Chinese semiconductor industry
- Thread starter Hendrik_2000
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Back then you had way more designers with their own fabs like AMD with global foundry. Now everybody and their mother is buying fab capacity at TSMC its a duopoly pretty much with TSMC and Samsung.
Huawei is basically betting that the sanctions will come down in time to manufacture those chips. It takes over a year to design a chip. If they are correct then they would be able to quickly ramp up production once the sanctions come down.
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-ish. Depends on if the law is written using de minimis or FDPR jurisdictions and even then, it would be dependent on if the EDA was "US-origin".
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US policy was always shipments to China allow for 2 gen behind
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Not really. Even there weren't sanctions, you'd be fighting against firm incumbency and even in non-controlled older nodes, those scale effects dno't exist in China
Bit late now I guess they've been selling it to China for years and they've been using it for years! With all those backdoors those pesky Chinese must have got something really great in the works, otherwise why ban it, just keep selling it to them, it will be like watching monkeys hitting an atomic bomb with hammers, just take the money and laugh......
Anyway the USA would never do that, its tantamount to IP theft and everyone knows the USA is a staunch believer in IP rights protection, I've watch countless speeches by the American great and good extoling the virtues of it, not sure why you are implying otherwise.
Boo Hoo Boo Hoo......
Comprehension of the English language obviously not a strong suit! But I guess to some legality is in the eye of the beholder, however, if I've already bought something is it illegal to use it? If it is I suppose the Chinese could just retroactively make it 'illegal' to use Chinese rare earths in US radars, would solve a big problem! Maybe not!
Back then the sanctions were not entirely watertight and SMIC was very successful at industrial espionage.
SMIC stole TSMC technology and lost the court case:
SMIC dodges US government restrictions:
Look at this chart. You can see also how many players dropped out due to the increasing financial burden of staying at the leading edge. 90nm was circa 2002-2003. Source:
This chart is less flattering to SMIC, and is likely more accurate. Let's not forget that TSMC also sued SMIC for copying their 130nm manufacturing technology and 90nm as well.
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Sure. But TSMC introduced 180 nm process in 1998.
SMIC was several years behind that.
The introduction of FinFET at 14nm was a major obstacle for a lot of companies and quite a lot simply dropped out of the market. SMIC managed to go past that. Machine tools cost also grew substantially and cost per transistor actually went up instead of down as usual. So yes to go further will require huge amounts of capital which most of the companies formerly in the market can't get.
With regards to TSMC vs SMIC lawsuit, there have also been lawsuits against UMC and Samsung. But for whatever reason it is only SMIC which poaches talent and trade secrets in the US's eyes...
SMIC was several years behind that.
The introduction of FinFET at 14nm was a major obstacle for a lot of companies and quite a lot simply dropped out of the market. SMIC managed to go past that. Machine tools cost also grew substantially and cost per transistor actually went up instead of down as usual. So yes to go further will require huge amounts of capital which most of the companies formerly in the market can't get.
With regards to TSMC vs SMIC lawsuit, there have also been lawsuits against UMC and Samsung. But for whatever reason it is only SMIC which poaches talent and trade secrets in the US's eyes...
And to that point, *a lot* of companies fell behind TSMC and Samsung, some of whom used to lead those two, if they didn’t drop out of the market entirely. We shouldn’t trivialize what it takes to keep up with these intense ever more expensive and more difficult two year cycles. That SMIC is still in the game is a testament to success.
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