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Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
Another article by GT expanding on unusual commissioning of 3 ships simultaneously. Dalian will go to South China theatre while Nanchang and Lhasa go to Beiyang fleet so 3 type 55 is in service now
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Unprecedented commissioning

Friday's commissioning of warships is unprecedented in many aspects, as it is the first time the PLA Navy has received three different types of large vessels on one day. This is also not seen in other countries, observers said.

This reflects the rapid development of the PLA Navy as well as the Chinese shipbuilding industry, as the two become world class, experts said, noting that China can develop, construct and harness these advanced vessels in a very short time, showing "Chinese speed."

It is also the first time the PLA South Sea Fleet has received three large surface and underwater main battle equipment on the same day, which highlights China's determination to manage the South China Sea, analysts said.

Under the current complex international situation, China attaches great importance to the construction of the South China Sea; the deployment of the new sea craft further strengthens the PLA's ability to safeguard national territory and territorial sea sovereignty, experts sa
id.

Song said that China is facing grave military struggle pressure, and needs large warships to build a stronger navy.

These vessels will play important roles in solving questions in places like the island of Taiwan and the South China Sea, Song said.
 

Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
Registered Member
Btw can someone explain why Xi was wearing just a simple a shirt during a ceremony. I dont know why but everytime I see him in this video it triggers me.

Shouldnt he have a uniform or a suit or something else more "official looking". Like the guy is the chairman of the CMC, he should be wearing a uniform or something else.

IMO he looks unprofessional
Jesus crikey, I normally agree with most of your posts as I find them to be well researched but I have to disagree with you on this one. Pres. Xi, can da..n wear whatever he likes and finds comfortable since he like all of his fellow CPC officials are always dressed professionally and represent their various positions with poise, grace, and dignity unlike their western counterparts that seem to care and focus more on appearance rather than on any actual substance.

I would have hated the idea of Pres.Xi or any other Chinese leaders emulate the western leaders penchant for dressing the part for the sake of appearance sake ala Bush Jr. during his infamous landing of the plane aboard a U.S. aircraft carrier disastrously proclaiming the War In Iraq as "Mission Accomplished." And they had another megalomaniac leader in DJT not only dressing himself as the ultimate Alpha but also capriciously extolling his military expertise better than his own general officers calling himself a stable genius lol...The thing you may find cringy in some aspects of Pres. Xi like his simplicity in public attire is exactly why he's the right man for the job and why he's hated by the west due to his seemingly incorruptible nature (based on the leaked C.I.A. cables from wikileaks)
 

Tiberium

Junior Member
Registered Member
Btw can someone explain why Xi was wearing just a simple a shirt during a ceremony. I dont know why but everytime I see him in this video it triggers me.

Shouldnt he have a uniform or a suit or something else more "official looking". Like the guy is the chairman of the CMC, he should be wearing a uniform or something else.

IMO he looks unprofessional
What he wears is called 陆军夏常服, army summer service uniform, not some casual shirt.
He wears it without any rank or decoration, which means he is a civil leader not military personnel.
 

Tyler

Captain
Registered Member
Well a few years ago I was saying China could build two destroyers per year for 30 years, ending up with a 60 destroyer fleet with AESA radars. but I got scoffed as chest pumping. Look at where we are now. Give another two years it'll be close to 40 052C+052D+055, total destroyer number around 50. Surely in the next 20 years those old ones will be replaced plus some new ones joining, which makes 60 a number easy to reach.
Is there any indication that they are building more type 052 and type 055 in the shipyards right now?
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
So much surface warship development. What's PLAN doing about its relative weakness below the surface? Anti-sub may have improved a lot and caught up if not surpassed but can they ensure any decent safety against the hordes of USN subs? They must be feeling pretty damn confident with PLAN's current anti-sub warfare but maybe this area doesn't get any attention or leaks from the authorities for a reason. Once you can detect subs with certainty and effectiveness, they are basically sitting ducks. In this respect, it is only a question of technology. The rest of the problem is securing airspace for anti-sub aircraft to release their ordinance. Could that be why China seems to consider air domain to be more important?

China's own sub fleet is a threat to the USN surface vessels more than they are to USN subs. It may not need the same level and numbers of submarines (though that's certainly useful for A2AD) to be totally capable of removing the USN submarine threat. It just seems while plenty of things are leaked and even very publicly shown and talked about, anti-sub insight is limited to just a few special mission aircraft and whispers of revolutionary detection tech. Anyway it's certainly true that if PLAN possess one or some new and effective anti-sub capabilities, it's only a matter of contesting and fighting for airspace - which explain spamming Type 055s and weapons dedicated to taking carriers.
 
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voyager1

Captain
Registered Member
So much surface warship development. What's PLAN doing about its relative weakness below the surface? Anti-sub may have improved a lot and caught up if not surpassed but can they ensure any decent safety against the hordes of USN subs? They must be feeling pretty damn confident with PLAN's current anti-sub warfare but maybe this area doesn't get any attention or leaks from the authorities for a reason. Once you can detect subs with certainty and effectiveness, they are basically sitting ducks. In this respect, it is only a question of technology. The rest of the problem is securing airspace for anti-sub aircraft to release their ordinance. Could that be why China seems to consider air domain to be more important?
I am also worried about their submarine construction rate and their capabilities. It seems to me that they have dropped the ball there relatively to the surface program.

The massive new sub construction base is a good step but its not enough. It has already be so many years and we have yet to see any dramatic increase in submarines being launched
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
I am also worried about their submarine construction rate and their capabilities. It seems to me that they have dropped the ball there relatively to the surface program.

The massive new sub construction base is a good step but its not enough. It has already be so many years and we have yet to see any dramatic increase in submarines being launched

There is at least one full generational gap between the 093B + 094 with Seawolf/Virginia and Ohio. At least one full generation even for whatever modifications have been made. Smaller diesel electrics are arguably more useful than the noisier (but more flexible) 093 in the role of A2AD against USN depending on range and where those subs are positioned. One thing I will concede for the PLAN is that PLAN's own submarine force doesn't have quite as much indication or usefulness in countering USN submarines. PLAN could have the world's best anti-sub capabilities and still operate Romeos. In this respect, it fits the picture we observe where PLAN seems to at least only broadcast its developing surface and anti-air capabilities.

In other words, China's pace of sub construction and development isn't necessarily (in fact probably not) related to how effective its anti-sub capabilities are at. There's no mystery or doubt at any point in the PRC's history that the USN's right arm is probably its SSN force when it comes to defeating navies and making way for their carriers to fight naval as well as land wars. It is impossible for the PLAN and China to only have spent decades working on countering one side without introducing any disruptive means of countering the subsurface threat. I mean, without a VERY watertight set of capabilities to stop Virginias, a single Virginia class could sink all the 052s and 055s in PLAN (if they're in the same place). It makes me doubt that planners and leaders have spared no thought on that issue. If anything, not talking about it quite as much should indicate that's where their technology focus truly is/was.

PLAN's slower sub pace is no doubt due to both the generational gap in submarine tech + experience and the desire to leapfrog rather than introduce something around the Borei, Virginia, Ohio, Vanguard, Astute level ... over ten years after them, try and deliver something that closes the gap more with a single step. China's own nuclear propulsion PWR tech may not even have caught up to the leading American/British standard. Maybe they're waiting for it to clear certain expectations or finishing up what they consider to be a better option... same with propellers and the shaftless EM drive breakthroughs that were leaked years ago. 095/096 production set up seems to be beginning so the work must have become finalised and completed recently.
 

lcloo

Captain
So much surface warship development. What's PLAN doing about its relative weakness below the surface? Anti-sub may have improved a lot and caught up if not surpassed but can they ensure any decent safety against the hordes of USN subs? They must be feeling pretty damn confident with PLAN's current anti-sub warfare but maybe this area doesn't get any attention or leaks from the authorities for a reason. Once you can detect subs with certainty and effectiveness, they are basically sitting ducks. In this respect, it is only a question of technology. The rest of the problem is securing airspace for anti-sub aircraft to release their ordinance. Could that be why China seems to consider air domain to be more important?

China's own sub fleet is a threat to the USN surface vessels more than they are to USN subs. It may not need the same level and numbers of submarines (though that's certainly useful for A2AD) to be totally capable of removing the USN submarine threat. It just seems while plenty of things are leaked and even very publicly shown and talked about, anti-sub insight is limited to just a few special mission aircraft and whispers of revolutionary detection tech. Anyway it's certainly true that if PLAN possess one or some new and effective anti-sub capabilities, it's only a matter of contesting and fighting for airspace - which explain spamming Type 055s and weapons dedicated to taking carriers.
These photos were released in 2016 by China, note the illustrated depths of ocean bed of 1,500m to 2,000m. I am sure many things have happened since then,

No country will disclose their top secret anti-submarine network deployed. What is disclosed in these photos are not so sensitive concepts for general views. the seabeds around China could already be having many of these things.193_179837_500583.jpg193_179838_657162.jpg193_179839_197710.jpg193_179840_497726.jpg193_179841_661241.jpg
 
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