JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

[Baibar of Jalat]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

India's Air Force Chief had this to say about the JF-17 :-

"The JF-17 is a fairly good plane, though there is nothing sensational about it. It is a class of lower than the F-16. I flew the simulator at Singapore air show. It is capable, but nothing that bothers me."

He said this in a recent interview.

Date of flying a simulator? I remember an Indian journalist compared simulator proformance to Ambassdor car made in India.

Generally J 10 and F 16 block 52 will be the premier aircraft. Everyone knows that. Plus as we seen the FC 1 has envolved from being a better version of J 7's. To something on par with F 16s in terms of flying ability. In terms of avionics the JF 17 will eventually be better then the upgraded Pakistani F 16s, when newer radar and avionics are developed.

Seperately I hope, Chinese avionics are fitted in next batch of FC 1, why because Pakistan can rapidly import Chinese missiles without being sanctioned in times of war.

 

[Indianfighter]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

Interesting quote, but I think he's being a bit misleading comparing it to the F-16 because inevitably we assume he means Pakistani F-16As, which it is undoubtedly superior to if only by virtue of its BVR capability.

Well, he could also have meant the F-16s that are on sale to India under MRCA. But it's true that by far the JF-17 is the most capable jet in the PAF presently i.e. before they get newer F-16s and J-10s.

 

[mean_bird]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

India's Air Force Chief had this to say about the JF-17 :-

"The JF-17 is a fairly good plane, though there is nothing sensational about it. It is a class of lower than the F-16. I flew the simulator at Singapore air show. It is capable, but nothing that bothers me."

He said this in a recent interview.

Is it available on youtube? or any link to it?

 

[Indianfighter]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

^ ^ It appeared in

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. The entire interview is on pages 54, 55.

 

[Semi-Lobster]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

^ ^ It appeared in

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. The entire interview is on pages 54, 55.

A very good interview, Chief Fali Homi Major is certainly an experienced individual with decades of experience, although his F-16 comment I believe is more directed at current F-16 Block 50+, the F-16 is over 30 years old. The old F-16As are worlds apart from their more capable successors. I'm not surprised about his comments on the JF-17, it is capable enough but nothing remarkable as the aircraft was never designed to be terribly remarkable in the first place but cost effective.

 

[adeptitus]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

For years the commonly cited capability of the JF-17/FC-1 was "70% of F-16". When I read the specs, what came to mind was that the JF-17 was Pakistan's "IDF". Where Taiwan's IDF was supported by US defense industry, Pakistan's JF-17 was supported by China's.

A more recent example is S. Korea's F/A-50. The aircraft is obviously inferior to F-16 C/D, but it'd be silly to compare them on even level.

The JF-17 project also brings Pakistan's domestic military aviation industry up to date. Here's a good article on China's assistance to Pakistan military aviation industry in the past:

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The PAC has performed valuable service in maintaining and upgrading J-6/F-6, J-7/F-7, Mirage-III/V, etc. aircraft. But those aircraft are now largely obsolete. The JF-17 project brings PAC up to date in manufacturing modern fighter aircraft. Though the JF-17 is inferior to F-16 C/D, it can also be said that there are very few countries in this world that has the manufacturing capability to produce, or even assemble fighter aircraft.

 

[mean_bird]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

^ ^ It appeared in

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

. The entire interview is on pages 54, 55.

thanks.. a good interview
just out of curiosity, at what age do IAF officers retire ?

For years the commonly cited capability of the JF-17/FC-1 was "70% of F-16". When I read the specs, what came to mind was that the JF-17 was Pakistan's "IDF". Where Taiwan's IDF was supported by US defense industry, Pakistan's JF-17 was supported by China's.

A more recent example is S. Korea's F/A-50. The aircraft is obviously inferior to F-16 C/D, but it'd be silly to compare them on even level.

The JF-17 project also brings Pakistan's domestic military aviation industry up to date. Here's a good article on China's assistance to Pakistan military aviation industry in the past:

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

The PAC has performed valuable service in maintaining and upgrading J-6/F-6, J-7/F-7, Mirage-III/V, etc. aircraft. But those aircraft are now largely obsolete. The JF-17 project brings PAC up to date in manufacturing modern fighter aircraft. Though the JF-17 is inferior to F-16 C/D, it can also be said that there are very few countries in this world that has the manufacturing capability to produce, or even assemble fighter aircraft.

I don't understand when people say Jf-17 is inferior to F-16...are they talking about maneuverability? avionics and radar? weapons? F-16A/Bs are remarkably good in maneuverability and quite agile...still better than a lot of modern-day aircraft.

I believe, as the ACM PAF once said when asked the same question, that JF-17s are quite comparable to all modern 4/4.5 gen aircraft...clearly, it currently lacks certain things which he mentioned such as only 7 hardpoints, avionics and radar, weapons system which are quite good but maybe not equal to say a higher block F-16, or Rafale/Eurofighter.

But with the proposed western avionics, and AESA radar already on offer and the MICA or the meteor BVRAAMs (both on offer) ...I do not see how a JF-17 cannot be called a true, capable 4.5 gen aircraft. Not to mention that the ACM specifically said in his interview that they are working on increasing the hardpoints to 9.

And I am not talking about fanboy stuff like stealth JF-17, or TVC, and what not (even though pshamim from pakdef does mention a future twin-tail version) but stuff that's already on offer and realizable in the near foreseeable future

 

[Indianfighter]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

I agree. Manufacturing the JF-17 will give the Pakistani aviation industry experience and knowledge, which till now was nothing more than an MRO facility with very limited capability in manufacturing aircraft components.

India was in the same stage 30 years ago when it first started licence building Migs and Jaguars and then progressed to designing the indigenous ... ahem ... you-know-what.
China too came up this way, first by licence building F-7s and then improving the designs to make J-8, FC-1 and finally designing J-10.

There are no geniuses. A country has to be taught first. Even Russia got a lot of help from UK, Germany and France before it's own aviation industry could take root sometime during WW2.

 

[Munir]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

Unfortunately the discussion is diverted towards both sides pointing at the other. But in essence BillBoy said the exact truth words. Look at Israel, South Africa, North Korea, Iran , China etc. They all succeeded cause they are marked as outcast by the western nations. The more they are pushed the more they will move towards national production. There is no alternative. India is indeed seen as big market and the western powers see no reason to blaim them for exporting terrorism in Kashmir or Sri Lanka... And as seen, the Indian facilities are maybe marketed as national but in reality the assemble foreign parts or "co-operate" with other producers. Their major productions are not really accepted by their own forces.

 

[Spike]

Re: JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread 2009

I think our friend billyboy might want to change his "Location" under his avatar. Sorry for the OT.