Littoral Combat Ships (LCS)

Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
dtulsa said:
Ok to me I'm confused they want LCS then they don't want LCS and if I were a sailor I really woul dnt like the idea of my assigned ship being refferd to as A "missile" sponge not a real secure feeling there as far as extending service life is HOW and why when they aren't even deployed yet and perhaps Jeff or someone else can answer the effects of say saltwater in aluminum as I have no idea what they are except both LCS has extensive aluminum superstructers and hulls
Click to expand...
Aluminum can be treated and work fie in a Slat Water/Ocean environment.

The biggest issue with Aluminum is that when the high temps of a missile hit get going, they will melt the superstructure and other areas faster.

now, they can treat it to help this...but the US learned by sad experience to build ships out of steel because of this.

That is another reason why the LCS were not considered very good for high risk warfare situations.

NOw, they have tried to mitigate that with adding armor in certain places, treating the material, and cutting fown on the RCS...as well as giiving them that speed.

But in the end...a fighting ship HAS to be able to take a hit or two and keep fighting.

I expect the uparmed LCS will work okay for many duties...but we still need warfighting frigates...and I hope they stay on track to provide them/
 
D

dtulsa

Junior Member
Jeff Head said:
Aluminum can be treated and work fie in a Slat Water/Ocean environment.

The biggest issue with Aluminum is that when the high temps of a missile hit get going, they will melt the superstructure and other areas faster.

now, they can treat it to help this...but the US learned by sad experience to build ships out of steel because of this.

That is another reason why the LCS were not considered very good for high risk warfare situations.

NOw, they have tried to mitigate that with adding armor in certain places, treating the material, and cutting fown on the RCS...as well as giiving them that speed.

But in the end...a fighting ship HAS to be able to take a hit or two and keep fighting.

I expect the uparmed LCS will work okay for many duties...but we still need warfighting frigates...and I hope they stay on track to provide them/
Click to expand...
Like you said Jeff I'm no fan of using aluminum in any warship just a crazy idea all the way around bothers me a great deal the navy is talking like this let a line even talking about it
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
dtulsa said:
Like you said Jeff I'm no fan of using aluminum in any warship just a crazy idea all the way around bothers me a great deal the navy is talking like this let a line even talking about it
Click to expand...
Well, that's why I have always felt that the Freedom is best suited for stronger escort and warfighting duties becuase it is a steel ship.

The Independence can do a lot of things...and uparmed they will be good. Use them with the PhibRons to escort and do anti-mine duties.

Let the Freedom class go out with the carriers.

Anyhow, Freedom uses Steel...Indpendence is aluminum.
 
D

dtulsa

Junior Member
Jeff Head said:
Well, that's why I have always felt that the Freedom is best suited for stronger escort and warfighting duties becuase it is a steel ship.

The Independence can do a lot of things...and uparmed they will be good. Use them with the PhibRons to escort and do anti-mine duties.

Let the Freedom class go out with the carriers.

Anyhow, Freedom uses Steel...Indpendence is aluminum.
Click to expand...
I also tend to think the Indy class would be well suited to the carribean mission such as drug watch rescue etc certainly the helo capability would be a welcome site for stranded boaters and unwelcome for the carribean drug cartels
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
dtulsa said:
I also tend to think the Indy class would be well suited to the carribean mission such as drug watch rescue etc certainly the helo capability would be a welcome site for stranded boaters and unwelcome for the carribean drug cartels
Click to expand...
Use the Coast Guiard and its Legend and the new class of 12 or 12 they will be building to do that.

IMHO, they should still use the Independence for military operations.

with a good ASM, with better local AAW coverage and some additional armor, they could do the Counter-mine role, they could do ASW missions, and they could go along to help with the ARGs and Phibrons.

I do not think they would be suited for CSG escort duties or high tempo or more dangerous SAG patrols...like into the SCS.

Let the new Frigates and the up gunned Independence class do that stuff.

Just the same, 18 or so Independence class can relieve the other vessels of a lot of the necessary lower tempo military duties that need to still be done.

I hope they DO NOT choose the Austal ships for the FFG. They build aluminum ships...thats what they do...and they do a good job of it.

But a warfighting FFG should not be aluminum.

So either use the Freedom ship hull or the Legend ship hull for that multi-role FFG.
 
Jura The idiot

Jura The idiot

General
according to a link inside Jul 12, 2017

Response Date:
Aug 24, 2017

for RFI of FFG(X) which is like one week from now, so I now read again my snap armchair-admiraling Jul 12, 2017
Jura said:
Today at 1:14 PM


but later noticed in Internet several analyses/"analyses" emerged, so without reading them now, I'll just repeat the politically-correct points from the Facebook discussion with 'dtulsa' here (LOL thanks man):

first of all
"The U.S. Navy's requirement is for 52 small-surface combatants, the bulk of which will be LCS." (the quotes here come from either article I linked above Today at 1:14 PM)
which means they'll keep building the LCS PORK Jul 1, 2017

also most important:
"We want this to be part of the high/low mix."
the first time I've heard this from USN (until now everything, including dysfunctional LCSs, was "front end")

then, there's a puzzling radar part:
"So on this ship we are looking at something more like a three-by-three, so four six-foot-by-six foot arrays."

[one of the requirements]: Enterprise Air Surveillance Radar (EASR) 3 face fixed array (3x3x3
Radar Modular Assembly)

why puzzling? because "Concepts of employment for this type of ship will include integrated operations with area air defense capable destroyers and cruisers as well as independent operations while connected and contributing to the fleet tactical grid."

it's related to the really vague part
Self Defense Launcher Capability


finally the USN appears to have dropped the nonsensical 'saving over the lifetime by reduced manning' claim:
"200 personnel crew max" between "Key FFG(X) Threshold Attributes"
but who knows

finally the USN appears to have dropped the excessive speed (good just for fanbois) requirement:
"28 kts at 80% MCR" between "Key FFG(X) Threshold Attributes"

the range should enable to sail between Hawaii and California without refueling, something an LCS couldn't Apr 29, 2015
Click to expand...
I later read several additional articles, discussions below them, but, to my surprise, I haven't seen this point noticed:

"We want this to be part of the high/low mix."
the first time I've heard this from USN (until now everything, including dysfunctional LCSs, was "front end")
Click to expand...
(its context is of course the above post)

I can't imagine how this point would fit into the other requirements like putting a fancy "rotating tiny Aegis" on:
EASR%2BRotating.jpg

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

(it's the point "Enterprise Air Surveillance Radar (EASR) 3 face fixed array (3x3x3
Radar Modular Assembly)" from the RIF)

OK why don't I just wait :)
 
Jura The idiot

Jura The idiot

General
Jan 9, 2017
Jura said:
Q: What’s in the near future for LCS? Is that the only deployment scheduled for 2017?

A: That is correct.

Q: You don’t have another LCS deployment scheduled for 2017?

A: No, I don’t think so.

says who?! Vice Admiral Thomas S. Rowden
Commander Naval Surface Force
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


in January 8, 2017 Interview: Vice Adm. Tom Rowden, Commander, US Naval Forces
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
Click to expand...
and here's an update (
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
):

"On the future deployments to two LCS slated for 2018 and as to whether both ships would arrive in Singapore simultaneously or separately, Gabrielson said the specific arrival dates were still being planned and worked on."

what a "formidable" "force" of revolutionary transformational quantum leaps!
 
D

dtulsa

Junior Member
Fyi per USNI news the scheduled test of the NSM for Freedom has been cancelled due to lack of funds as of right now the only missile to be carried is the Harpoon 1c do not know if NSM will ever be tried on LCS or if the Harpoon is the chosen system seems as though the navy doesn't either
 
Jura The idiot

Jura The idiot

General
dtulsa said:
Fyi per USNI news the scheduled test of the NSM for Freedom has been cancelled due to lack of funds as of right now the only missile to be carried is the Harpoon 1c do not know if NSM will ever be tried on LCS or if the Harpoon is the chosen system seems as though the navy doesn't either
Click to expand...
do you have anything newer on it than
No Funds Available for Naval Strike Missile Test on USS Freedom, Demo Stalled
Updated: September 1, 2016 3:04 PM
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


?
 
D

dtulsa

Junior Member
Yes it was quoted in the latest test firing article from the Indepence of the Harpoon frankly if the Harpoon works as advertised that would be a good system in and around the Pacific islands where range isn't such a great concern due to land masses
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top