JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

[Deino]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Pakistan Air Force looking towards western engine for their JF-17 Thunders.

Is that just Your personal opinion or only a statement ??? If not please tell us the source !!

In my opinion that's completely ridiculous as it would waste additional time and –again IMO – there’s no Western engine available that fits just in place ! It would take much too long to redesign the rear-fuselage, no Western aero-engine-manufacture would be allowed to deliver any of its high-end turbofans to Chengdu to assist the integration and for the PAF such an aircraft would come much too late.

IMO they will probably wait for the WS-13.

Deino

 

[Nomi929]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Is that just Your personal opinion or only a statement ??? If not please tell us the source !!

In my opinion that's completely ridiculous as it would waste additional time and –again IMO – there’s no Western engine available that fits just in place ! It would take much too long to redesign the rear-fuselage, no Western aero-engine-manufacture would be allowed to deliver any of its high-end turbofans to Chengdu to assist the integration and for the PAF such an aircraft would come much too late.

IMO they will probably wait for the WS-13.

Deino

Its not my Personal opinion or wish!

PAF Air Chief today in an TV interview said that they are also looking for Western Engine for JF-17.

Reasons he gave are

1) PAF not fully satisfied with Performence of RD-93.
2) Life span of Russian/Chinese engine is 1/4th of western engine.

He also said that, current batch of 50 aircrafts will be of this Russian engine and Chinese Radar + missies.

For the next Batch of 50, they will consider French offer for Thales RC-400 + MBDA MICA along with other western options, and compare it with what Chinese has to offer at that time.

Regarding Western Engines , PAF has been using and maintaing SNECMA engines for last three deacdes.

So there might some solution from the french on the table. Some existing engine (like of SNECMA used in Mirage 2005) can be modified to fit into JF-17.

Best Regards.

 

[Totoro]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

They're trying to get the best deal possible out of chinese, once the second contract for the second batch becomes a reality. It's called healthy competition. It's certainly possible but there's many things to be taken into account, especially considering it's a decision to be made in a few years and not now. Too many to say if it is probable.

 

[Nomi929]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

They're trying to get the best deal possible out of chinese, once the second contract for the second batch becomes a reality. It's called healthy competition. It's certainly possible but there's many things to be taken into account, especially considering it's a decision to be made in a few years and not now. Too many to say if it is probable.

NO!

PAF chief said that decision about second batch of jf-17 (Avionics+Engine) will be finalized within next 12 months.

 

[Deino]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Its not my Personal opinion or wish!

PAF Air Chief today in an TV interview said that they are also looking for Western Engine for JF-17.

Reasons he gave are

1) PAF not fully satisfied with Performence of RD-93.
2) Life span of Russian/Chinese engine is 1/4th of western engine.

He also said that, current batch of 50 aircrafts will be of this Russian engine and Chinese Radar + missies.

For the next Batch of 50, they will consider French offer for Thales RC-400 + MBDA MICA along with other western options, and compare it with what Chinese has to offer at that time.

Regarding Western Engines , PAF has been using and maintaing SNECMA engines for last three deacdes.

So there might some solution from the french on the table. Some existing engine (like of SNECMA used in Mirage 2005) can be modified to fit into JF-17.

Best Regards.

Thanks for that but even if I haven't read that interview I think a Western engine isn't realistic.

I agree with You that the PAF has many years experience in operating and maintaining French engines but the Mirage 2000’s engine is much too large in comparison to the RD-93/WS-13 which would result in a completely new aircraft. The only French engine that would fit is the current M.88 from the Rafale and also this would require an extensive redesign of the rear-fuselage, airintake and evaluation of systems, flight characteristics and so on … I think such an aircraft would be too expensive and too late available.


Deino

 

[flyzies]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

NO!

PAF chief said that decision about second batch of jf-17 (Avionics+Engine) will be finalized within next 12 months.

Why dont you provide the source? Because all the news available is this and it says nothing about when the second batch will be ready.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Accord soon with China on JF-17 jets

ISLAMABAD, Sept 6: Pakistan and China are ready to sign a contract for serial production of the first batch of forty-two JF-17 Thunder aircraft after 10 months of deliberations on the configuration of different parts of the planes.

In an interview with DawnNews TV, Chief of Air Staff, Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mehmood Ahmed said Pakistan had already received eight JF-17s and added that production of the 42 aircraft was likely to be completed by the end of 2010.

He said JF-17s had Russian RD-93 engine installed on them but Pakistan Air Force was looking for some western engine for the new batch of the aircraft. He said the life of the Russian engine was almost one-fourth as compared to the western engines.

The air chief said that since President Nicolas Sarkozy had assumed office the French had changed their policy towards Pakistan and were now willing to offer Air Borne Radar RC-400, mission computer and other equipment for the JF-17s. The PAF is evaluating the French offer.

 

[Nomi929]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Why dont you provide the source? Because all the news available is this and it says nothing about when the second batch will be ready.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Accord soon with China on JF-17 jets

ISLAMABAD, Sept 6: Pakistan and China are ready to sign a contract for serial production of the first batch of forty-two JF-17 Thunder aircraft after 10 months of deliberations on the configuration of different parts of the planes.

In an interview with DawnNews TV, Chief of Air Staff, Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mehmood Ahmed said Pakistan had already received eight JF-17s and added that production of the 42 aircraft was likely to be completed by the end of 2010.

He said JF-17s had Russian RD-93 engine installed on them but Pakistan Air Force was looking for some western engine for the new batch of the aircraft. He said the life of the Russian engine was almost one-fourth as compared to the western engines.

The air chief said that since President Nicolas Sarkozy had assumed office the French had changed their policy towards Pakistan and were now willing to offer Air Borne Radar RC-400, mission computer and other equipment for the JF-17s. The PAF is evaluating the French offer.

Today is Air Force Day in Pakistan.

So about 4 hrs ago DAWN TV conducted an 30 min interview PAF Chief.

Details or even clip of that whole interview will be out in next 1-2 dayz.

The link u r mentioning is just a news (outline), I have seen the whole interview.

 

[Nomi929]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

Thanks for that but even if I haven't read that interview I think a Western engine isn't realistic.

I agree with You that the PAF has many years experience in operating and maintaining French engines but the Mirage 2000’s engine is much too large in comparison to the RD-93/WS-13 which would result in a completely new aircraft. The only French engine that would fit is the current M.88 from the Rafale and also this would require an extensive redesign of the rear-fuselage, airintake and evaluation of systems, flight characteristics and so on … I think such an aircraft would be too expensive and too late available.


Deino

ACM just said that they might be looking for some western engine for JF-17.

As France has offered RC-400 radar, which is based on RDY2 radar used in Mirage 2000-5 but 20% smaller in size to accomodate some aircrafts.

So, maybe possible some thing like scenario. with some some current western engine.

 

[Totoro]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

There is a translated transcript on the interview on the internet (google for it) and it does mention that the air marshall expects the further 42 planes (locally assembled in Pakistan) which constitute the first batch (8 planes from china would then be batch zero) to be delivered to the air force by the end of 2010. If we can assume the second batch would come right away after the first one, that'd mean possibility of new engines and/or avionics in 2011. I guess it's quite possible the decision to equip that new batch might be made some two years prior to that, meaning sometime in 2009. We have to remember that the details concerning the first batch were probably aranged sometime before 2007., perhaps even 2006., even though planes are just starting to be delivered.

All that being said, it's still jockeying for position on behalf of Pakistani air force. They have other options and if chinese aren't willing or able to offer a matching avionics/weapons package/engines, they will shop elsewhere.

 

[tphuang]

Re: New JF-17/FC-1 Fighter Aircraft thread

ACM just said that they might be looking for some western engine for JF-17.

As France has offered RC-400 radar, which is based on RDY2 radar used in Mirage 2000-5 but 20% smaller in size to accomodate some aircrafts.

So, maybe possible some thing like scenario. with some some current western engine.

I'm just not sure what Western engine they can fit in there? M-88 was the only one that is small enough, but then it's lighter than RD-93, so you will have to do more flight tests. WS-13 is the obvious answer, but it's going to be even less reliable than RD-93 in the beginning.