PLA strike strategies in westpac HIC

Tomboy

Junior Member
Registered Member
Total ACTIVE fighter jet counts of US and allies:


United States​


  • USAF: ~1,690 fighter aircraft (F‑15, F‑16, F‑22, F‑35)
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  • USMC: ~297 fighter jets
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  • USN: Includes ~450 carrier-based F/A‑18E/F Super Hornets plus early F-35Cs (not fully tallied; estimate ~400)

➡️ Estimated total: ~2,387 active fighter jets across Air Force, Marine Corps, and Navy.




Japan​


  • Total JASDF fighter aircraft: ~321 across all fighter types (F‑15J/DJ, F‑2, F‑35A)
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➡️ Estimated total: ~321 active fighters.




Australia​


  • F‑35A: 72
  • F/A‑18F Super Hornet: 24
  • EA‑18G Growler (electronic‑attack version of the Hornet): 12
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➡️ Estimated total: 108 combat-capable jets (all active)
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Taiwan​


  • F‑16A/B: ~150
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  • Indigenous Defense Fighter (F‑CK‑1): 129
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  • F‑5E/F: ~180
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  • Mirage‑2000‑5: 60 (verified from 24/7 Wall St.)
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  • Other types (like trainers, etc.) exclude non-fighters.

➡️ Estimated total: ~519 active fighter jets.




Summary Table​


CountryActive Fighter Jet Count (All Services)
United States~2,387
Japan~321
Australia~108
Taiwan~519



US numbers only show active count. If you start counting Air national guard and other reserves it will exceed 3000+. Yes, US will not be able to bring everything to a fight. They need to keep some for other regions. But China also has to keep some for other contingencies. So, overall count is in US+allies favour ina huge way.
That's assuming Australia would even join the fight which is doubtful while Taiwan's 519 "fighter" jets wouldn't be of much help, F-5s are a literal joke right now if used on the frontline along with F-CK-1 which doesn't seem to be upgraded. M-2Ks aren't of much help either especially with no access to advanced munitions such as meteors, the only thing that could present a potential threat would be F-16A/B with upgrades. Japan's viable fleet would be the 68 or so Super F-15Js that they'll finish upgrading in the 2030s and 147 F-35A/Bs they'll have by the 2030s. While with the US basically halving F-35 procurement, I doubt US would even reach 1000 5th generation by 2030 while China is full steaming ahead with 5th gen procurement and could have ~1300 5th generation(~450 J-20s, 550 J-20As, 300 J-35As) active just for PLAAF while the PLAN would likely have ~120 J-35s and a unknown amount of stealthy jump jets depending on how fast development goes. Other relevant aircraft the USAF/USN has would be Super hornets and F-15EXs, planned procurement for F-15EX is only 144 aircraft while USN can only realistically deploy 6 carriers to Westpac assuming which would be 144 Super hornets and 120 F-35Cs, there's also no way that USAF will deploy what 5th gens they have to Westpac as well. China could realistic have has much 5th gen as the opposition could bring in total in terms of air power. China's airpower is mostly concentrated on the shores anyways and could realistically deploy much more percentage of its force in a Westpac conflict than the US can. Mothballed aircraft don't magically return to service instantly; they need months of restoration work and that is assuming the airframe still has a useful lifespan most of these has been sitting for decades. US Air national guard is called... the air national guard for a reason they can't just divert homeland defense to fight a war lmao neither would the 800 or so filler F-16s do much in a Westpac conflict due to how short legged they are and their age and relatively lack of upgrades.
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Mothballed planes will just be target practice for modern planes. Without AESA radars and modern EW systems, they are no better than targeting drones. Good luck producing the most expensive parts like engines and avionics for those mostly empty airframes when Western MIC are having trouble producing them.
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
China can only disrupt supplies to US forces via the pacific if they defeat US navy in the high seas outside first island chain, for that they need the big advantage in numbers in both Carrier and destroyer force. Chinese Air force cannot fly its planes that far in the 2nd island chain without getting spotted by ground based patriot missiles (US has a 1000 launchers) and Air force in the 1st island chain choke points. So, China has to completely destroy everything in the first island chain. Can they do that with just 2000 rocket force missiles?

That is not accurate. You don't need to defeat the US Navy to impose a blockade.

An alternative is to attack the actual runways and seaports, then no cargo ships or aircraft can resupply.
These are much easier targets than the US Navy.

And remember all of Japan is within 1300km of mainland China, which is within range of piston-engine cruise missiles

---

Note that Russia is again doubling production of Geran piston-engine cruise missiles to 5000 per month.
It should be straightforward for China to run at 10x this production rate, given the difference in manufacturing capacity and economic heft.

That would be 50,000 per month of piston-engine cruise missiles.

When combined with everything else, that should be enough to destroy everything in the First Island Chain.

---

If that happens, there won't be any bases for large numbers of aircraft.
And therefore no large scale air battles.

Remember that the best time to destroy an aircraft is when it is sitting on the ground and vulnerable.
 
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AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
You continue to amaze me sometimes.

that's not a compliment

Well, I just see the US being able to sustain salvoes of 200 missiles/bombs against an isolated target like Iwo Jima.

At least until there are enough carriers and/or J-36
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
Sometimes, I kinda hoped that @Patchwork_Chimera and @MarKoz81 are still around to slam some senses and logic into those people who have neither sense nor logic.

I have actually had discussions with Patchwork_Chimera and MarKoz81

My last interactions with MarKoz81 was with him advocating that it is in China's interests to carve up Russia into little pieces and for China take a chunk of Russian territory. Needless to say, such a policy has neither sense nor logic, given the US-China competition is far more important.
 

charles18

Junior Member
Registered Member
PLA doesn’t have to occupy Guam, just need to smash it to pieces so it can’t be used to support US military operations during the war.
If we're talking about WW3 then it's not enough to simply "neutralize" Guam.
The PLA must occupy Guam.
Americans in the military like to jokingly say "Guam is the USA's most important aircraft carrier."
If the PLA can occupy Guam, put DF-26 missiles and H-6 bombers there, then everything from Japan to Indonesia now becomes within firing range. China will basically own the 2nd island chain. China must take Guam for the simple reason it is too perfectly positioned.

Let's assume when WW3 happens the H-20 bomber and the Type 004 carrier will exist in too few numbers to actually matter.
China's ability to project power beyond 4,000km from land based infrastructure will be severely limited. Therefore those "worthless islands" in the Pacific which hold very little economic value during peacetime will become super critical during wartime. China must occupy those islands, build up the infrastructure there, and use them as jumping points to reach further out into the Pacific. The PLA will go on an Island hopping campaign similar to how a frog crosses a pond by jumping off floating lily pads.
 

Tomboy

Junior Member
Registered Member
Let's assume when WW3 happens the H-20 bomber and the Type 004 carrier will exist in too few numbers to actually matter.
China's ability to project power beyond 4,000km from land based infrastructure will be severely limited. Therefore those "worthless islands" in the Pacific which hold very little economic value during peacetime will become super critical during wartime. China must occupy those islands, build up the infrastructure there, and use them as jumping points to reach further out into the Pacific. The PLA will go on an Island hopping campaign similar to how a frog crosses a pond by jumping off floating lily pads.
I doubt major conflicts is going to happen anytime this decade or even the next decade, China isn't running out of time with Taiwan to force an armed reunion. It's the US that is increasing running out of time to force China into a conflict while China is still weak and building up its resources and economy, if China plays it smart(And I'm sure they would) it wouldn't get baited into a conflict before they are absolutely ready if by then Taiwan has not already opted for a peaceful reunion.
 

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
If we're talking about WW3 then it's not enough to simply "neutralize" Guam.
The PLA must occupy Guam.
Americans in the military like to jokingly say "Guam is the USA's most important aircraft carrier."
If the PLA can occupy Guam, put DF-26 missiles and H-6 bombers there, then everything from Japan to Indonesia now becomes within firing range. China will basically own the 2nd island chain. China must take Guam for the simple reason it is too perfectly positioned.

Let's assume when WW3 happens the H-20 bomber and the Type 004 carrier will exist in too few numbers to actually matter.
China's ability to project power beyond 4,000km from land based infrastructure will be severely limited. Therefore those "worthless islands" in the Pacific which hold very little economic value during peacetime will become super critical during wartime. China must occupy those islands, build up the infrastructure there, and use them as jumping points to reach further out into the Pacific. The PLA will go on an Island hopping campaign similar to how a frog crosses a pond by jumping off floating lily pads.

Tinian and Rota are alternative islands, which are close to Guam.

So it should be feasible to isolate Guam and let it "wither on the vine".
 

SinoAmericanCW

Junior Member
Registered Member
Total ACTIVE fighter jet counts of US and allies:


United States​


  • USAF: ~1,690 fighter aircraft (F‑15, F‑16, F‑22, F‑35)
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
  • USMC: ~297 fighter jets
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
  • USN: Includes ~450 carrier-based F/A‑18E/F Super Hornets plus early F-35Cs (not fully tallied; estimate ~400)

➡️ Estimated total: ~2,387 active fighter jets across Air Force, Marine Corps, and Navy.




Japan​


  • Total JASDF fighter aircraft: ~321 across all fighter types (F‑15J/DJ, F‑2, F‑35A)
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

➡️ Estimated total: ~321 active fighters.




Australia​


  • F‑35A: 72
  • F/A‑18F Super Hornet: 24
  • EA‑18G Growler (electronic‑attack version of the Hornet): 12
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

➡️ Estimated total: 108 combat-capable jets (all active)
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!





Taiwan​


  • F‑16A/B: ~150
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
  • Indigenous Defense Fighter (F‑CK‑1): 129
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
  • F‑5E/F: ~180
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
  • Mirage‑2000‑5: 60 (verified from 24/7 Wall St.)
    Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
  • Other types (like trainers, etc.) exclude non-fighters.

➡️ Estimated total: ~519 active fighter jets.




Summary Table​


CountryActive Fighter Jet Count (All Services)
United States~2,387
Japan~321
Australia~108
Taiwan~519



US numbers only show active count. If you start counting Air national guard and other reserves it will exceed 3000+. Yes, US will not be able to bring everything to a fight. They need to keep some for other regions. But China also has to keep some for other contingencies. So, overall count is in US+allies favour ina huge way.
Some of those figures are too high, others too low.

The best open-source resource is The Military Balance, published by the IISS.

Its latest edition (current as of November 2024) gives the following numbers:

USAF: 138x bomber and 2,010 combat aircraft (including 185x F-22s and 424x F-35s)
USN: 896x combat aircraft (including 68x F-35s)
USMC: 348x combat aircraft (including 171x F-35s)

US total: 138x bomber + 3,254 combat aircraft (including 185x F-22s and 663x F-35s)

Japan (JASDF): 330x combat aircraft (including 39x F-35s)
Australia (RAAF): 99x combat aircraft (including 63x F-35s)
Taiwan (ROCAF): ~322x combat aircraft (a mix of F-CK-1s, F-16s and Mirage 2000s - all the F-5s have been retired)

In comparison, China has:

PLAAF: ~219x bomber and 2,277x+ combat aircraft (including 230x+ J-20s - a *very* conservative way to put it, to say the least)
PLAN: ~126x combat aircraft

China total: ~219x bomber and 2,403x+ combat aircraft (including 230x+ J-20s)
 

tphuang

General
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
Tinian and Rota are alternative islands, which are close to Guam.

So it should be feasible to isolate Guam and let it "wither on the vine".
There is no alternative to Guam. The level of infrastructure and support built up in Guam is unparallel.

If we're talking about WW3 then it's not enough to simply "neutralize" Guam.
The PLA must occupy Guam.
Americans in the military like to jokingly say "Guam is the USA's most important aircraft carrier."
If the PLA can occupy Guam, put DF-26 missiles and H-6 bombers there, then everything from Japan to Indonesia now becomes within firing range. China will basically own the 2nd island chain. China must take Guam for the simple reason it is too perfectly positioned.

Let's assume when WW3 happens the H-20 bomber and the Type 004 carrier will exist in too few numbers to actually matter.
China's ability to project power beyond 4,000km from land based infrastructure will be severely limited. Therefore those "worthless islands" in the Pacific which hold very little economic value during peacetime will become super critical during wartime. China must occupy those islands, build up the infrastructure there, and use them as jumping points to reach further out into the Pacific. The PLA will go on an Island hopping campaign similar to how a frog crosses a pond by jumping off floating lily pads.
what the heck? Why do you need to occupy Guam to control Japan to Indonesia? Have you seen how close China itself is to Japan and Indonesia vs Guam?

People, please just do some basic lookup on the map to understand distances.

Well, I just see the US being able to sustain salvoes of 200 missiles/bombs against an isolated target like Iwo Jima.

At least until there are enough carriers and/or J-36

Okay, so have you done any calculations on how many aircraft are per carrier air wing. Per mission, how many are used for the purpose of attack and how many for escorts? In this case, how many missiles can they carry while realistically fly say 500nm out to launch and then come back? What % of missiles can they launch away?

How, the next question is how many are they launching against shipping targets vs land targets.

Once you land a SHORADS on the island, estimates on what % of subsonic missiles you can shoot down. Now, also factor in fighter jet that can also launch missiles to intercept incoming ground attack missiles.

Let's say you score a few hit on the runway, how quickly can the runway be repaired?


Next, how many days of replenishment do you have? How long can carrier group sustain this type of attack? Is it needed for elsewhere?

I'm not saying that USN cannot overwhelm a position in Iwo Jima, but rather does it make sense for USN to do so when it needs to actually concentrate its fleet for a major showdown at least somewhat close to Taiwan.

If China can keep US from attacking its industrial center, then it's not going to work out for America. It will run out of weapons stockpile after not a long period of time. And without the East Asian supply chain, it's hard to see US MIC being able to keep production going whereas China's factories will be building plenty of missiles and such.
 
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