Turkey Military News, Reports, Data, etc.


Anlsvrthng

Senior Member
Registered Member
same way it didn’t stop the Iranian rocket attack. Can’t protect if it’s not there.
Sight....
I think it works like a faith. If you believe then it must be true . : P

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The kingdom has spent billions in recent years on US-made Patriot surface-to-air missiles designed to shoot down high-flying targets such as enemy jets or ballistic missiles. Satellite imagery suggests
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was installed at Abqaiq in the recent past.

...
At least four shorter-range defence systems, designed to take out smaller targets, were also present around Abqaiq, according to satellite images.
Any more nonsense ?
That site was the most protected in the Kingdom, but practically all USA equipment not simply failed to defend it, but even didn't detected the cruise missiles .
It is not a surprise the Turkish doesn't want to buy any Patriot. Maybe they hasn't got enough faith . : )
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
In the recent past doesn’t mean was there that night. SAM systems are some magical force field that suddenly blankets the country the site has to be in range of the incoming barrage and the site has to be active otherwise your own excuse for the destruction of Russian supplied systems comes into play. But Sigh...
 

Anlsvrthng

Senior Member
Registered Member
In the recent past doesn’t mean was there that night. SAM systems are some magical force field that suddenly blankets the country the site has to be in range of the incoming barrage and the site has to be active otherwise your own excuse for the destruction of Russian supplied systems comes into play. But Sigh...

Still the Pantsir systems and the S-300 forced the ISIS/ISrael/USA airforce to operate from big distances, and to use expensive supersonic missiles (translation : cut back the number of affordable targets by one-two magnitude)

And yes, we know the problems with the Patriot.
1. it is built around single band radar
2. No cheap/continuous emission early warning radar in the system (see point one)
3. Not capable to detect low flying targets
4. not capable to detect low RCS targets
5. can cover one quadrant only
6. no integration with point defence systems
7. No automatic operation mode ( the one it posses has the tendency to shoot down friendly/civilian aircrafts)


So, as you pointed out the Patriot is not capable to give continuous cover for an area, and it is not the biggest issue with it.

There is at least 3 design deficiency why the patriot failed to detect/intercept the cruise missiles.

: )

And still ,there was four other point defence system there .


I suggest to read bit more about it, objective evaluation is the king : )
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But these are basically inconsequential, says Jack Watling, a land warfare expert at the Royal United Services Institute who advises Gulf militaries.

“The Patriots are kind of irrelevant,” Watling told CNBC in a phone interview. “The track record of Patriot engaging missiles of any kind is pretty awful, they very rarely hit the target.” The other issue, he says, is that it’s designed for shooting down high-altitude ballistic missiles, not the cruise missiles and drones used in Saturday’s attack.

....
Aerial photographs found on open-source platforms show three Skyguard batteries placed around the targeted Abqaiq oil facility, which are slow-firing large caliber anti-aircraft guns, as well as French-made Shahine batteries from the 1980s.
So ,the Patriot is very effective to shoot down aircrafts, including UK, USA ones : )

And sorry, the USA hasn't got any point defence systems, so the Kingdom has to use France/German ones. : D
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Wait forced ISIS? Really ISIS? When the hell did they get an Air Force?! You don’t use S400 for a drone with a hand grenade. So you revert to making up your own facts.

Israel? Israel operated without issue. still do The US? They operate without issue as well. Stand off or otherwise. Remember the cruise missile strikes?The US and Russia chose to deconflict letting the other know about stiles they intended. US forces operated in Syria without a issue for the better part of a decade without any issues from S400.
So far the Russian systems have proven best used to shoot down airliner class aircraft.
 

Anlsvrthng

Senior Member
Registered Member
Wait forced ISIS? Really ISIS? When the hell did they get an Air Force?! You don’t use S400 for a drone with a hand grenade. So you revert to making up your own facts.

Israel? Israel operated without issue. still do The US? They operate without issue as well. Stand off or otherwise. Remember the cruise missile strikes?The US and Russia chose to deconflict letting the other know about stiles they intended. US forces operated in Syria without a issue for the better part of a decade without any issues from S400.
So far the Russian systems have proven best used to shoot down airliner class aircraft.
Ok, I try to repeat it :
1. the air defence system forcing all aggressor aircraft to operate outside of the engagement envelope of the systems.
2. the point defence systems protect the highest value targets
3. the remaining options of the aggressors is to use supersonic, medium/ long range missiles OR saturation attack.

The point 3 means instead to drop 30 tons cheap dumb onto dozens of targets they happy if can hit the one target with a 0.2 tons supersonic missile warhead with the same sortie number and magnitude higher cost.

I know, it is hard to understand, but the presence of a layered defence system doesn't means the target can't be destroyed, it means the cost to destroy is increased by two magnitude( at least).

So instead to carpet bombing whole Syria, the aggressors happy if they can hit one or two targets.

Prior of the introduction of SAM systems there was bombardment of hospitals, water treatment plants and everything else that was on the way back home from sortie.

Again, a dumb bomb cost 10k, a supersonic missile that the ISrael air force has to use now is 500-1000k.
 

ougoah

Captain
Registered Member
Casualties of S-400 Deal: Turkish Albayraklar Defence seized operations:
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Turkey accused Russia of fraud, discloses fatal flaws in Russian-made S-400 SAM system calling it a “chimney”:
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Both from the same dodgy Indian based military blog/youtube/forum type robot voiced propaganda/click farm machines.

I read some other GDC articles on their site and it appears they are basically just another one of those aggravatingly shallow youtube military channels that all seem to be openly (sometimes secretly) Indian. The openly ones will say headquarters are in India and the undisclosed source ones do not have any contacts apart from emailing them and usually feature disproportionately high numbers of Indian related materials. Indian materials are ALWAYS either neutral or positively portrayed whereas Chinese material is ALWAYS negative if not violently negatively and Russian material is all over the place. They also love praising Israeli and western stuff too.

Now I'm sure there may be some drama between Turkey and Russia when it comes to the S-400 but after reading GDC's articles on Sukhoi and Migs, it's clear they have some anti-Russian agenda. No references at all and backing up claims about certain events. They quote dodgy "anonymous sources" (classic Indian media trait) and even claimed in one article that it was probably an Indian crew that flew the Mig-35 in MAKS 2019. Their forum is Indian/Pakistan/Bangladesh trafficked and make claims about how Israel has used Growlers to completely disable S-300 and S-400 in Syria. This stuff is absolutely bogus because there is no way they have this information even if it were true. This is just from 5 mins of reading their crap.

At most, the Turkish issue with S-400 now is that Russia is denying them the level of technology transfer that Turkey may have been expecting. That's about it. Does anyone actually think Turkey would not thoroughly test the S-400 before buying and wait until now to give it a test drive?! When these idiots make up bullshit like this, they should try harder. Better yet, they should hang themselves, literally.
 

araberuni

Junior Member
Registered Member
Both from the same dodgy Indian based military blog/youtube/forum type robot voiced propaganda/click farm machines.

I read some other GDC articles on their site and it appears they are basically just another one of those aggravatingly shallow youtube military channels that all seem to be openly (sometimes secretly) Indian. The openly ones will say headquarters are in India and the undisclosed source ones do not have any contacts apart from emailing them and usually feature disproportionately high numbers of Indian related materials. Indian materials are ALWAYS either neutral or positively portrayed whereas Chinese material is ALWAYS negative if not violently negatively and Russian material is all over the place. They also love praising Israeli and western stuff too.

Now I'm sure there may be some drama between Turkey and Russia when it comes to the S-400 but after reading GDC's articles on Sukhoi and Migs, it's clear they have some anti-Russian agenda. No references at all and backing up claims about certain events. They quote dodgy "anonymous sources" (classic Indian media trait) and even claimed in one article that it was probably an Indian crew that flew the Mig-35 in MAKS 2019. Their forum is Indian/Pakistan/Bangladesh trafficked and make claims about how Israel has used Growlers to completely disable S-300 and S-400 in Syria. This stuff is absolutely bogus because there is no way they have this information even if it were true. This is just from 5 mins of reading their crap.

At most, the Turkish issue with S-400 now is that Russia is denying them the level of technology transfer that Turkey may have been expecting. That's about it. Does anyone actually think Turkey would not thoroughly test the S-400 before buying and wait until now to give it a test drive?! When these idiots make up bullshit like this, they should try harder. Better yet, they should hang themselves, literally.
BTW this is Russian source and reference from Turkish president.

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