Chinese semiconductor thread II

zhy_formal

Just Hatched
Registered Member
SMIC only provides technical support, and production lines are from Huawei...
Could you please inform me about the specific locations of Huawei's production lines? Additionally, if SMIC's N+2 capacity is not exclusively for Huawei, who else could be the reasonable customers?
 
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gelgoog

Brigadier
Registered Member
Nevermind what olalavn is talking about. Huawei fans seem to think that the company is making everything by itself.
The Kirin chips are most likely being made at SMSC. Which is owned by the Shanghai municipal government and operated by SMIC.
They doubled the floor area at SMSC late last year. So SMIC FinFET production should double next year.
 

zhy_formal

Just Hatched
Registered Member
Nevermind what olalavn is talking about. Huawei fans seem to think that the company is making everything by itself.
The Kirin chips are most likely being made at SMSC. Which is owned by the Shanghai municipal government and operated by SMIC.
They doubled the floor area at SMSC late last year. So SMIC FinFET production should double next year.
This is a picture I took in mid-October last year of the new fab building that was about to be completed at SMSC; From my perspective, if Huawei is not a customer of SMIC's N+2 capacity, it is hard to answer whom SMSC is in such a hurry to expand the capacity for?

1.jpg
 

gelgoog

Brigadier
Registered Member
SMSC is quite likely fully loaded. Not just with Huawei orders but with Loongson orders and probably other chips as well.
Just making enough chips to satisfy either Chinese government computer orders or Huawei orders would probably keep the factory loaded.
 

sunnymaxi

Captain
Registered Member
SMSC is quite likely fully loaded. Not just with Huawei orders but with Loongson orders and probably other chips as well.
Just making enough chips to satisfy either Chinese government computer orders or Huawei orders would probably keep the factory loaded.
the demand of advance chips are just too high in mainland. 7nm/7++nm and 5nm in near future..

SMSC likely to expand more after 2025 as per the local source..
 

tokenanalyst

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Changxin Memory’s patent for “Semiconductor Structure and Its Read and Write Control Methods and Manufacturing Methods” was published.​


Changxin Storage Technology Co., Ltd.’s patent for “Semiconductor Structure and Its Read and Write Control Methods and Manufacturing Methods” was published. The application publication date is April 5, 2024, and the application publication number is CN117832252A.
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Embodiments of the present disclosure relate to the field of semiconductor technology and provide a semiconductor structure, a read/write control method and a manufacturing method thereof. The semiconductor structure includes: a substrate and a data line located on the substrate, the data line extending along a first direction; A first transistor and a second transistor located on a side of the first transistor away from the data line; wherein the first transistor and the second transistor each include: a semiconductor pillar, the semiconductor pillar is located on part of the top surface of the data line and extends along the third direction There is an isolation structure inside the semiconductor pillar. Along the second direction, the isolation structure in different areas has different thicknesses in the third direction, and the isolation structure runs through the semiconductor pillar, and the first direction, the second direction and the third direction intersect each other. Embodiments of the present disclosure are at least beneficial to improving the sensing sensitivity of the second transistor to current changes in the first transistor while reducing the leakage current in the first transistor, so as to improve the electrical performance of the semiconductor structure.

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tphuang

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
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Kirin 9010 is still made on the SMIC 7nm process, right? That's a pretty good performance gain without moving to a more advanced process.
of course. I do think SMIC process is probably more consistent and yield is higher, which may have led Huawei to make changes to further improve chip performance

I have been obsessing over Kirin 9010 and I have gathered this as of now:

  1. Localization has increased. Domestic DRAM confirmed. There are multiple teardowns floating on Douyin.
  2. Kirin 9010 is a mystery. It has an 11% single core performance and 8% multi core performance boost over 9000s.
  3. The larger core is different. So 9000s had three different kinds of cores, 2 have been retained, the larger core is different.
  4. The IPC of larger core is 20% higher, so a massive boost, but single core performance is only 11% higher because clock speed has been reduced.
  5. Some rumor going around that the litho process is different. Not 5 nm but something like a more optimized 7nm.

Eagerly waiting for some good teardowns, and detailed analysis.
Let's be precise here. Kirin 9010 is just the SoC
you mean Pura 70 localization has increased from Mate 60. That is expected. I'd be curious how domestic DRAMs look here. Certainly the camera CMOS chips are now domestic also. Question is SSD.
If IPC of larger core is 20% higher, then that probably explains why clock speed has been reduced. Since that explains how many instructions you can do per cycle. Otherwise, you'd need a more advanced node

They will get to their improved 7th nm process this year, but I don't believe the one used for 9010 is changed. Yield improvement is probably the biggest change from past few month. The improved process will be for the Mate 70 phone SoC

the demand of advance chips are just too high in mainland. 7nm/7++nm and 5nm in near future..

SMSC likely to expand more after 2025 as per the local source..
I think 50k wpm by end of 2025 for SMSC would be good progress

It's unclear at this point where the EUV line will be. I suspect there is chance of both Huawei and SMIC having their own EUV lines. But we will see.
 
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tokenanalyst

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Registered Member

Astech was approved as Guangdong Silicon Carbide Discrete Device Research and Application Engineering Technology Research Center.​


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The "Guangdong Provincial Engineering Technology Research Center" is led by the Guangdong Provincial Department of Science and Technology. It mainly relies on the construction of scientific and technological enterprises with innovative capabilities and strong comprehensive strength in industries and fields in the province, deeply integrates collaborative innovation of industry, academia and research, and breaks through the constraints on industrial development. Key technologies are an important starting point for promoting the construction of enterprise R&D institutions and improving independent R&D capabilities.

The recognition of "Guangdong Silicon Carbide Discrete Device Research and Application Engineering Technology Research Center" this time fully reflects that Aistek has strong technological innovation capabilities and independent research and development capabilities in the field of silicon carbide power devices, and the company's comprehensive strength has been highly recognized .

Asite has always focused on R&D, design and manufacturing of silicon carbide power devices and application solutions, overcoming "stuck neck" technical problems: mastering the domestic leading core technology of silicon carbide power devices, achieving a nearly 15% reduction in chip costs ; taking the lead in developing and Mass-produced 1700V silicon carbide power modules, filling some gaps in the domestic industry; product models are complete, and 650V, 1200V, 1700V, 3300V SiC MOSFETs have been mass-produced ; product performance has reached the international advanced level, with a total of more than 3 million units installed and used, reaching 50 More than 10,000 vehicles have been provided with supporting services ; the self-developed automotive-grade silicon carbide power devices have entered the European aviation manufacturing procurement catalog, which shows the company's R&D innovation capabilities and product strength.

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