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Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
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So 10 billion USD over five years is just early stages of R&D?
What about statements of a rapid acquisition process and iterative development, even an interim engine?

I'm aware of those statements and those articles; the US military has made it quite a priority to expedite the procurement process for PCA/NGAD. But as of yet I remain skeptical as to how successful those efforts will be (affordability and rapid procurement are hardly new jargon to be introduced for military procurement), and even the USAF doesn't know what current efforts for a 2030 "PCA" will look like, and it's not yet even known how much of it will rely on a traditional fighter at its core.

Make no mistake, I'm firmly aware that the USAF wants a new gen air superiority capability by 2030.
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But I'm skeptical as to whether it can be achieved by that date; if in the next few years we start to see rapid movement then I will certainly reconsider my position.
 

Klon

Junior Member
Registered Member
Obviously nobody can tell the future in this regard and it's hard to really know the present. I question whether this program is behind things like Tempest and FCAS, based on what they've revealed so far (much less financial commitment and a later target date).
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Obviously nobody can tell the future in this regard and it's hard to really know the present. I question whether this program is behind things like Tempest and FCAS, based on what they've revealed so far (much less financial commitment and a later target date).

I suppose it depends on how seriously/realistically one takes the USAF's target 2030 date at this stage...
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
It's been planed that F22 and F35 will get upgrades. We will likely see F22 getting a midlife program slated in 2024-2025 timeframe. I suspect that will bring it up to a 5.5 gen. And Lightning will likely follow suit soon after.
Most of the 5.5 models and concepts are clearly overgrowth of 5th gen airframe with more advanced systems.
Because of the nebulous aspects of sixth generation it could be that 5.5 is 6.
The 2030 date is my expectations of production start of the PCA for the USAF and NGAD for the USN.
The Navy needs that it's Super Duper Hornets are lifecycle end in the early 2030s. F22 was built with short sighted numbers and F15 are long in the tooth.
However If as you suspect @Bltizo that 6th gen has not come to full form then at that point the late 2020s the fall back plans should be to expand from F22 midlife to new modernized production and F35 upgrades including a F/A35F Super Lightning for the sailors.

Around that same time B21 will emerge and may have a major barring on American Air power as the age of tankers based on airliners is reaching the end. By this point to the PLAAF will have shown what it under it's curtain. It might follow the same idea.

Although it seems like Tempest have some advantage the truth is all they have are concept art and models. The USAF has that. They don't even have full ideas on who is partnered,
Right now you have the German French team and the British team has happened in previous pan European fighter programs they might merge and then break up again or keep independent either way neither plans before 2035 IOC. They aim for prototypes in the late 2020s same as the US.
F3 is a different case as it's likely to have some American DNA. It's planned into has always been in the late 2020s which overlaps with American plans it might end up being that F3 is a Japanese Cousin to one the American 6th gens. Sharing systems to some degree.
All the other programs I can think of are either solid fifth gen, nebulous or doubius.

I expect some degree of production for J20, Fc31 and SU57 and upgraded versions to bring them to gen 5.5 along the way even claims of being 6th gens but again nebulous.
 
here comes the tweet
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's government has sent bombers halfway around the world to
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. The Russian and Venezuelan people should see this for what it is: two corrupt governments squandering public funds, and squelching liberty and freedom while their people suffer.

DuGpDIhWoAABAv5.jpg
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
gee even according to The National Interest A New Report Reveals Why There Won't Be Any 'New' F-22 Raptors

May 7, 2018
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Well golly gee @Jura i didn't see. That... oh wait I did. And I considered it.
fall back plans should be
Since Raptor is supposed to get a mid life overhaul that will likely include some degree of hardware upgrade, and a partial reopening of the line for replacement parts. That's why I feel that such is viable as a fall back in the event PCA falls apart.
 
Well golly gee @Jura i didn't see. That... oh wait I did. And I considered it.

Since Raptor is supposed to get a mid life overhaul that will likely include some degree of hardware upgrade, and a partial reopening of the line for replacement parts. That's why I feel that such is viable as a fall back in the event PCA falls apart.
OK the sentence in

#10373 TerraN_EmpirE, Today at 1:41 AM
"However If as you suspect @Bltizo that 6th gen has not come to full form then at that point the late 2020s the fall back plans should be to expand from F22 midlife to new modernized production and F35 upgrades including a F/A35F Super Lightning for the sailors."

sounded to me as if there would new Raptors manufactured according to you;

from my google-fu now: Raptors didn't even get Link 16 transmit yet
Rejuvenating the Raptor: Roadmap for F-22 Modernization

October 11, 2018
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sentence starting with "To that end" have to go right now
 
Oct 26, 2018
Feb 21, 2018
now though After consecutive failures, Navy has successful SM-3 missile intercept
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and again US Navy, Missile Defense Agency shoot down an intermediate-range ballistic missile in space
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The U.S. Navy and Missile Defense Agency continued a hot streak Tuesday when they successfully shot down an intermediate-range ballistic missile target in space from its Hawaii-based
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.

The test marked the second consecutive successful intercept for the SM-3 Block IIA missile in development. The intercept f
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, which shook off two hard-luck consecutive failures ― one caused
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and
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third-stage rocket motor. Both tests were on course for a successful intercept when the respective mishaps occurred, officials told Defense News.

The missile, which was launched from Hawaii, fired on a track from a sensor that was a significant distance from the Aegis Ashore Missile Defense Test Complex at the Pacific Missile Rang Facility at Kauai, said Mark Wright, spokesman for the Missile Defense Agency.

Aegis Ashore never had a native track on the missile, Wright confirmed, meaning the missile that was shot from that facility successfully locked onto a target, which was entirely tracked by a non-native sensor relaying its tracking data, a key capability under development by the MDA.

The SM-3 Block IIA is a co-development between the U.S. and Japan, and it is expected to be equipped on both the U.S. Aegis Ashore stations in Romania and Poland and the future Aegis Ashore stations in Japan — making it a keystone to America’s short- and intermediate-range missile defense strategies. The European Aegis Ashore sites have been the source of significant tension between Russia and the U.S., with Russian President Vladimir Putin regularly criticizing the platform and accusing the U.S. of attempting to upset the strategic balance.

In a release, the MDA said the missile was fired by a U.S. Air Force C-17 “thousands of miles southwest of the Aegis Ashore test site that launched the SM-3 Block IIA interceptor.”

“The engagement leveraged a ground, air and space-based sensor/command and control architecture linked by the Ballistic Missile Defense System's Command and Control, Battle Management, and Communications (C2BMC) suite,” the release said.

In a statement, the head of the MDA said the test proved the technology going into the missile defense capabilities in Europe are on course.

"Today's successful flight test demonstrated the effectiveness of the European Phased Adaptive Approach Phase 3 architecture,” said Lt. Gen. Sam Greaves. “It also was of great significance to the future of multi-domain missile defense operations and supports a critical initial production acquisition milestone for the SM-3 Block IIA missile program.

“This system is designed to defend the United States, its deployed forces, allies, and friends from a real and growing ballistic missile threat. I offer my congratulations to all members of the team, military, civilian, contractors and allies who helped make this possible.”

This is the third successful intercept out of five intercept tests for the SM-3 Block IIA.
 
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