Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

beijing_bandar

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Here we have some "wild" dreams again... ;)
Wonderful news. India is making a bad mistake. The Indian Defense Minister said earlier in the week "work" has started on the third carrier.
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Not exactly clear what work is. The cost of an aircraft carrier along with planes will be astronomical for India.

Matheswaran noted the cost of the Vikrant, once fully equipped with aircraft, would likely be "$10–11 billion". "The third proposed carrier, Vishal, still in conceptual stages, is expected to cost $6–8 billion and take 10–14 years to build. Including an aerial component of F-18E or Rafale aircraft at current prices, the total cost is likely to be in the order of $16–17 billion," Matheswaran wrote in The Interpreter.
India could not possibly afford the third carrier unless their defense planners assumed the economy was set to grow dramatically. The two richest men in India have over the last several weeks competed with each other to see which one has the more outlandish prediction of Indian GDP at midcentury.

Mukesh Ambani says Indian economy to grow 13-fold to $40 trillion by 2047 | Mint (November 25)
India is set to become a $30 trillion economy by 2050, a nearly 10-fold jump from its current size, according to Asia’s richest man Gautam Adani. (November 19)
I predict the Indian economy will not even reach $10 trillion by 2040. Nominal GDP in China increased by 134% from $6.08 trillion to $14.28 trillion from 2010-19, while nominal GDP during the same period in India grew 72% from $1.67 trillion to $2.87 trillion in 2019. There is no way India will grow to $30 or $40 trillion unless the dollar collapses in value by midcentury.

I hope the Indian Defense Minister is not exaggerating. As in the project hasn't really gotten off the ground and could get shelved later on. A few months ago, I suggested PLAN should send an aircraft carrier to Pakistan as a show of force in the Indian Ocean to galvanize India to build a third aircraft carrier. It would cripple the Indian defense capital expenditure budget for years to come. Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.
 

Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
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Wonderful news. India is making a bad mistake. The Indian Defense Minister said earlier in the week "work" has started on the third carrier.
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Not exactly clear what work is. The cost of an aircraft carrier along with planes will be astronomical for India.


India could not possibly afford the third carrier unless their defense planners assumed the economy was set to grow dramatically. The two richest men in India have over the last several weeks competed with each other to see which one has the more outlandish prediction of Indian GDP at midcentury.



I predict the Indian economy will not even reach $10 trillion by 2040. Nominal GDP in China increased by 134% from $6.08 trillion to $14.28 trillion from 2010-19, while nominal GDP during the same period in India grew 72% from $1.67 trillion to $2.87 trillion in 2019. There is no way India will grow to $30 or $40 trillion unless the dollar collapses in value by midcentury.

I hope the Indian Defense Minister is not exaggerating. As in the project hasn't really gotten off the ground and could get shelved later on. A few months ago, I suggested PLAN should send an aircraft carrier to Pakistan as a show of force in the Indian Ocean to galvanize India to build a third aircraft carrier. It would cripple the Indian defense capital expenditure budget for years to come. Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.
Just look at the kind of discussions Indian media loves to engage with: Two Front War with China and Pakistan. In what UNIVERSE is India even equipped to handle such scenario? Why would China attack or even invade India? What's the strategic goal and aims for China to do so? To absorb millions of impoverished people? To occupy a piece of real estate that do not offer any meaningful benefits to China. These sort of questions are never factored by these type of journalists and there's no distinction between civilian commentators a.k.a. chicken hawks and their retired military officers most of whom are more bellicose than their civilian counterparts.

I have no idea why and where Indians got this bravado and hubiritistic attitude that they're a world beating army or that they come from a lineage of world conquering race.

 

Temstar

Brigadier
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I think building a second Vikrant is a decent decision, nevermind the 5 years thing but it's more pragmatic than the other talks about a 3rd carrier would be something like a PANG, nuclear powered and catapults.

If they go ahead though you'll think the navy will have to cut something, say TEDBF and just buy F-18. The 2nd Vikrant would presumably also have the lift problem fixed to fit F-18 or Rafale-M better.
 

Deino

Lieutenant General
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I think building a second Vikrant is a decent decision, nevermind the 5 years thing but it's more pragmatic than the other talks about a 3rd carrier would be something like a PANG, nuclear powered and catapults.

If they go ahead though you'll think the navy will have to cut something, say TEDBF and just buy F-18. The 2nd Vikrant would presumably also have the lift problem fixed to fit F-18 or Rafale-M better.


I totally agree and indeed 5 years are not impossible, as long as they would not only talk, but work!

My point is - just with the new trainer - it all makes sense as long a budget is allocated, the necessary decisions like what type of aircraft it will operate and the lift issue is rectified is made, but typical for India they plan, talk, do a lot of chest-bumping and not more.

And just fitting to the discussion, I got this to my surely provocative Tweet:

 

KampfAlwin

Junior Member
Registered Member
I totally agree and indeed 5 years are not impossible, as long as they would not only talk, but work!

My point is - just with the new trainer - it all makes sense as long a budget is allocated, the necessary decisions like what type of aircraft it will operate and the lift issue is rectified is made, but typical for India they plan, talk, do a lot of chest-bumping and not more.

And just fitting to the discussion, I got this to my surely provocative Tweet:

You really offended a lot of Indians lmao, you're now Chinese @Deino !
 

Bellum_Romanum

Brigadier
Registered Member
I totally agree and indeed 5 years are not impossible, as long as they would not only talk, but work!

My point is - just with the new trainer - it all makes sense as long a budget is allocated, the necessary decisions like what type of aircraft it will operate and the lift issue is rectified is made, but typical for India they plan, talk, do a lot of chest-bumping and not more.

And just fitting to the discussion, I got this to my surely provocative Tweet:

Who's that angry Indian dude anyway? He seems dismissive of not just @Deino but he seemed to dismiss a retired Indian Army officer who runs Force India defense magazine (if my assumption is correct) since he was just a "lowly Capt. artillery officer." Who and what military record of service did he serve on, If he ever did serve at all? And what makes his "opinion" much more relevant, factual, credible compared to Deino and others? I guess it's a useless question for me to ask since we unfortunately know the most obvious answer to this phenomenon.
 

Mohsin77

Senior Member
Registered Member
I totally agree and indeed 5 years are not impossible, as long as they would not only talk, but work!

My point is - just with the new trainer - it all makes sense as long a budget is allocated, the necessary decisions like what type of aircraft it will operate and the lift issue is rectified is made, but typical for India they plan, talk, do a lot of chest-bumping and not more.

And just fitting to the discussion, I got this to my surely provocative Tweet:


you are way too polite @Deino , let's go beat this guy up
 

Deino

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Who's that angry Indian dude anyway? He seems dismissive of not just @Deino but he seemed to dismiss a retired Indian Army officer who runs Force India defense magazine (if my assumption is correct) since he was just a "lowly Capt. artillery officer." Who and what military record of service did he serve on, If he ever did serve at all? And what makes his "opinion" much more relevant, factual, credible compared to Deino and others? I guess it's a useless question for me to ask since we unfortunately know the most obvious answer to this phenomenon.


Seems to be Saurav Jha and the main argument by many was, "he has a huuuuuge group of followers in India"!

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siegecrossbow

General
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I totally agree and indeed 5 years are not impossible, as long as they would not only talk, but work!

My point is - just with the new trainer - it all makes sense as long a budget is allocated, the necessary decisions like what type of aircraft it will operate and the lift issue is rectified is made, but typical for India they plan, talk, do a lot of chest-bumping and not more.

And just fitting to the discussion, I got this to my surely provocative Tweet:


The point is not so much that the Indian trainer is a copy of a Chinese one as the fact that it is a throwback to a design from the 1960s. I don’t think he understands.
 
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