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SilentObserver

Junior Member
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Malaysia a case study in how China wins friends and influences Asia​

US simply cannot match what Beijing is able to offer its neighbors
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That's the whole point.

China offers a better deal.

Full stop. Unless the Americans can somehow offer a better deal, then the current situation will persist into future, diminishing American influence a little bit more each year as we go along.

As we can see currently, the Americans have no capacity to offer a better deal, so it resorts to coercion to its allies and negative campaigning against China (stories of fake genocide).

Just my opinion but this does not have a chance.

The stories of fake genocide, does that stop America from doing business with the Chinese?

Yes? No?

Why would anyone else be any different?

Unless we think Australia or corrupt UK politicians are the center of the world.

Someone is being played. It ain't the Chinese.

:p

Peter Zeihan said it fairly directly in his talks, America bribed together an alliance system to fight the cold war.

The world had 2 isolated camps, American led and Soviet led systems. Europe and Japan were the only non American or Soviet industrial regions and were devastated by WW2. America provided an attractive offer for these countries, a stable international trading system to prosper in. The exchange was economics for geopolitical patronage.

US used to account for roughly half of global gdp right after ww2, now down to a quarter. As America's market power experiences a relative decline, negotiating power also declines. Instead of carrots, the stick is used more often as a policy tool.

Traditional American allies are reluctant to participate in this new cold war as the benefits seen in the previous confrontation are less apparent now. We are seeing America using stalling tactics like media manipulation and disruption of the international system to both slow down progress of competitors and make other nations understand America is the kingpin to the international system (SWIFT, world police, strategic technologies). All this before China becomes much harder to deal with.
 

horse

Colonel
Registered Member
All this before China becomes much harder to deal with.
Agree, China is doing fine.

Forget about the before, what about now?

When the economic growth of China rate is double the America rate, and that was before the pandemic, there are really no options other than improve yourself to compete better.

To compete better, we have to improve ourselves, enhance our own capabilities.

When America only tries to do, is to stop China or slow it down, and in the same time does not improve itself, it has no chance of competing with China, as China will always offer the better deal.

This is already true today in some cases, 5G being one of them.

:D
 

B.I.B.

Captain
What I want to see is when China recognises Native American genocide n, aboriginal genocide, Algerian genocide,British colonial empire genocide.

This entire thing is intended for a particular group of audience. China has the tool it needs to respond. The question is, can they & will they.
Actually, under different aspects of genocide you can have all the 5 eye countries for misdoings.Australia engaged in the forcible removal of aboriginal and Torres Straight Islander children from their parents under the belief that they would live better lives in a white society.

But back in New Zealand, anger has been growing at the state of child welfare. Activists say the state intervention in Māori families reeks of racism and a dark colonial legacy, reminiscent of Australia’s “stolen generation”. An open letter titled “Hands off our Tamariki” has been signed by more than 17,000 people.
and what Canada did is embarrasingly similar to what they are accusing of China

"
Soon after its independence, Canada asserted control over indigenous peoples and lands. The Indian Act (1876), which is still upheld with amendments in Canadian law, was imposed on First Nations peoples without their consultation. It was, and still is, a legal reaction to Canada’s treaty obligations. It limits the self-governance of First Nations peoples, their control over indigenous lands and services they use, such as education and health care.

During this period, First Nations peoples, like Native Americans in the US, were also confined on reservations. Within these spaces, Canadian authorities attempted to suppress indigenous cultural practices. The Potlatch festival for example, a practice which could be used to redistribute wealth or as a rite of passage depending on the culture, was made into a criminal offence in section 3 of An Act Further to Amend the Indian Act (1880). This ban lasted until 1951.

This was all part of a larger process by which Canadian authorities were consciously trying to eliminate indigenous identities and assimilate these peoples into Canadian culture, largely because they wanted them, as an ethnic minority group with unique treaty statuses, to disappear. In 1920, Duncan Campbell Scott, the Canadian Deputy Superintendent General of Indian Affairs said of his government’s policy: ‘Our objective is to continue until there is not an Indian that has not been absorbed into the body politic, and there is no Indian question, and no Indian Department.’

There were many reasons why Canadians wanted to assimilate indigenous peoples into their society. Some were well intentioned, albeit condescending, such as the belief that it was only by assuming Western culture that indigenous peoples could survive in a modern world. Other reasons were more malicious, such as the belief that this process would invalidate the claims of indigenous peoples to their lands, meaning it could be divided up and seized for Canadians."
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NiuBiDaRen

Brigadier
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I don't understand what France is saying when it says it wants to 'protect its exclusive economic interests' in the South China Sea. What, do they still think Vietnam and Cambodia belong to the French colonial office? Did Britain just construct an additional aircraft carrier just to contain China, since they wish to deploy their second aircraft carrier permanently near China?
 

NiuBiDaRen

Brigadier
Registered Member
We might need to rename the SCS Strategy thread or Westpac air operations thread since there'll be even more activity than usual in the next few years by Western nations. USA plans to deploy two, three, or even four aircraft carrier groups to Indo-Pacific. Plus UK sending an aircraft carrier group. Germany and France also pledged to join in more frequently, besides the usual Australia-Japan pair. China will retaliate with more action, so there'll be more activity and missile tests and military construction to watch out for.
 

ansy1968

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I don't understand what France is saying when it says it wants to 'protect its exclusive economic interests' in the South China Sea. What, do they still think Vietnam and Cambodia belong to the French colonial office? Did Britain just construct an additional aircraft carrier just to contain China, since they wish to deploy their second aircraft carrier permanently near China?
@Crang

Hi bro, you're absent yesterday :cool: , all of these are just press releases , let them burn their hard earned money in these "show of power" rather than fixed their economy. And if I'm CGTN, its a golden opportunity to hit back especially on BBC, I'll make a program about the 8 nation that sack and burn the summer palace in Beijing and to correlates the current / present situation.
 
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horse

Colonel
Registered Member
I don't understand what France is saying when it says it wants to 'protect its exclusive economic interests' in the South China Sea. What, do they still think Vietnam and Cambodia belong to the French colonial office? Did Britain just construct an additional aircraft carrier just to contain China, since they wish to deploy their second aircraft carrier permanently near China?
Forget where it is on the map, but the French still owns islands in the South Pacific as their territory, the legacy of their imperial past. Those islands were where they did their nuclear testing, I believe I remember that part correctly.

Therefore, they visit their own military base. Since they have to transit the South China Sea like always, now they talk it up, but really, who cares.
 

horse

Colonel
Registered Member
Just ranting here, but this Freedom of Navigation Operations, that is the among the dumbest strategy I have ever seen.

This is the barking dog strategy.

Imagine 10 to 20 years in the future. The trade volume in the South China Sea will double, and the US Navy would have watched the trade volume double, because they had a front row seat to watch the trade volume doubling between China and ASEAN and other neighbours. So the US Navy conducts these FONOPs to watch China and the region build up their economic clout, with America excluded from it. Imagine China and America doubling their trade in 10 to 20 years, that never will happen.

Maybe the US Navy is doing these FONOPs so that one day they will attack all the container ships. When they do that, they attack the interests of all countries in Asia, including their friends and treaty allies. Is the US Navy going to that? Is the US Navy trying to help with the FONOPs?

In fact, no one knows what the US Navy is trying to accomplish, other than the barking dog strategy, which is not even a strategy. Maybe in the 36 Tricks book, they had something different, but a barking dog strategy cannot work.

If the US Navy does not bite, then all they do is watch the region move up in the world which does not mean US interests are benefitted. If the US Navy does bite, then no one would want them around anymore.

All China has done so far, is basically bark back. So I guess on some level, it is working. <rant></rant>

:oops:
 

Mr T

Senior Member
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The G7 -> D10 plan (to invite Australia, India and South Korea) championed by UK seems to have fallen apart.

In particular, Italy decided to stand up and say no, keep Australia out because they are China-haters.
You're conflating two separate issues.

The first regards considerations of expanding the G7 permanently but those were in the early stages. As the article says, this plan hasn't progressed ("deferred" as the article says). You're also misrepresenting what the Italian diplomats said. They made no reference to Australia, rather it was a concern that expanding the G7 in that fashion would be perceived by China as an anti-Chinese alliance (because the three countries proposed to be added weren't in the top 7 developed economies - only SK being in the top 10 & developed).

The second issue is inviting SK, Australia and India to this year's G7, which is going ahead.
 
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