Hong-Kong Protests

[Air Force Brat]

If this forum is to have any relation to the real world, especially as a military forum, it cannot forbid talk of potential violence. If Americans did not resort to violence against fellow Americans, your country could still be split between the North and South today. Sometimes in life, violence is the only way to bring about peace and denial of that only divorces discussions from reality.

But as you can tell from my post that you quoted, I'm not entirely sure that violence (or a military answer) is the correct response yet as I'm still struggling to understand what Hong Kong is (even without consideration to the riots).

If this were not the most relevant forum pertaining to the Chinese military on the web?? I wouldn't be here, nor would you? SDF has been the best long before either of us came along, thanks to our outstanding moderation.....

 

[getready]

Well the Chinese members here are having a good discussion with various points of view on how things should be handled, with some people learning and changing their minds. That is the definition of a mature and fruitful conversation. But when people come here to troll, it can go downhill very quickly.

Show evidence for why they are false then. My ears are wide open as I'm trying to formulate a solid picture for myself of what Hong Kong is. Every member here posts videos and evidence of violence and mob behavior in order to correctly define them as riots. It is you who chooses to side-step such discussions and go off on your own tangent posting propaganda articles that emotionalize things without evidence... When one looks at videos but still says no evidence was provided, I can only assume that this is a voluntary blindness.

I don't assume these things until they are proven to me... sometimes over and over again.

False things don't become true no matter how many times they are posted. They are just propaganda pieces, without evidence, that regurgitate what they hear from each other. Oftentimes, the authors have never even been to Hong Kong; they just romanticize a battle of people's hearts over tyranny from their own imagination.

If you want to have any effect other than trolling, come join the discussion, refute our evidence, show why you are correct with logic instead of just repetition. Don't be scared of the mental challenge of debate.

Just ignore the troll. No one's really believes his crap anyway.

 

[AssassinsMace]

The only real difference between a Hong Kong protestor and a gangster thug? The defenders of democracy and freedom love the Hong Kong protestor.

 

[Equation]

If this were not the most relevant forum pertaining to the Chinese military on the web?? I wouldn't be here, nor would you? SDF has been the best long before either of us came along, thanks to our outstanding moderation.....

This forum is relevant and fine without having to have any Anti China or anti Communist trolls preaching all because some members can't accept the changing of the world.

 

[solarz]

Yeah, but if you live there like 10 years, you can sorta get a feel on things. Western fake news would have you believe it's 100% anti-China LOL

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Huge pro-China rally on 8-17 that got completely ignored by Western MSM.

Police estimates placed numbers at 108,000. Compare this to the police estimate of 128,000 at the "pro-democracy" rally.

I'd say 50/50 is the right ballpark.

 

[Janiz]

I'd say 50/50 is the right ballpark.

lol

If those numbers would be true I would say that in reality it's like 1:10+.

You know, you can go to prison for protesting against CCP and for protesting in it's support the only question will be how many points can you get from this?

 

[manqiangrexue]

lol

If those numbers would be true I would say that in reality it's like 1:10+.

You know, you can go to prison for protesting against CCP and for protesting in it's support the only question will be how many points can you get from this?

I'm waiting for all the rioters to go to prison, which is what's supposed to happen in every country for disturbing the peace, inciting unrest, destruction of public property and assault on police officers/private citizens. Unfortunately they don't seem too concerned about that. I mean they only live there while you get to read Japanese and American media so certainly they probably don't know as much about China as you do, right? LOL

Check against logic before posting to avoid immediate humiliation.

 

[SpicySichuan]

But if it is some stronghold of anti-Chinese hatred with everyone jumping at the chance to help the CIA subvert the Chinese government, then talks are useless. Tanks and guns are the only solution to cleaning it up. There can be no anti-Chinese stronghold allowed to exist in China.

Hong Kong is a stronghold of ethnic Chinese (and SE Asians) who are fiercely anti-CCP (but not China as a whole). However, if CCP sends in tanks to wipe them off the map, CCP's SOES and well-connected private firms would also lose billions of investment (not to mention additional costs inflicted by sanctions). Therefore, I think military option should be off the table, unless Xi is willing to sacrifice tons of material interests belonging to the CCP, its well-connected businesses (including those owned by Xi's family members), and SOEs.

 

[Jura The idiot]

now went through

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Hong Kong’s increasingly xenophobic protests are devolving into chaos with help from US government regime-change outfits and a right-wing local media tycoon with close ties to hardliners in Washington.

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some footage inside can be disturbing (but not to those who, like me, watched videos from actual combat)

 

[SpicySichuan]

I myself have absolutely no problem with HKers wanting to have more freedom. I am ok with them protesting on the streets.

However, I do have a huge problem with some of them claiming not to be Chinese. Unlike Taiwan, where there had been some gray areas (especially concerning the aboriginals living on the island way before China took control of the island >400 years ago), Hong Kong has always been part of China. Even the British recognized this fact when they were the colonial power controlling HK. That’s why they had to return HK back to China when the lease was up, despite that fact that the British wanted to keep HK for themselves.

HK people had always identified themselves as Chinese. HK’s Chinese history drama in the 70’s, 80’s and 90’s have been considered as classics and the golden standard of Chinese ancient history drama.

As the saying goes, they may hate the government, but they love the country. Similarly, HKers may hate the PRC, but they should never separate themselves from being Chinese.

An earlier article talks about an international student from HK feeling uncomfortable being referred to as being from “Hong Kong, China”. This, to me, would be unacceptable. The term “Hong Kong, China” is legally, politically, historically and socially correct in every sense of the word. HKers are Chinese in every sense of the definition. No matter how anyone spins it.

The HKer in the article considers themselves the same as Tibet and Taiwan. HK is very different in the sense that HK has always been offficially and legally part of China. Even the most staunched supporters of the Taiwan independence acknowledge that Taiwan and HK are very different. Most of the supporters of the Taiwan independence movement consider HK as a Chinese territory colonized by the British. They always proudly claim that “we have independence, but they (HKers) have never had independence.

Even one of the main leaders of the protest made a statement today that he is not seeking Hong Kong independence. That means he acknowledges that HK is part of China. Then HKers are Chinese. “Hong Kong, China” is an absolutely 100% correct description.

HKers have the wet dream of becoming another Singapore. As some constructivists would argue, their historical interactions with both Britain and China led to them to conclude that they have become unique (neither British nor Communist Chinese). Since China has been ruled by an Autocratic Communist regime, and yet liberal-minded HKers could never become Anglo-Saxons, the only ideal option would be to seek independence (despite being unrealistic in a world where geopolitical rules are dictated by powerful nation states).