China Flanker Thread II

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Blitzo

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It doesn't matter if J-15's AL-31F is a naval variant. They are developing a naval variant of WS-10. Once that's ready and fully tested, J-15 will use it.

Actually I think it does sort of matter, given the type of Al-31F used (ie a navalized variant or a standard variant) by current J-15s may reflect what characteristics of present WS-10s are currently most important for explaining why J-15s are not powered by WS-10s.
 

tphuang

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Actually I think it does sort of matter, given the type of Al-31F used (ie a navalized variant or a standard variant) by current J-15s may reflect what characteristics of present WS-10s are currently most important for explaining why J-15s are not powered by WS-10s.
you are overly argumentative. You were wondering why J-15s were not using WS-10 and I told you what I read. If you have a problem with that, you can go try to take that up with PLAN. It's not my job to defend PLAN decisions.
 

Air Force Brat

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you are overly argumentative. You were wondering why J-15s were not using WS-10 and I told you what I read. If you have a problem with that, you can go try to take that up with PLAN. It's not my job to defend PLAN decisions.
He's right again Blitzo, he gave you a great answer, and there you go, you are almost as argumentative as that obnoxious AFB. The J-15s seem to be doing very well with their present powerplants, and I only wish we had more evidence of their day to day training routines? The J-15 is still my favorite Flanker, and just a very fine aircraft, its quite amazing how adaptable the Flanker is, and how the PLA have taken great advantage of this flexibility to build up the PLAAF.
 

Blitzo

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He's right again Blitzo, he gave you a great answer, and there you go, you are almost as argumentative as that obnoxious AFB.

He did give an answer, however I think my subsequent questions were also relevant to the thread -- I was interested in further details for the sake of healthy discussion, especially around the parameters for navalizing engines and whether that has existed or not for Al-31F. He and I have since discussed some of our differences and I'm willing to let whatever supposed issue there is slide.

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Back on topic: on the subject of navalized engines, the obvious situation with J-15s is that current production J-15s use Al-31F engines, and will be expected to use a WS-10 variant in due time. This isn't a matter of contention.

However, that consensus does raise a few questions, because the Al-31F is not a navalized engine, and we have no evidence that China imported navalized Al-31F3 variants (used on the Su-33) for use on their J-15s.
Thus, the question which I believe is worth asking, is that if the Navy is using standard non navalized Al-31Fs on their current J-15s, when what is it about standard non navalized WS-10s that prohibits them from powering current J-15s as well? That is, if J-15s are waiting for a navalized WS-10 variant, why could they not use non navalized WS-10s as a current stop gap instead of non navalized Al-31Fs?
For instance, are standard, non navalized Al-31Fs simply naturally more corrosion resistant than non navalized WS-10s, and/or are there some other characteristics at play which makes non navalized Al-31Fs more suitable for J-15s than non navalized WS-10s?

I'd be interested in any hypotheses which anyone could offer.
At present I'm sitting on three possible answers:
1: China did import Al-31F3s and are using them on J-15s, but we simply didn't hear about it. Probably unlikely, but still possible.
2: there are certain characteristics about the non navalized Al-31F which make it more suitable for use aboard J-15s than non navalized WS-10s, such as possibly being more corrosive resistant by design or something of the sort.
3: there is no appreciable difference between the non navalized Al-31F and non navalized WS-10 in actual performance, but the Al-31F has more far cumulative flight hours across hundreds of aircraft around in service around the world for decades, and are/were still demonstrably "lower risk" than WS-10s which had far less flight hours -- so the Navy chose Al-31Fs as the lower risk option as their stop gap.
 

jobjed

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He did give an answer, however I think my subsequent questions were also relevant to the thread -- I was interested in further details for the sake of healthy discussion, especially around the parameters for navalizing engines and whether that has existed or not for Al-31F. He and I have since discussed some of our differences and I'm willing to let whatever supposed issue there is slide.

--------------------

Back on topic: on the subject of navalized engines, the obvious situation with J-15s is that current production J-15s use Al-31F engines, and will be expected to use a WS-10 variant in due time. This isn't a matter of contention.

However, that consensus does raise a few questions, because the Al-31F is not a navalized engine, and we have no evidence that China imported navalized Al-31F3 variants (used on the Su-33) for use on their J-15s.
Thus, the question which I believe is worth asking, is that if the Navy is using standard non navalized Al-31Fs on their current J-15s, when what is it about standard non navalized WS-10s that prohibits them from powering current J-15s as well? That is, if J-15s are waiting for a navalized WS-10 variant, why could they not use non navalized WS-10s as a current stop gap instead of non navalized Al-31Fs?
For instance, are standard, non navalized Al-31Fs simply naturally more corrosion resistant than non navalized WS-10s, and/or are there some other characteristics at play which makes non navalized Al-31Fs more suitable for J-15s than non navalized WS-10s?

I'd be interested in any hypotheses which anyone could offer.
At present I'm sitting on three possible answers:
1: China did import Al-31F3s and are using them on J-15s, but we simply didn't hear about it. Probably unlikely, but still possible.
2: there are certain characteristics about the non navalized Al-31F which make it more suitable for use aboard J-15s than non navalized WS-10s, such as possibly being more corrosive resistant by design or something of the sort.
3: there is no appreciable difference between the non navalized Al-31F and non navalized WS-10 in actual performance, but the Al-31F has more far cumulative flight hours across hundreds of aircraft around in service around the world for decades, and are/were still demonstrably "lower risk" than WS-10s which had far less flight hours -- so the Navy chose Al-31Fs as the lower risk option as their stop gap.
Good post, I was wondering about that as well. I'm leaning to Pt.3 since I haven't heard of a navalised AL-31 and don't believe that the WS-10 is THAT inferior in terms of reliability. Plus, there is a J-15 with WS-10s. So I think it's likely the PLANAF is using AL-31s just to play safe.
 

davidau

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Surely equipment ( aircraft, engines etc...) that are used in a marine (salt-laden) atmosphere must be treated to provide corrosion resistant..
 

DigoSSA

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Does anyone know what the operating system used by J-11b? I saw a news that would windows xp. That's true?
 
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