Chinese semiconductor industry

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Weaasel

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星海:年底会交付浸没式duv 吗?经过多重曝光能达到多少纳米?谢谢
havok:14nm
星海:Will submersible duvs be delivered by the end of the year? How many nanometers can be achieved after multiple exposures? Thanks
havok:14nm
For some weeks now, I have seen postings in which Havok makes comments and answers questions in relation to China's semiconductor equipment and IC chip manufacturing industry.. Who is this Havok guy?
 

xlitter

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My apologies in advance if posting this news on this thread is misplaced or too political, or this news has been posted on this thread already. I don't have any expertise, technical familiarity on this subject matter, in other words am a total layman but since this particular industry/technology is very crucial to China's core objective in advancing into high economy not to mention and important and critical component to America's intention of stopping China's ability to establish/gain a firm foothold into this realm of technology in maintaining it's global rules based order a.k.a. American hegemony.

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The following interview was published a couple of weeks ago and is certainly one of the more detailed and interesting pieces discussing the current US-China tech war to have been published in China in recent months. For those of you interested in this topic, I would recommend reading it in full. The lengthy excerpts below have been translated with the kind help of
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who is co-authoring today’s post with me.

Lu’s main arguments:

  • The scope of Washington’s tech crackdown has always been constrained by the reliance of US companies on the Chinese market. Lu recommends further weaponising Chinese demand.
  • Beijing must stop pursuing individual technological targets and should come up with a comprehensive strategy aimed at developing an “independent industrial base” for semiconductors.
  • Chinese companies are already present in almost every part of the semiconductor supply chain. The key for China today is to help foster strong supply and demand links between these companies.
  • Beijing should set up a body similar to the Mao era’s Central Special Committee [中央专委] that would directly oversee the development of this industrial base.
  • China must pursue “fully independent manufacturing” by first de-Americanising its chip supply chain and ultimately replacing almost all foreign made equipment and materials with domestically made ones. Decoupling is bad for everyone, but needs must.
  • China should focus less on developing advanced chips and more on building up a domestic industrial chain capable of producing mature chips (≥28nm).
  • China’s goal should be to become the world’s main supplier of mature chips and ultimately use this dominance as a weapon against the US and others (if and when necessary).
  • Beijing should impose sanctions on any company that complies with the US’s export controls. For example, by banning the sale of NVIDIA’s mature chips and of ASML’s less advanced lithography equipment to China.
  • Lu is adamant that China should implement strong countermeasures in response to the US’s current crackdown. Backing down will only make matters worse, he says.

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Interviewer: So in order to deal with the US’s tech embargo, do you think that the key is to build up a supply chain [that depends on] internal circulation?


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1. The US’s tech crackdown is constrained by the pull of China’s market
Interviewer:
The US has been constantly making new moves to block and remove Chinese technology, with embargoes and bans being issued one after the other. How do you analyse this situation?
This seems to be the author of "光变". This book is a detailed history of the development of the panel giant BOE, from the plight of the 1980s to the current rise. It is a very good book. People who understand Chinese are recommended to read it.
 

tphuang

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星海:年底会交付浸没式duv 吗?经过多重曝光能达到多少纳米?谢谢
havok:14nm
星海:Will submersible duvs be delivered by the end of the year? How many nanometers can be achieved after multiple exposures? Thanks
havok:14nm
That would be quite the big deal. I don't think they will actually use it for 14nm. But it probably has better overlay precision than I thought after his previous answers.

See that he deliberately avoids timing questions, because he doesn't know the answer.

Japanese restrictions will begin in Spring
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hmm, that would just indicate the change in law probably doesn't have that much teeth. But I guess we will find out. Seems like the Japanese politicians are doing the bare minimum here to get Americans off its back.
 

european_guy

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look at this sales chart... we have seen a decrease in the number of exports of Japan's semiconductor manufacturing equipment...
View attachment 106580

Decrease of Japan semiconductor's related exports to China is inevitable.

There are already many local substitution solutions (in production or trial stage) for every Japan product. Many have still not caught up in quality and cannot be used at the same advanced node, but Chinese toolmakers and chemical and materials companies are closing the gaps one by one. In 2/3 years Japan will sell very little in China.

Of course bowing to US demands, will only but accelerate the process.
 

paiemon

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Q: In addition, some investors mentioned that the company's ARF photoresist project has been verified for one and a half years since it passed the acceptance of the expert group in July 2021 and has been verified by various chip companies. May I ask your company's photoresist project? What about verification? When will it be able to pass the verification and mass production, please give investors an assurance, the specific time, is it still possible?

A: Nanda Optoelectronics said that its subsidiary Ningbo Nanda Optoelectronics is actively carrying out customer verification of ArF photoresist. Two products have passed the verification, and many products are currently undergoing certification by many customers.



Very poor answer by Nanda. They seem to be stuck somewhere for some reason, but they don't say where they are stuck. They are not able to move to volume production, nor can give a possible date for production.
There is a good possibility that Nanda's ArF photoresist is stuck in customer validation hell. Their products may have passed their own internal verification against their internal design requirements but the customer feedback isn't favorable enough to gain certification with those end users. Therefore they are stuck in a loop of iterating changes, resubmitting for feedback until there is a signoff. Although the product may work the users may feel the results using the photoresists is less then optimal from a process standpoint and thus refuse to certify it w/o changes. There's not much Nanda can say besides they are working for it because they can't control the signoff. If there was no other option I am sure they would probably take the best they can get but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
 

HighGround

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There is a good possibility that Nanda's ArF photoresist is stuck in customer validation hell. Their products may have passed their own internal verification against their internal design requirements but the customer feedback isn't favorable enough to gain certification with those end users. Therefore they are stuck in a loop of iterating changes, resubmitting for feedback until there is a signoff. Although the product may work the users may feel the results using the photoresists is less then optimal from a process standpoint and thus refuse to certify it w/o changes. There's not much Nanda can say besides they are working for it because they can't control the signoff. If there was no other option I am sure they would probably take the best they can get but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
That just sounds like their photoresists aren't good enough.
 
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