Chinese Aviation Industry

ZeEa5KPul said:

When you say "jointly" developed with Safran, how jointly? Can China build the entire engine on its own? How does its MTBO compare to other engines in its class? And can that figure be taken as a proxy for indigenous Chinese turboshafts like WZ-10 and WZ-9?

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I don't know the nature of the joint partnership or whether China has the ability to independently produce the engine as of right now, but I suspect the aim is to have independent production.

I also have no answer to your second question. I'm entirely unfamiliar with turboshaft industry and what constitute cutting edge maintainability parameters. Other members surely will be better able to answer that.

WZ-9 and WZ-10 are Chinese military projects. While I'm not discounting the possibility of cross-pollination, but given the timelines of their development, I doubt WZ-16's MTBO numbers can be taken as a proxy for WZ-10 and WZ-9, especially WZ-9, which is much older tech.

ZeEa5KPul said:

When you say "jointly" developed with Safran, how jointly? Can China build the entire engine on its own? How does its MTBO compare to other engines in its class? And can that figure be taken as a proxy for indigenous Chinese turboshafts like WZ-10 and WZ-9?

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by78 said:

I don't know the nature of the joint partnership or whether China has the ability to independently produce the engine as of right now, but I suspect the aim is to have independent production.

I also have no answer to your second question. I'm entirely unfamiliar with turboshaft industry and what constitute cutting edge maintainability parameters. Other members surely will be better able to answer that.

WZ-9 and WZ-10 are Chinese military projects. While I'm not discounting the possibility of cross-pollination, but given the timelines of their development, I doubt WZ-16's MTBO numbers can be taken as a proxy for WZ-10 and WZ-9, especially WZ-9, which is much older tech.

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WZ-16 is the engine, as reported by CCTV.

by78 said:

AC352, also known as Z-15, has been awarded an official approval certificate by the Civil Aviation Administration of China. It is now cleared to enter service.

AC352 is equipped with WZ-16 turboshafts jointly developed with Safran of France. The take-off weight is 7.5 tons, the maximum range is 850 kilometers, and it can carry 16 passengers. It features a 4-axis digital automatic flight control system, advanced glass cockpit, and highly integrated avionics. Rotors and fuselage have a lifespan of 20,000 hours. MTBO for the engines and transmission is around 5,000 hours.

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A better from the certificate award ceremony + a photo of the certificate.

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Some high-resolution images to celebrate the occasion.

by78 said:

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Not sure "Booze" is the best serial for a new helo type? Implies the designers were drunk!

ZeEa5KPul said:

When you say "jointly" developed with Safran, how jointly? Can China build the entire engine on its own? How does its MTBO compare to other engines in its class? And can that figure be taken as a proxy for indigenous Chinese turboshafts like WZ-10 and WZ-9?

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WZ-16 is part of the Ardiden 3 family (Ardiden 3C) and an incremental improvement of earlier Ardiden 3s, which also powers Ka-62. Thus most of the overall development was done by Safran, and cannot be taken as an indicator of the performance of WZ-9, but hopefully the experience in improving earlier Ardiden 3s will help (and might have already helped) in improving WZ-9. It's also jointly built with Safran, so not 100% Chinese production.

Ka-62 is likely dead from EU sanctions. Z-15 should seize the opportunity to get some export orders.

OppositeDay said:

WZ-9. It's also jointly built with Safran, so not 100% Chinese production.

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WZ-9 turboshaft engine independently developed by China, derived from WZ-8 core machine. which is produced with Safran under joint venture. so WZ-9 has nothing to do with Safran. its improved variant already under production but specifications are not available.

WZ-16 derived from Ardiden3, basically its variant. indeed all basic R&D done by Safran but this engine is just a long commitment of French engine maker with Chinese mainland. production agreement signed with Harbin Dong'an Engine(Group) Corporation. they have shared all iPs with them. assembled in Harbin main production plant.

sunnymaxi said:

WZ-9 turboshaft engine independently developed by China, derived from WZ-8 core machine. which is produced with Safran under joint venture. so WZ-9 has nothing to do with Safran. its improved variant already under production but specifications are not available.

WZ-16 derived from Ardiden3, basically its variant. indeed all basic R&D done by Safran but this engine is just a long commitment of French engine maker with Chinese mainland. production agreement signed with Harbin Dong'an Engine(Group) Corporation. they have shared all iPs with them. assembled in Harbin main production plant.

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is the hot part made in China? That's the real question