Z-10 thread


by78

Lieutenant General
An interesting image. A Z-10 parked in a meadow.

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Hendrik_2000

Brigadier
Via JSch Anti tank missile is getting deadlier by the day
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China test fires new ‘world-leading’ helicopter missile
By Liu Xuanzun Source: Global Times Published: 2020/7/15 18:48:41

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A cluster of helicopters attached to an army aviation brigade under the PLA Western Theater Command lift off for a flight training exercise in early March, 2020. Photo: eng.chinamil.com.cn

China recently test launched a new type of helicopter-based air-to-ground missile, which is at a world-leading level, according to the weapon's developers.

The missile is likely to excel at range, accuracy and power, making it a nightmare for hostile tanks and fortifications, aviation experts said on Wednesday.

An undisclosed type of helicopter conducted the test firing of the missile at a test site in Alxa, North China's Inner Mongolia Autonomous Region on June 22, reported China Aviation News, a newspaper affiliated with the state-owned Aviation Industry Corp of China (AVIC), on Tuesday.

The missile accurately hit its target, marking the successful, first test launch of the missile, the report said.


"In the whole world, [the missile] is in a leading position," the report quoted an unidentified test employee as saying.

The report did not reveal the new missile's designation or its capabilities.

Fu Qianshao, a Chinese military aviation expert, told the Global Times on Wednesday that in order to be called "world-leading," the air-to-ground missile must have a very long effective range, an advanced guidance system that enables very high accuracy, and a very powerful warhead that can penetrate a tank's thick armor.

It is not surprising that China's new missiles have become world leaders after seeing the performances of previous missiles like the HJ series, Fu said.

The Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) operates multiple types of attack helicopters, including the Z-10 and Z-19, both of which were recently upgraded.

According to a photo released by PLA's 80th Group Army in February,
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featured exhaust openings that face upward instead of outward, which experts said will make it harder to target by infrared sensors.

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, lighter than the Z-10, saw an extra millimeter-wave fire control radar installed on the top of its rotor at the Fifth China Helicopter Exposition in Tianjin in October 2019. The new radar can give the chopper the capability to search and track targets over long distances in complex weather conditions day and night, and provide accurate targeting data for guided weapon systems.

Among other weapons and equipment, many Z-10 attack helicopters were reportedly mobilized to western China's plateau regions for drills amid border tensions with India.

When equipped with the new missile, the PLA's helicopters will become even deadlier, particularly to enemy tanks, armored vehicles and fortifications, experts said.

China is also building amphibious assault ships that can carry helicopters and extend their capabilities across seas, analysts noted.
 

Hendrik_2000

Brigadier
.... It’s so great they don’t even have a clue how great!!

Well you can infer the performance of the new missile by comparing it to the most widespread ATGM HJ-8
It is widely use in PLA and portable enough to be carried by Z10 or Z19 It is battle tested but seem to be dated since it is product 1980 and entered service in mid 1980. It has been updated over the years but clearly there is the need for new ATGM to reflect Chinese progress in technology since 1980's
If I have to guess it is probable has a range of at least 10km, bigger warhead and more accurate than HJ10, less prone to jamming , fire and forget firing system Here is the spec for HJ8
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Early Red Arrow missiles had a range of three kilometers and their 120-millimeter shaped charges had a penetration equivalent to eight hundred millimeters of Rolled Homogenous Armor (RHA). However, HJ-8 has seen a lot of upgrades over the years. The HJ-8C and D versions introduced a tandem charge designed to defeat the Explosive Reactive Armor common on Soviet and Russian tanks, a feature retained in later models.

The principle contemporary variant is the HJ-8E, which has a thermal imaging system, a range of four kilometers, and reported penetration of one-thousand-millimeter RHA. A new HJ-8L launch unit has miniaturized circuitry to reduce its weight to fifty pounds, so it can serve as a truly man-portable weapon. Finally, there is also a longer-range HJ-8H that can strike targets up to six kilometers distant, including helicopters. Specialized HJ-8F bunker busters with thermobaric warheads and HJ-8S anti-shipping missiles also exist.


The Red Arrow is the most widespread antitank system in the People’s Liberation Army. As an infantry weapon, the four-part system is fired from a heavy tripod. However, it is also mounted on infantry fighting vehicles, wheeled APCs and attack helicopters.

Beijing has extensively exported the missiles to nearly twenty countries in Asia, Africa and South America. Egypt, Sudan and Pakistan also produce the weapon under license. Pakistan has produced around twenty-three thousand of its own Baktar-Shikan variant, mounted on Land Rovers, APCS and even AH-1 Cobra attack helicopters bought from the United States.

The Red Arrow was first used in action by Bosnian fighters facing Serbian armor in the early 1990s.
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despite a UN arms embargo, the Red Arrows were filmed knocking out numerous T-55 and M-84 tanks (the latter a Yugoslav derivative of the T-72), as well as BMP-1 infantry fighting vehicles, and were credited with blunting Serbian armored offensives in the Battles of Stup in 1992 and Tesanj in 1993.

Since 2013 there have been
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of videos of Syrian FSA rebels using HJ-8Es to blow up Syrian Arab Army T-72, T-62 and T-54
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, 2S1 and 2S3
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,
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,
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, and even
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. These weapons
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, and were possibly supplied by Qatar.


All in all, the videos suggest that somebody supplied a lot of HJ-8s to the rebels in 2013, and that they were fairly effective in combat. However, the sharp drop-off in HJ-8 videos in the last several years may indicate that the weapon shipments were not continued.

Red Arrows have also been
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by Kurdish peshmerga troops in Iraq in 2014, and were reportedly acquired by Wa rebels in Myanmar.


The HJ-8 is a reliable system, but no longer at the cutting edge of antitank technology. It could probably be shot down by the Active Protection Systems on tank such as
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or the
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. The Red Arrow 8 might also struggle to penetrate the frontal composite armor of top Western main battle tanks like the M1 Abrams. Intriguingly, a video shows PLA troops testing an HJ-8 on one of their own Type 96 tanks, which benefit from modern composite armor. It appears to survive the missile impact reasonably well.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
If I have to guess it is probable has a range of at least 10km, bigger warhead and more accurate than HJ10, less prone to jamming , fire and forget firing system Here is the spec for HJ8
Oh that can’t be because this is a “World leading” missile and the SPIKE NLOS has a range of 25km. So this has to be better than that...
seriously this article is hyperbole to the extreme. It doesn’t give any details. Only hype about hype. It’s the stuff Fanboi dreams are made of. No range no accuracy, No warhead data. Just the promise that it will “be Great, You’re gonna love it.. Yuge!! Game changer.” Everything after that is just inference which is basically another way of saying daydreams.
 

Hendrik_2000

Brigadier
Oh that can’t be because this is a “World leading” missile and the SPIKE NLOS has a range of 25km. So this has to be better than that...
seriously this article is hyperbole to the extreme. It doesn’t give any details. Only hype about hype. It’s the stuff Fanboi dreams are made of. No range no accuracy, No warhead data. Just the promise that it will “be Great, You’re gonna love it.. Yuge!! Game changer.” Everything after that is just inference which is basically another way of saying daydreams.

Why is is day dream HJ 10 has a range of 10 km ? Everything that I say is in vogue right now with the other ATGM missile fabricator, thing like fire and forget, bigger warhead and more precision
You think Chinese industry cannot compete with the israeli?Giving almost 20 years since they design the HJ8 It is more than likely they will exceed the israeli performance. They didn't say it is NLOS missile
Even Spike come with various flavors . As I said I make educated guesses based on existing system.

You stay long enough in this forum you should know that PLA NEVER divulge spec for weapon that thye use. We always infererred the performance based on export version There is nothing daydream about it
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
It’s a day dream because the article is A GT Fluff piece. We all know the Global Times it’s a Tabloid. You are the one, not the article Who is drumming up 10km @Hendrik_2000. You sir. Not the article. The article just says we have a great new missile that we don’t know anything about but it sounds so great!!
all I can think of is the Justin Hammer EX wife from Ironman 2
You want to talk about being on the forum long enough? Remember whom you are comparing to I have a whole year on you and we are two of the old men of the group. I don’t believe in divination.
The Export versions give us a basis to compare as they are made using the same technology and same concept. This doesn’t even give us a basis to compare. You are inferring a basis of comparison based solely on it must be better than X. Yet based on what? The claims of an unknown source who doesn’t give anything? That’s the daydreaming. Might as well be based on the endtrails of some animals.
We don’t have even estimates. No photos.
For all we know this could just be an upgraded HJ8. Or something totally different. the Piece sums its self up as “ Better missile we promise...”
and from that you created your own specs and details. It’s a Rorschach.
 

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