Chinese Aviation Industry


But if the form drag is smaller, while the wings are larger, differences can net out. They changed the wing design for a reason related to some kind of optimization. They're not stupid.
They're all stupid compared to Blue here. A whole team of professional engineers can get together, plan, and design a prototype and Blue here can just eyeball it and go, "Nope. Pssht, nose is too big; wings are too fat. Drag is too high and it's about 18.43% deficient on lift by my (mental) calculations. It'll never work. You guys are stupid. Try again." LOL That's why they're professional aircraft designers and he's here commentating on the internet. It'll never ever occur to him that a team of professionally-trained aero-eingineers just might know something beyond the stuff he can google and try to misinterpret to his wishes.

Now, I'm not saying that model is a winner and is gonna go to market, but I am saying there are definite reasons they built it and we most likely are not at a level high enough to (fully) understand what they were getting at. And that goes 10 fold to someone who thinks the design makes no sense at all.
 
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superdog

Junior Member
They're all stupid compared to Blue here. A whole team of professional engineers can get together, plan, and design a prototype and Blue here can just eyeball it and go, "Nope. Pssht, nose is too big; wings are too fat. Drag is too high and it's about 18.43% deficient on lift by my calculations. It'll never work. You guys are stupid. Try again." LOL That's why they're professional aircraft designers and he's here commentating on the internet. It'll never ever occur to him that a team of professionally-trained aero-eingineers just might know something beyond the stuff he can google and try to misinterpret to his wishes.

Now, I'm not saying that model is a winner and is gonna go to market, but I am saying there are definite reasons they built it and we most likely are not at a level high enough to (fully) understand what they were getting at.
The hybrid wing-body (HWB) transport is not a new idea, various manufacturers and research institutes around the world has shown interest in the concept. Some small scale demonstrators has already been built and larger ones are being planned. The most famous project is probably the Boeing X-48 series.

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This design still has a long way to go before entering commercial service, mainly because of challenges in flight control. There are also issues to solve in cabin arrangement. Less windows may be offset by improved in-flight entertainment but emergency exit design requires more careful considerations.

It is only normal for any country with an ambition in future airliner/transport design to venture into HWB studies, because such a design offers greatly improved fuel economy (rather than increasing drag and reducing efficiency). Boeing, NASA, Lockheed Martin Skunk works, and now AVIC all seem to agree. But I guess you're right, these institutions know nothing about aircraft design when compared to SamuraiBlue.
 

SamuraiBlue

Captain
The hybrid wing-body (HWB) transport is not a new idea, various manufacturers and research institutes around the world has shown interest in the concept. Some small scale demonstrators has already been built and larger ones are being planned. The most famous project is probably the Boeing X-48 series.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


This design still has a long way to go before entering commercial service, mainly because of challenges in flight control. There are also issues to solve in cabin arrangement. Less windows may be offset by improved in-flight entertainment but emergency exit design requires more careful considerations.

It is only normal for any country with an ambition in future airliner/transport design to venture into HWB studies, because such a design offers greatly improved fuel economy (rather than increasing drag and reducing efficiency). Boeing, NASA, Lockheed Martin Skunk works, and now AVIC all seem to agree. But I guess you're right, these institutions know nothing about aircraft design when compared to SamuraiBlue.


That is not a Hybrid Wing Body Transport.
The ones NASA and Boeing was studying was more like a flying wing where passengers would be seated in parts of the wing as well.The one above is just a passenger liner with large wings that is not blended into the the fuselage.
 

jobjed

Captain
That is not a Hybrid Wing Body Transport.
The ones NASA and Boeing was studying was more like a flying wing where passengers would be seated in parts of the wing as well.The one above is just a passenger liner with large wings that is not blended into the the fuselage.
You mean "are blended into fuselage", right? If that's not blended wing body, pigs can fly.
 

SamuraiBlue

Captain
You mean "are blended into fuselage", right? If that's not blended wing body, pigs can fly.
No they are not blended since you can define the fuselage from the wings in that picture.
Basically a HWB transport's overall length and width will be shorter than a conventional plane with the same capacity that can be separated into a fuselage and wings since passengers will be seated within parts of the wing while the main body will generate lift as well reducing the over all length in both dimensions.
 

SinoSoldier

Colonel
I'm with SamuraiBlue on this one. There lacks a discreet transition between the wing and the rest of the fuselage and hence this aircraft would function very differently from a flying wing (the lift surface would not involve the central fuselage component).
 

jobjed

Captain
No they are not blended since you can define the fuselage from the wings in that picture.
Basically a HWB transport's overall length and width will be shorter than a conventional plane with the same capacity that can be separated into a fuselage and wings since passengers will be seated within parts of the wing while the main body will generate lift as well reducing the over all length in both dimensions.
Blended-wing-body does not necessarily mean the wing and body are indiscernible. Just like blending two colours on canvas doesn't mean you're making one colour indistinguishable from the other. It simply means the border between the two is a gradual continuous transition instead of a sudden shift. The F-16 is famous for being the first fighter aircraft to incorporate a blended-wing-body design. Contrast the F-16's smooth transition from fuselage to wing with the F-4's and MiG-21's abrupt change from fuselage to wing. The airliner concept is very obviously blended, but not a flying wing. It's more blended than the F-16, which is renowned for being blended.
 

SamuraiBlue

Captain
Blended-wing-body does not necessarily mean the wing and body are indiscernible. Just like blending two colours on canvas doesn't mean you're making one colour indistinguishable from the other. It simply means the border between the two is a gradual continuous transition instead of a sudden shift. The F-16 is famous for being the first fighter aircraft to incorporate a blended-wing-body design. Contrast the F-16's smooth transition from fuselage to wing with the F-4's and MiG-21's abrupt change from fuselage to wing. The airliner concept is very obviously blended, but not a flying wing. It's more blended than the F-16, which is renowned for being blended.
Still does not make it a HWB transport. Blended to some degree yes but the fuselage required to provide comfortable space to the passengers will be too large to generate any lift and the wing box connecting the wing to the fuselage will expand considerably adding excess weight as a whole. The F-16 being a single file seat with a single engine configuration was able to pull it off reducing the wing span.
 

jobjed

Captain
Still does not make it a HWB transport. Blended to some degree yes but the fuselage required to provide comfortable space to the passengers will be too large to generate any lift and the wing box connecting the wing to the fuselage will expand considerably adding excess weight as a whole. The F-16 being a single file seat with a single engine configuration was able to pull it off reducing the wing span.
None of my previous comments are edited. Quote a passage from them where I claimed the airliner concept was HWB.
 

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