CV-17 Shandong (002 carrier) Thread I ...News, Views and operations

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Jeff Head

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From Asia times February it is and 2 type 003 will be built simultaneously in Dalian and Jiangnan ?

February sea trial’ for China’s first homemade carrier
The new carrier, known as Type 002, is expected to be tested after the Lunar New Year; third-generation carriers may be built concurrently after that
By ASIA TIMES STAFF DECEMBER 29, 2017 3:09 PM (UTC+8)
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Speculation is rife again that China’s first domestically built aircraft carrier, codenamed Type 002, will embark on her maiden voyage into the Bohai Sea from the Dalian Shipyard after the Chinese Lunar New Year break in February.

During the year’s last press conference on Thursday, a spokesperson for the People’s Liberation Army fielded questions about the construction of Type 002, but minced his words on the exact timetable for the indigenous carrier’s sea trial and commission.

Yet the Beijing-based Global Times reported on Friday that Type 002 – almost an exact replica of the Liaoning, a Soviet-built and PLA-revamped carrier – will sail out of its dock for the first time around the Lunar New Year holiday. It cited fresh photos taken in December as evidence.

The apex of the vessel’s “island” has been fitted out with electronically-scanned array radars, and metal scaffolding is being peeled from the exterior, as seen in these photos.

“For sure the speed is impressive, as it has only taken 10 months after the [new carrier’s] dry dock was flooded for the first time in April till the builder’s trial and acceptance trial at sea, to be conducted in February 2018,” a military expert told the newspaper.

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Metal scaffolding is being peeled off from the exterior of the island structure on the Type 002 carrier. Photo: Handout
A separate post in a WeChat account managed by Xinhua also revealed that the carrier is “ready to go” after some finishing touches are put on the flight deck and the temperature of the Bohai Sea rises.

Meanwhile, Chinese news portal Sina says that two “next generation” Chinese carriers, from a program called Type 003, are rumored to have done away the upward-curved ramp on the bow for a more advanced electromagnetic launch system. These may be built concurrently at the Dalian facility and the Jiangnan Shipyard on Shanghai’s Changxing Island.

Evidence backing this was the fact that 1,600-ton gantry cranes have been erected at Jiangnan Shipyard’s No-3 Dock, the website said.


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The Jiangnan Shipyard on Shanghai’s Changxing Island. Photo: Google Maps
Previous reports all suggested that China had completed the design for the third-generation homemade carriers that, although steam propelled like their predecessors, would be capable of generating adequate power to power these launch pads.

Onshore tests of linear motors to catapult aircraft have seen “more than 1,000 successful takeoffs”, giving the PLA confidence to try out a range of seagoing airbase technology on Type 003 carriers, right after the Pentagon commissioned the Gerald R Ford in July, the first US carrier with such electromagnetic launch pads.

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An artist’s impression of the Type 003 carrier created by Chinese military fans. The next generation carriers have a flat flight deck. Photo: Handout
February builders trials sounds right.

But I do not believe thata bnoth the builder's trials and the acceptance trials will necessarily come in the same month.

They will want to address whateveer they find from the builder's trials and depending on what that is, take it out again to make sure it is addressed.

Builder's trials and acceptaance trials foucs on increasing areas of importance and use.

My guess is that the acceptance trials may follow by 2-4 months, depending on what the intial builder's trials show.

At any rate, it is still fast progress.

Now, they are talking about potentially building two CATOBAR carriers concurrently.

We shall see. That may be risky on such a new thing. These carriers will be larger and more complex.

But I belive the two STOBAR carriers will be followed by two CATOBAR carriers and have been saying as muh for several years. Whethjer they will be built concurrently is yet to be seen.

I ecpect that ultimately China will probably have six carrier altogether. So another two CATOBAR carriers will follow at some point.

Wil these first two be nuclear and EMALS?

If they are, I expect the next two will be essentially the same class.

If not, then the second two probably will be nuclear and EMALS.

Time will tell.
 

fatfreddy

New Member
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Just a question that might sound silly to the old hands. I noted that the mounting of communications and radar etc took quite a while yet it would appear that the building of the island took a short time. So why don't they mount all the equipment etc before installing the island on the carrier? That would save a few months.
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
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Moderator - World Affairs
Just a question that might sound silly to the old hands. I noted that the mounting of communications and radar etc took quite a while yet it would appear that the building of the island took a short time. So why don't they mount all the equipment etc before installing the island on the carrier? That would save a few months.

add extra weight and risk damaging them when lifting them to the ship
 

Jeff Head

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Just a question that might sound silly to the old hands. I noted that the mounting of communications and radar etc took quite a while yet it would appear that the building of the island took a short time. So why don't they mount all the equipment etc before installing the island on the carrier? That would save a few months.
It would take the same amount of time...and fitting them and then dialing them in or tuning them is best done once they are installed onto the ship.

If they tried to do that off the ship, they could easily be damaged or at the very least have to be reset once they were on the ship.

It woul take the same amount of time in any case and just delay them being installed...only to almost surely have to spend more time readjusting them once they wee placed on the ship.
 

damitch300

Junior Member
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It would take the same amount of time...and fitting them and then dialing them in or tuning them is best done once they are installed onto the ship.

If they tried to do that off the ship, they could easily be damaged or at the very least have to be reset once they were on the ship.

It woul take the same amount of time in any case and just delay them being installed...only to almost surely have to spend more time readjusting them once they wee placed on the ship.


Its mostly plug and play.
Only the Height (for beam control) and blanking needs to be adjusted according to the fitment location.(for these carriers there is no blanking sincs they dont "shine" to a structure)
And ofcourse auxilliary unit testing I.E cooling and power unit.

For example.
The complete APAR masts. I masts. Smart l systems are made and tested at Thales before shipping.
The same goes for EMPAR and SAMPSON and Herakles systems (no fixed phases but a rotary but basicly the same type of system)

Reason can be.
Personel allocated elsewhere.
Units not ready yet (new system and many 052Ds finished that could use them earlier).
Maybe weight of whole bridhe being placed on deck?
Damaging the systems because they have to do a lot still on the bridge.

Many European navys fit the radar masts later woth the systems build in.
That simply doesnt work here since its a whole structure.

20121130023350_hjmf_imast_cabinets_220211-24.jpg


39076.jpg
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
That simply doesnt work here since its a whole structure.
Exactly...which results in the necessities that I talked about.

For this older design it is not plug and play as they have become today.

Remember, the basic design is 30+ years old...and the Chinese did not make that many changes in the first indigenous vessel...a few nice upgrades, but not really ekletronically as modernized.

Now, I expect the new CATOBAR designs to be modernized since they will be all new designs and will incorporate all they have learned more recenlty.
 

Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
Its mostly plug and play.
Only the Height (for beam control) and blanking needs to be adjusted according to the fitment location.(for these carriers there is no blanking sincs they dont "shine" to a structure)
And ofcourse auxilliary unit testing I.E cooling and power unit.

For example.
The complete APAR masts. I masts. Smart l systems are made and tested at Thales before shipping.
The same goes for EMPAR and SAMPSON and Herakles systems (no fixed phases but a rotary but basicly the same type of system)

Reason can be.
Personel allocated elsewhere.
Units not ready yet (new system and many 052Ds finished that could use them earlier).
Maybe weight of whole bridhe being placed on deck?
Damaging the systems because they have to do a lot still on the bridge.

Many European navys fit the radar masts later woth the systems build in.
That simply doesnt work here since its a whole structure.

20121130023350_hjmf_imast_cabinets_220211-24.jpg


39076.jpg
On a side note, I find it sad that such a powerful and effective integrated mast system was designed into a patrol vessel nearly devoid of weaponry.
 
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