every single provocation that the West makes, because if they do that it will only play it into their hand so they can paint China in a negative light as they easily can. That is why China is very wisely absorbed many tiny insult and not hitting back, instead China spend its energy into much more important battle for its own national interest such as economy, building up alliance with other races of 3rd world nation, building up a strong military capability etc...

If China do what you said by openly support Iran, trust me, in the end it will hurt China a lot more than it will benefit China.

A Phoenix TV interview about Indian-China border issue. For those speak Chinese only.