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Sardaukar20

Captain
Registered Member
I think the guys who wrote these are being deceitful. This stuff was some academic research in transmedium vehicles in this case subsurface - air - subsurface. It wasn't attached to anything military. Speaking of which, why would such a hypothetical weapon really even need to pop out of the water just before flying into the hull of ships??

If you could make a super long range, semi autonomous, AI enhanced torpedo, why not just launch them at your targets. What else is different lol. In fact making them able to pop out of the water and fly towards the target is just epic stupidity unless there are some CIWS/highly effective anti torpedo jamming system guarding ships from torpedos. Speaking of which, ARE there any CIWS equivalents employed by ships dedicated for subsurface threats? There may be electronic types but no interceptor torpedo defence system I'm aware of haha.
I agree. The idea of having something that could pop up from underwater and fly into a ship is nothing new. There is already a category of weapons that does just that: Submarine-launched AshMs. These have been around for quite awhile already.

That being said. I think a Trans-medium 'suicide drone' could potentially be a good idea. It could potentially eliminate the need for submarines to carry and launch them. But if that is what the designers are going for, then they should just design a new torpedo/missile hybrid instead of a drone. A trans-medium drone can be put to much better use in non-munition applications.
 

Maikeru

Captain
Registered Member
VLAs are very much viable ASW systems, not a "torpedo CIWS" (though as you said, there are some capabilities in that realm). A competent ASW effort will be able to detect subsurface contacts outside of the "outer screen" comprised of rotary wing assets, ASW vessels (think 056A, or potentially 054A in some cases), and friendly SS(N/P/K)s, along with whatever other sensors can be brought to the table (MPAs, gliders where applicable, SOSUS-style fixed arrays, etc. etc.). They can then be localized by those assets, and engaged with any mix of outer-ring surface vessel launched VLAs, rotary or fixed wing dropped LWTs, or a fish from whatever flavor of submarine you brought along. Typically this outer ring is extended more along the direction of travel of the task force, and "sanitizes" the waters it travels through.

In the event a submarine penetrates this outer ring, prompt engagement from VLAs can be a life saver. An SSN doesn't know it's detected if done so passively, and it's (for a wide variety of reasons) obviously not always prudent to start slinging torpedos left and right at the first opportunity (that's a quick way to die - and SSN crews typically train to not just sink their customer, but also to not get their own boat turned into an artificial reef in the process), meaning a "core" task force vessel (not part of the outer ASW screen, and typically something more valuable - i.e. DDG, LPD, LHD, CV, etc. etc. etc.) is absolutely presented use cases for such VLAs aside from watching them betray and slaughter their unsuspecting torpedo brethren ( :( ).
Great, except I wasn't talking about VLAs but rather the Type 87 240mm anti-submarine rocket launchers before the main gun on 054As.
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Maikeru

Captain
Registered Member
Ah, I see, that's my fault (been awake for a little too long I suppose lol). I always end up skipping over them in my thinking, since yeah as you said, they're definitely more for last ditch defense, and nothing that gets within their employment range is likely to be bothered by their usage at that point lol.

Sorry again for the mixup, have a good one!
Interesting that the Type 87 was omitted from the 055 though. Perhaps they have a different last-ditch system?
 

Heliox

Junior Member
Registered Member
Interesting that the Type 87 was omitted from the 055 though. Perhaps they have a different last-ditch system?

Type 55 has the Type 726 launchers.
Some tubes there will have ASW rockets or Anti-Torpedo decoys.

"Hey Deng, yeah you in the 056, 15 degrees starboard, ahead flank for me, would you? Why? Oh, y'know, no reason haha, let me just slow down and pull alongside you, it'll look coo!. No no, there's no reason in particular I chose this side....

Good luck!"

Ship launched LWT?
Isn't that somewhat similar to ASW rockets where if you have to shoot one, it's pucker up time?
 

Strangelove

Colonel
Registered Member
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China dispatches advanced main combat equipment to Russian Vostok-2022 drills

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Published: Sep 01, 2022 06:53 PM

Chinese and Russian warships transit simulated mined sea area during the naval exercise Joint Sea-2021 on the morning of October 15. The China-Russia joint naval exercise kicked off in waters near Russia's Peter the Great Bay on the afternoon of October 14, which focused on such training subjects as communications, mine countermeasures, air defense, live-fire shooting at maritime targets, joint maneuvering and joint anti-submarine missions.Photo:Xinhua

Chinese and Russian warships transit simulated mined sea area during the naval exercise Joint Sea-2021 on the morning of October 15. The China-Russia joint naval exercise kicked off in waters near Russia's Peter the Great Bay on the afternoon of October 14, which focused on such training subjects as communications, mine countermeasures, air defense, live-fire shooting at maritime targets, joint maneuvering and joint anti-submarine missions.Photo:Xinhua

China has sent some of its most powerful main combat equipment units of its army, navy and air force to the Russian Vostok-2022 exercises, whose maneuvering phase officially started on Thursday after an opening ceremony a day earlier. The participation of the equipment displayed the depth of China-Russia military cooperation, as the drills will deter uncertainties and contribute to peace and stability in the region, analysts said.

The Chinese troops participating in the drills are mainly from the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Northern Theater Command. They include about 2,000 personnel, more than 300 vehicles of various types, 21 fixed-wing aircraft and helicopters, and three warships, China Central Television (CCTV) reported on Thursday.

This is the first time the PLA has sent three of its forces, the Army, the Navy and the Air Force, to participate in a single Russian drill, observers said.

Type 99 main battle tanks, Type 04 infantry fighting vehicles and Z-19 reconnaissance and attack helicopters of the Army, the Type 055 large destroyer Nanchang of the Navy, and J-10C fighter jets of the Air Force were seen in the CCTV report.

A flotilla of Chinese naval vessels consisting of the Type 055 large destroyer Nanchang, the Type 054A guided missile frigate Yancheng and the Type 903A comprehensive supply ship Dongpinghu sailed through Tsushima Strait, from the East China Sea into the Sea of Japan on Tuesday, according to a press release on the day by the Japanese Ministry of Defense Joint Staff. With the Nanchang confirmed as a participant in the Vostok-2022 drills, the other two vessels are also likely part of the Russian exercise, observers said.

All the above-mentioned vehicles, aircraft and vessels are China's main combat weaponry and equipment, particularly the Type 055 10,000 ton-class destroyer, which is considered one of the most powerful warships in the world, a Chinese military expert who requested anonymity told the Global Times on Thursday.

Their participation showed the breadth and depth of China-Russia military cooperation as well as mutual trust, the expert said.

The exercise will be carried out in four stages: troop assembly and deployment, joint campaign planning, implementation of plans, and troop withdrawal. The participants have jointly set up a directing department and a campaign command structure, CCTV reported, citing the Chinese joint campaign headquarter.

The navies of China and Russia will conduct anti-ship, anti-air and anti-submarine defense drills in the Sea of Japan. They will work out joint practical actions to defend sea lanes and areas of maritime economic activity, and to assist ground forces, according to a press release from the Russian Defense Ministry on Thursday.

While the drills are not aimed at a third party and are not related to current situations, they serve as a deterrent against uncertainties such as ill-intended external forces, hegemony and power politics, analysts said, noting that as two major military powers in the world, China and Russia's military cooperation will contribute to peace and stability in the region.

The maneuvers of the Vostok-2022 are also seeing participation by Algeria, India, Belarus, Tajikistan and Mongolia, among other countries. The Vostok-2022 maneuvers will involve over 50,000 military personnel, more than 5,000 weapons and military equipment, including 140 aircraft, 60 warships, boats and support vessels, the Russian Defense Ministry said.
 
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