Chinese Economics Thread
- Thread starter Norfolk
- Start date
Wang Chuanfu is an interesting dude. His stated goal is for BYD to become the #1 auto maker in the world by 2025. I don't see how that's humanly possible, unless electric cars take off in a big way, with his company at the forefront. However, I have heard it said that China may be the only country in the world that can profitably produce electric vehicles, since they have the right blend of technology and low production costs.
Rising China
Junior Member
:china::china::china:
Tuesday October 13, 02:41 PM
China's billionaire list hits 130 despite crisis
By Allison Jackson
BEIJING (AFP) - Car battery tycoon Wang Chuanfu topped a new list of China's 1,000 richest people released on Tuesday, which has 130 dollar billionaires in an emphatic declaration of the Asian giant's economic arrival.
Most of the super-wealthy on the Hurun Rich List, unlike Wang, made their fortunes in the property and stock markets -- the focus of Beijing's massive government stimulus efforts over the past year.
"China's wealth is growing at breakneck speed," Rupert Hoogewerf, the founder of the Shanghai-based Hurun Report which publishes the annual list, told a press conference.
"You can double the real number of billionaires in China to 260," Hoogewerf said, noting China has the most known dollar billionaires after the United States.
"There are still a large number of billionaires off the radar screens, managing to build up substantial wealth away from the public spotlight from property, the stock market and investments."
The list does not include people based in Hong Kong and Macau.
Wang, the founder of rechargeable battery and electric car maker BYD, leapt 102 places to top the rich list after his fortune increased more than five-fold to 5.1 billion dollars thanks to US billionaire investor Warren Buffett, said Hoogewerf.
Wang's 27.8 percent stake in BYD "hit the big time" after Buffett paid 230 million dollars for a 10 percent stake in the company last September, the report said.
The rich list had 180 new entrants -- despite the entry level for the latest list rising by 50 percent to 150 million dollars.
Seven people moved into the top 10, in the biggest shake-up since the report started publishing the rich list in 1999.
Last year's richest man, Huang Guangyu, who made his fortune building up the nation's largest electrical appliance chain Gome, slipped to the 17th spot after he was detained late last year on suspicion of market manipulation.
Du Shuanghua, last year's second-richest person, plunged 39 places to 41 as he battled a state-owned company for control of Shandong-based private steel manufacturer Rizhao Steel.
"Since our 2004 list, we have seen a ten-fold increase in the number of individuals with personal wealth of at least 150 million dollars," said Hoogewerf.
"In 2004, we could only find 100 individuals with 150 million, whereas this year, we managed to find 1,000 individuals with 150 million."
A separate report released Tuesday showed the number of super-rich people in the Asia-Pacific (002790.KS - news) region shrank in 2008 despite the region's relative resilience in the face of the global economic slump.
This year's Asia-Pacific Wealth Report showed there were 2.4 million high-net-worth individuals (HNWI) in 2008, a 14.2 percent fall from the previous year.
The fall in HNWIs -- people with investable assets of at least one million US dollars -- is almost in line with the global average of 14.9 percent, the study by investment bank Merrill Lynch (NYSE: MER - news) and financial consultancy Capgemini said.
China's HNWIs fared better than their counterparts elsewhere in the region, falling only 11.8 percent to 364,000 in 2008, thanks to a combination of closed markets and robust macroeconomic growth.
The Hurun Report said that rebounding capital markets and property prices pushed the collective net worth of the 1,000 richest people in China to 571 billion dollars by September 15 of this year, from 439 billion dollars last year.
Zhang Yin, the woman who founded paper-recycling company Nine Dragons Paper (2689.HK - news) and China's richest person in 2006, was in second place.
Zhang was one of 102 women on the list -- up from 88 last year and accounting for 10.2 percent of the total.
"Significantly, all are self-made, a remarkably high percentage compared with their Western counterparts. Chinese women now lead the world's richest self-made women," the report said.
Among the new people in the top 10 were husband and wife Huang Wei and Li Ping, who shot up 23 spots to fifth place through their 71 percent stake in Shanghai-listed property developer Xinhu Zhongbao.
Shares in Xinhu Zhongbao had surged 265 percent to 12.5 yuan in early September from 4.7 yuan a year ago, the report said, reflecting strong gains in the Chinese stock market.
Zhongwang Holdings chairman Liu Zhongtian moved into 10th place with 4.1 billion dollars after the aluminium manufacturer raised 1.3 billion dollars through an initial public offering earlier this year.
Tuesday October 13, 02:41 PM
China's billionaire list hits 130 despite crisis
By Allison Jackson
BEIJING (AFP) - Car battery tycoon Wang Chuanfu topped a new list of China's 1,000 richest people released on Tuesday, which has 130 dollar billionaires in an emphatic declaration of the Asian giant's economic arrival.
Most of the super-wealthy on the Hurun Rich List, unlike Wang, made their fortunes in the property and stock markets -- the focus of Beijing's massive government stimulus efforts over the past year.
"China's wealth is growing at breakneck speed," Rupert Hoogewerf, the founder of the Shanghai-based Hurun Report which publishes the annual list, told a press conference.
"You can double the real number of billionaires in China to 260," Hoogewerf said, noting China has the most known dollar billionaires after the United States.
"There are still a large number of billionaires off the radar screens, managing to build up substantial wealth away from the public spotlight from property, the stock market and investments."
The list does not include people based in Hong Kong and Macau.
Wang, the founder of rechargeable battery and electric car maker BYD, leapt 102 places to top the rich list after his fortune increased more than five-fold to 5.1 billion dollars thanks to US billionaire investor Warren Buffett, said Hoogewerf.
Wang's 27.8 percent stake in BYD "hit the big time" after Buffett paid 230 million dollars for a 10 percent stake in the company last September, the report said.
The rich list had 180 new entrants -- despite the entry level for the latest list rising by 50 percent to 150 million dollars.
Seven people moved into the top 10, in the biggest shake-up since the report started publishing the rich list in 1999.
Last year's richest man, Huang Guangyu, who made his fortune building up the nation's largest electrical appliance chain Gome, slipped to the 17th spot after he was detained late last year on suspicion of market manipulation.
Du Shuanghua, last year's second-richest person, plunged 39 places to 41 as he battled a state-owned company for control of Shandong-based private steel manufacturer Rizhao Steel.
"Since our 2004 list, we have seen a ten-fold increase in the number of individuals with personal wealth of at least 150 million dollars," said Hoogewerf.
"In 2004, we could only find 100 individuals with 150 million, whereas this year, we managed to find 1,000 individuals with 150 million."
A separate report released Tuesday showed the number of super-rich people in the Asia-Pacific (002790.KS - news) region shrank in 2008 despite the region's relative resilience in the face of the global economic slump.
This year's Asia-Pacific Wealth Report showed there were 2.4 million high-net-worth individuals (HNWI) in 2008, a 14.2 percent fall from the previous year.
The fall in HNWIs -- people with investable assets of at least one million US dollars -- is almost in line with the global average of 14.9 percent, the study by investment bank Merrill Lynch (NYSE: MER - news) and financial consultancy Capgemini said.
China's HNWIs fared better than their counterparts elsewhere in the region, falling only 11.8 percent to 364,000 in 2008, thanks to a combination of closed markets and robust macroeconomic growth.
The Hurun Report said that rebounding capital markets and property prices pushed the collective net worth of the 1,000 richest people in China to 571 billion dollars by September 15 of this year, from 439 billion dollars last year.
Zhang Yin, the woman who founded paper-recycling company Nine Dragons Paper (2689.HK - news) and China's richest person in 2006, was in second place.
Zhang was one of 102 women on the list -- up from 88 last year and accounting for 10.2 percent of the total.
"Significantly, all are self-made, a remarkably high percentage compared with their Western counterparts. Chinese women now lead the world's richest self-made women," the report said.
Among the new people in the top 10 were husband and wife Huang Wei and Li Ping, who shot up 23 spots to fifth place through their 71 percent stake in Shanghai-listed property developer Xinhu Zhongbao.
Shares in Xinhu Zhongbao had surged 265 percent to 12.5 yuan in early September from 4.7 yuan a year ago, the report said, reflecting strong gains in the Chinese stock market.
Zhongwang Holdings chairman Liu Zhongtian moved into 10th place with 4.1 billion dollars after the aluminium manufacturer raised 1.3 billion dollars through an initial public offering earlier this year.
bladerunner
Banned Idiot
I would agree with that view. Being new technology they're more or less starting out on a equal footing,they could even be world leaders in this field if they get it right, however performance of electric cars at this stage may not get the Western car enthusiast over excited. (Can you see them racing around in a Indy 500?
)One would electric ars would be ideal in China, but to date, I havent come across any publication on any supporting infrastructure for electric car usage in China, well not like any in Israel, Denmark, USA where theres talk or in the process of establishing nationwide recharge stations, or drive in swap a battery, with exchange not taking much longer than a petrol fill up.
I wonder what the driving habits are like in China? such as driving long distances for pleasure trips?
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bladerunner
Banned Idiot
More speculation on the Hummer deal from a Chinese perspective. It seems some don't see it as a good buy, however its interesting to read, some analyst suggesting that the H3 or its patents not being allowed outside the U.S> Management would be another valid question , in the light of earlier acquisitions of Western Companies by the Chinese have encountered similar troubles.
However Im a little puzzled byu CEO Yang Yi's statement that they would be pitching the vechile towards emerging markets (is that 3rd world countries)? Wouldnt it be too expensive for their requirements?
From the China Daily
For many it's appropriate that Hummer means a horse that cannot be tamed in Chinese because they believe the bulky, gas-guzzling utility vehicle would not co-exist happily with Tengzhong's stable of other products.
Although the first, tentative hurdles with bankrupt General Motors have been cleared, a long and tricky field lies ahead before the Sichuan-based heavy industrial machinery company can gallop past the finishing post to claim its prize.
Some punters believe it's a race that cannot be won; others claim it's a race not worth winning.
"Purchasing a horse is easier than taming one," cautioned many analysts who have been observing developments closely and who identified two particular obstacles.
"Firstly, the Ministry of Commerce has not expressed its attitude toward the acquisition. Secondly, Tengzhong has no auto-related operational experience," said Jia Xinguang, chief analyst with the Chinese National Automotive Industry Consulting and Development Corp.
Hummer's CEO, James Taylor, said he was very confident of getting the nod from Chinese regulators despite many expressions of doubt coming from China, according to the Xinhua news agency.
"To get regulatory approval, Tengzhong has to convince relevant departments that the lineup it acquired will be energy-efficient and in accordance with the environment protection strategy," said John Zeng, senior market analyst with Global Insight Inc.
Tengzhong would obtain ownership of the Hummer brand, its trademark and trade names, as well as use of patents needed for the manufacture of the vehicles, according to the as yet unratified agreement.
It remains unclear what stage negotiations have reached between the relevant parties or what the details are. All sides are keeping mum for the time being. And during this period of Purdah, many are wondering what Tengzhong hopes to achieve. Some have even, strictly off the record, dubbed it a publicity stunt, bringing international recognition to an otherwise little-known company.
"The key point is how Hummer's next generation - H3 - would be developed. The future star model, which is said to be more energy-efficient, will replace the fallen H2 model," said Zeng.
Some observers doubt the company's green strategy would derail Hummer's original purpose as a special use and all-terrain military truck. They question the purpose in buying a brand that is effectively no longer appropriate for the current age.
"If you need a green vehicle, why choose Hummer and spend hefty amounts of money to redesign it?" asked Zeng.
The analyst said it was also questionable whether GM would allow Tengzhong to produce the H3 and use H3 patents outside the US.
Tengzhong will definitely put more focus on the Chinese market, Zeng said, echoing the company CEO Yang Yi's statement that it would devote more effort in emerging markets. However, he added that China was still a relatively small market for sports utility vehicles (SUVs).
According to the deal, Hummer's production would remain in the US and GM would provide key components, vehicle manufacturing and assembly as well as other business services over the transitional period. The existing senior management and operational team would also be retained.
Yang said Tengzhong had not ruled out the possibility of setting up a production base in China - something analysts doubt would happen in the short term.
"How to run and manage an international brand such as Hummer is a challenge for the manufacturer. Tengzhong has to make itself aware of international operating principles as well as the overseas legal environment," Jia Xinguang said.
With so many questions unanswered, and the terrain so uncertain, it's no wonder the betting man is at a loss where to put his money.
Source: China Daily
However Im a little puzzled byu CEO Yang Yi's statement that they would be pitching the vechile towards emerging markets (is that 3rd world countries)? Wouldnt it be too expensive for their requirements?
From the China Daily
For many it's appropriate that Hummer means a horse that cannot be tamed in Chinese because they believe the bulky, gas-guzzling utility vehicle would not co-exist happily with Tengzhong's stable of other products.
Although the first, tentative hurdles with bankrupt General Motors have been cleared, a long and tricky field lies ahead before the Sichuan-based heavy industrial machinery company can gallop past the finishing post to claim its prize.
Some punters believe it's a race that cannot be won; others claim it's a race not worth winning.
"Purchasing a horse is easier than taming one," cautioned many analysts who have been observing developments closely and who identified two particular obstacles.
"Firstly, the Ministry of Commerce has not expressed its attitude toward the acquisition. Secondly, Tengzhong has no auto-related operational experience," said Jia Xinguang, chief analyst with the Chinese National Automotive Industry Consulting and Development Corp.
Hummer's CEO, James Taylor, said he was very confident of getting the nod from Chinese regulators despite many expressions of doubt coming from China, according to the Xinhua news agency.
"To get regulatory approval, Tengzhong has to convince relevant departments that the lineup it acquired will be energy-efficient and in accordance with the environment protection strategy," said John Zeng, senior market analyst with Global Insight Inc.
Tengzhong would obtain ownership of the Hummer brand, its trademark and trade names, as well as use of patents needed for the manufacture of the vehicles, according to the as yet unratified agreement.
It remains unclear what stage negotiations have reached between the relevant parties or what the details are. All sides are keeping mum for the time being. And during this period of Purdah, many are wondering what Tengzhong hopes to achieve. Some have even, strictly off the record, dubbed it a publicity stunt, bringing international recognition to an otherwise little-known company.
"The key point is how Hummer's next generation - H3 - would be developed. The future star model, which is said to be more energy-efficient, will replace the fallen H2 model," said Zeng.
Some observers doubt the company's green strategy would derail Hummer's original purpose as a special use and all-terrain military truck. They question the purpose in buying a brand that is effectively no longer appropriate for the current age.
"If you need a green vehicle, why choose Hummer and spend hefty amounts of money to redesign it?" asked Zeng.
The analyst said it was also questionable whether GM would allow Tengzhong to produce the H3 and use H3 patents outside the US.
Tengzhong will definitely put more focus on the Chinese market, Zeng said, echoing the company CEO Yang Yi's statement that it would devote more effort in emerging markets. However, he added that China was still a relatively small market for sports utility vehicles (SUVs).
According to the deal, Hummer's production would remain in the US and GM would provide key components, vehicle manufacturing and assembly as well as other business services over the transitional period. The existing senior management and operational team would also be retained.
Yang said Tengzhong had not ruled out the possibility of setting up a production base in China - something analysts doubt would happen in the short term.
"How to run and manage an international brand such as Hummer is a challenge for the manufacturer. Tengzhong has to make itself aware of international operating principles as well as the overseas legal environment," Jia Xinguang said.
With so many questions unanswered, and the terrain so uncertain, it's no wonder the betting man is at a loss where to put his money.
Source: China Daily
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Autumn Child
Junior Member
There are actually pilot projects in cities all over china to build electric car ecosystem. Heck...china is building an experimental eco city near shanghai. Cities like Wuhan has already started building electric car ecosystem and employing Nissan to design the prototype cars. There is a huge political push here to get the program started even if it will not be making money in 10 years.
From what I have heard, Chinese rarely use cars for cross country trips, they prefer trains. For that reason electric cars may be ideal for the country. On the other hand, few people in urban China live in their own house, so they can't plug in their car overnight while it's sitting in the driveway ... they would need a designated power station from the apartment building.
bladerunner
Banned Idiot
ffWhat happened to that eco city I heard they stopped it, some time ago. I was looking forward to seeing it , when deciding if i wanted to go and see expo next year.
vesicles
Colonel
I think they still own those units, much like condo units in the States, just not a lot of "single-family-houses".
AssassinsMace
Lieutenant General
China's infrastructure is better than you think. Remember, they're basically starting from scratch unlike the US who has old infrastructure still in place. China has a lot more room to work with. I live in the US and I know no one with a plug-in unit in their house. So basically that means the US is not "more" advanced in that regard. I was given a survey about plug-in installation and pricing by my local power utility so they are still asking questions on how to implement it.
And why do many assume that China lock-step follows the US? Just because the US is at this point it must mean China is lagging behind following the same path. Electric vehicles? More in use in China than you believe. I saw a TV news story on a man who converts regular gas cars to electric in his garage. He's getting orders from people in cities all over the region. He's now requesting help from the government to help expand his business. Electric bikes are big in China. Europe imports them from China because no one domestic can meet with the demand becuase no one else produces them in large enough numbers.
And why do many assume that China lock-step follows the US? Just because the US is at this point it must mean China is lagging behind following the same path. Electric vehicles? More in use in China than you believe. I saw a TV news story on a man who converts regular gas cars to electric in his garage. He's getting orders from people in cities all over the region. He's now requesting help from the government to help expand his business. Electric bikes are big in China. Europe imports them from China because no one domestic can meet with the demand becuase no one else produces them in large enough numbers.