09III/09IV (093/094) Nuclear Submarine Thread

duncanidaho

Junior Member
For comparison, in the infamous ONI chart they put the still non existing 095 sub somewhere between Victor III and Akula I


chinasubsound.jpg

What an achievement from the chinese navy industrie, we also can expect the next generation sub, type 095, will be quieter than the 093A.


To put in context, what 110 dB underwater means, the following link.

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Xizor

Captain
Registered Member
what limits china's push to catch up with the US on the Submarine stealthiness (acoustic front) ? Material issues? System issues? It seems to be quite the norm to come to the mentioned conclusion and not ponder about what leads to the lag in capabilities and how to overcome it. It might be due to the inherent secretive nature of the underwater systems ...but still.

Oh and ofc, i'm pretty sure the chinese administration and planners are aware of the lag. Certainly money isn't the issue . It might be technology. A technological barrier that china can't "hack and slash" it's way through ?! Color me surprised.
 

Broccoli

Senior Member
Does not compute.

Like most Soviet submarines Yasen was designed between 1975-1985. It's possible that "improved Victor III" incorporates all the latest design features Soviets had 1985-1990 while first Yasen was laid down 1993 as designed without latest noise reduction tech added.
 
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Tirdent

Junior Member
Registered Member
Aspects of the Yasen design may date back to the 1980s, but it's still of far newer vintage in every way than the Victor III, the last unit of which was launched 2 years before Severodvinsk was even laid down. Most silencing technology is impossible to retro-fit, including the reactor (where the first Yasen unit is 1.5, the second 2 generations ahead of the Victor III) and raft-mounting arrangements (on which a surprising amount of info has been leaked for Yasen - it is extremely advanced in this regard).

Quite apart from that, I didn't find where he states that in the first place - I'm also not sure how much faith you can put in his info in general. Giving him the benefit of the doubt, he at the very least is dumbing things down quite a bit for the general audience on those topics where I'm reasonably fit to judge. It may be "maskirovka" to avoid coming into conflict with any confidentiality agreements he is bound by, or he may not be quite what he claims, but in any case, bring along salt.
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
If the statements below are true, then the next version of the Type-93/95 should be competitive enough against the Virginia/Seawolf.

That would argue for a large increase in production rate, given that the Chinese Navy does lag behind in submarines and when you compare it to the resources that are being devoted to the surface navy.


In one of his answer Jive Turkey stated that the 110 dB of 093A is as good as Victor III from 1990,

View attachment 53212
which lead me to this diagram, as you can see Victor III in 1990 is the improved Victor III.View attachment 53214
 

Hyperwarp

Captain
Got a very informative video about 093 family [*MEDIA=youtube]EnMyKX-5Y10[/MEDIA]

So if the 093A is around 110 db, then it is time to update some charts. Improved LA class is said to be around 105, while Seawolf, Virginia and Astude classes are around 95 db.

@Interstellar, how far off is the speculation below,

EDIT: Original -
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uKKGoaE.jpg
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
So if the 093A is around 110 db, then it is time to update some charts. Improved LA class is said to be around 105, while Seawolf, Virginia and Astude classes are around 95 db.

@Interstellar, how far off is the speculation below,

EDIT: Original -
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uKKGoaE.jpg

I appreciate the effort and I don't have any comment as to the projected dates and noise level association projections.

However I think it would be useful to use the designations of 09III and 09V etc with the PLA standard for Roman numerals when referring PLAN nuclear subs for your chart seeing as you put the effort for making the chart.
 

Broccoli

Senior Member
Pentagons 2019 report mentions that Type-093B will be launched 2020-2025 and they classify these new humpback boats as 093A Shang II's (page 36).
SHANG I-class SSNs (Type 093), four SHANG II-class SSNs (Type 093A).
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Original 093 = Shang I

093A = Shang II

093B = Shang III?
 
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