China's SCS Strategy Thread

[Dolcevita]

I don't know what is wrong with Gordon Chang

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

I suspect it is Stockholm Syndrome and he does what his publisher wants to hear. This is not uncommon among East Coast born Chinese American, specially those with mixed ancestry. It is not uncommon for them to try to suppress their Chinese ancestry to gain acceptance with their American peers, Some like Gordon would go even further and be openly hostile to his Chinese ancestry to gain even greater acceptance, That's survival instinct for them.

This is still true today. People who are unable to suppress their Chinese identity are more likely to get bullied and passed up for promotions. See what happened to Private Danny Chen of Chinatown, NY.


Same with the Japanese units in US Army druing WWII. They were fighting in Europe mostly out of necessity to prove that they are loyal Americans, But all is good now with Japan and the Japanese. Today, the bigger threat to American Hegemony in Asia are the Chinese.

 

[broadsword]

But in his case, money talks louder after judging for himself his own experience. If brinksmanship could only bring in 50 grand whereas by preaching to the choir, he could back up the Brinks for a tidy 500, there is no question hands down which choice he would choose. He had been there before and by appearing to speak his mind, he is making clean money, unlike some scientists whose findings are sometimes greased by big corporations. His conscience is not worse than someone like Peter Navarro.

 

[PanAsian]

Well, who didn't see this coming?

Once bitten, twice shy US and allies.

This course of events wasn't a foregone conclusion, if the US was willing to pay up more (economic investment, military aid, yielding more political power in bilateral arrangements, positive PR, and freedom of action... etc.) to the likes of the Philippines and Vietnam then the US could have gotten more of its way, though still not everything as it wanted. But the US was not willing to be more generous which partially is a deeper reflection of the kind of relationship the US expects between itself and others, and the history of US relations with these specific countries.

But it's still early in the game, let's see what happens when Duterte and Abe meet. Duterte's rhetoric also continues to not match statements from others in the Philippines government, his pivot has not been cemented as Philippines' pivot, there is the possibility he may be removed from power one way or the other, and a different president may not take the Philippines in the same direction.

 

[Blackstone]

This is still true today. People who are unable to suppress their Chinese identity are more likely to get bullied and passed up for promotions. See what happened to Private Danny Chen of Chinatown, NY.

What hogwash! Generalizing an entire country on a few bad apples is intellectually dishonest to say the least. Stressful environments tend to draw out the best and the worst in people, and Private Chen's despicable treatment by his commanding officer, NCOs, and fellow soldiers is deplorable to the extreme. In a perfect world, such things wouldn't happen, but we don't live in a perfect world.

The Army followed SOP by investigating the case, conducting court marshals, and rendering judgements. The case wasn't swept under the rug, and the guilty were punished. We could opine on sufficiency of punishments, but without all the facts, it's just talk. Therefore, we must accept the system rendered proper justice, unless contrary evidence come to light.

I'm not naive about racism in America, nor do I excuse national failures past and present. There are racists in the US government and in its Armed Services, and I'll wager dollars to donuts the numbers aren't insignificant. Nevertheless, it's important to stress bigots come in all colors, genders, and religions, from Privates to Generals. That's why America's Armed Forces have been, and are at the forefront of equal treatment and colorblind justice. Does it mean all injustices are prevented or adjudicated? Of course not! We live in the real world for Pete's sake. But, I'll stack the US system against all others, with high confidence honest brokers will find more faults with others.

 

[Dolcevita]

What hogwash! Generalizing an entire country on a few bad apples is intellectually dishonest to say the least. Stressful environments tend to draw out the best and the worst in people, and Private Chen's despicable treatment by his commanding officer, NCOs, and fellow soldiers is deplorable to the extreme. In a perfect world, such things wouldn't happen, but we don't live in a perfect world.

The Army followed SOP by investigating the case, conducting court marshals, and rendering judgements. The case wasn't swept under the rug, and the guilty were punished. We could opine on sufficiency of punishments, but without all the facts, it's just talk. Therefore, we must accept the system rendered proper justice, unless contrary evidence come to light.

I'm not naive about racism in America, nor do I excuse national failures past and present. There are racists in the US government and in its Armed Services, and I'll wager dollars to donuts the numbers aren't insignificant. Nevertheless, it's important to stress bigots come in all colors, genders, and religions, from Privates to Generals. That's why America's Armed Forces have been, and are at the forefront of equal treatment and colorblind justice. Does it mean all injustices are prevented or adjudicated? Of course not! We live in the real world for Pete's sake. But, I'll stack the US system against all others, with high confidence honest brokers will find more faults with others.

I was not generalizing the entire country and was just describing the environment Chinese Americans are subjected to. Private Danny Chen's case I agree is an extreme case of this scenario, But it is a case that personifies the environment we live in today, We see examples of this everyday but of course it does not drive us all to commit suicide. On one extreme are people like Private Danny Chen who could not cope and was driven to commit suicide. On the other extreme are people like self-loathing Gordon Chang, a victims of Stockholm Syndrome. We all are in between these two extremes and fortunately do not have to face these choices. But if we have to, are we going to be more like Danny Chen or Gordon Chang?

I am not saying Private Danny Chen was right to commit suicide. Just thinking aloud here. Just saying most of us just suppress our identity to mitigate any maltreatments.

 

[weig2000]

In separate but simultaneous pieces, WSJ and FT came out with reports that characterize Rodrigo Duterte's moving-away-from-US as personal, as well as political. Not sure if they have coordinated their pieces.

From Wall Street Journal:

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Philippines president, driven by a sense of grievance over colonial history and perceived slights, threatens to undo a vital American relationship in Asia

By Trefor Moss

In an effort to clear tension with

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

, Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte approached him during a dinner at a

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

last month, two days after he had openly criticized the U.S. president.

It made things worse. Mr. Duterte didn’t feel Mr. Obama treated him as an equal in the encounter, says a Philippine official present, because Mr. Obama said a follow-up would come from White House staff, not himself. The next day, Mr. Duterte boycotted a group meeting with Mr. Obama and Southeast Asian leaders.
...

From Financial Time:

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Philippine president’s stance on America stem from deep-rooted anger

When Philippines president

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

at his country’s long-standing alliance with the US during his first official visit to China, the motivation may have been personal as well as political.

Alleged abuse by an American Jesuit priest when he was a schoolboy, a mysterious explosion in his home city of Davao and student years that coincided with the Vietnam war have all stoked Mr Duterte’s anger.

Add the recent US censure of his bloody

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

and the result is

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

.
...

 

[PanAsian]

Wonder where exactly this was and what was China's reaction if any.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

WORLD NEWS | Fri Oct 21, 2016 | 9:38am EDT
Exclusive: U.S. carries out freedom-of-navigation operation in South China Sea - officials

A U.S. navy warship carried out a freedom-of-navigation operation in the South China Sea on Friday near islands claimed by China and two other Asian countries, U.S. officials told Reuters.

The guided-missile destroyer USS Decatur challenged "excessive maritime claims near the Paracel Islands," specifically Triton and Woody Islands, claimed by China, Taiwan and Vietnam, the U.S. officials said, speaking on condition of anonymity.

The Pentagon declined to comment.

(Reporting by Idrees Ali, Matt Spetalnick and David Brunnstrom; Editing by Chizu Nomiyama)

 

[Dolcevita]

Wonder where exactly this was and what was China's reaction if any.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

US being reckless and stirring the pot and being belligerent. Unhappy perhaps with the recent turn of events.

China protests 'illegal,' 'provocative' U.S. South China Sea patrol

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

China's Defense Ministry said that a patrol by a U.S. warship in the South China Sea on Friday was "illegal" and "provocative" and that it had lodged a protest with the United States.

In a statement on its website, the ministry said two Chinese warships had warned the U.S. warship to leave during the patrol. It added that the Chinese military would increase air and sea patrols according to need.

U.S. defense officials said the guided-missile destroyer USS Decatur challenged "excessive maritime claims" in a patrol near the Paracel Islands, among a string of islets, reefs and shoals over which China has territorial disputes with its neighbors.

The Chinese Defense Ministry said two warships, the Guangzhou and the Luoyang, warned the U.S. vessel to leave.

It said China had declared its "baseline" for the Paracel Islands in 1996, something the United States was clear about. Despite that, the Chinese government said, the United States had sent a ship into Chinese "territorial waters."

“This is serious illegal behavior, and is intentionally provocative behavior. China’s Defense Ministry is resolutely opposed to this and has lodged serious representations with the U.S. side,” it said.

The ministry statement said that as a result of hard work by countries in the region, the situation in the South China Sea had seen positive developments, but the United States had conducted the patrol, “motivated by a desire to see the world in chaos."

"This shows that it is the United States which is the troublemaker when it comes to the stability of the South China Sea."

The ministry said the patrol had seriously damaged mutual trust between the two countries and added:

"We strongly urge the U.S. side to respect China’s national sovereignty and security interests, and not keep repeating the same mistakes. The Chinese military will increase its air and maritime patrol efforts in accordance with need, strengthen defense ability building in all areas, and resolutely defend national sovereignty and security."

(Reporting by Ben Blanchard in Beijing; Editing by David Brunnstrom and Jeffrey Benkoe)

 

[Blackstone]

US being reckless and stirring the pot and being belligerent. Unhappy perhaps with the recent turn of events.

All nations have the right to conduct FON operations in accordance with international laws, so contrary to what the Chinese Defense Ministry said, US FON wasn't illegal on its own. As for supposed violation of Chinese territorial waters, we need more facts to determine if that's true.

 

[Dolcevita]

All nations have the right to conduct FON operations in accordance with international laws, so contrary to what the Chinese Defense Ministry said, US FON wasn't illegal on its own. As for supposed violation of Chinese territorial waters, we need more facts to determine if that's true.

China had declared its "baseline" for the Paracel Islands in 1996 in accordance to UNCLOS and international law. There is no ambiguity on what is or what is not territorial waters. Since the US has not ratified and does not recognize UNCLOS, The US is stating that they are challenging the "excessive maritime claims near the Paracel Islands" BASED on what ??? not UNCLOS but ??? their interpretaion of what should be terrotorial waters???? If US wants to challenge the baseline. It should ratify UNCLOS and make their case according to international law, not through military show of force. At least practice what you preach but the US has always had holier than thou attitude towards international law.