China's SCS Strategy Thread

[Hendrik_2000]

Hey I never said that because you have Chinese heritage automatically you are pro China . You are the one that said it I just highlight what Duterte said

For your info Corazon was never been anti China so did Benigno Aquino Sr.
She is even quoted to say that not only she is president of Phillipine but she is also daughter of Hongjian village

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I don't know what gotten into the young Aquino I guess he very much influence by his Foreign Minister De Rosario who is long time Phillipine ambassador to US.Maybe they promise him. Cushy post retirement job with one of those right wing think tank

But it is also true that Chinese Phillipine Chamber of commerce is very powerful organization.
Whose member controlled the real estate development, banking, trade, transportation etc. And those people can improve the livelihood of Philippine people giving right environment in concert with China big ticket expertise

And as I said it repeatedly Duterte priority is improving the people life and he come to conclusion only China can help that is the reason why he is change his tack to China

Now about Singapore . True the leadership has tilt toward the west. But She doesn't have a treaty with US unlike Japan or Australia. That is the price you have to pay for US support in equipping the SAF with mostly US equipment . I am not so sure if push come to shove they will choose US.

Because at the height of Taiwan crisis. The present prime minister went to Taiwan and warn Taiwan not to declare independent causing a rift with Taiwan at that time.
Though Singapore has long standing relation with Taiwan.And owe gratitude. Many Taiwan naval officer and pilot were seconded to Singapore in the early year of SAF to train the young SAF

 

[solarz]

Heh, I'd have thought it's pretty obvious that people with Chinese blood aren't necessarily pro-China. Just look at those Hong Kong kids, the FLG, or the Taiwan DPP.

 

[Iron Man]

Don't forget Gordon Chang, whose ancestors are turning over in their graves daily.

 

[Hendrik_2000]

I don't know what is wrong with Gordon Chang but the Chinese in North America and in South East Asia come form different province and different background.
In the past, most Cantonese are indenture worker and forced to work in building railway in North America.

But most Chinese who went to South east asia are trader.Independent business man and since they collaborate with colonial power in symbiotic relationship, both achieve prosperity and success
They are the upper strata of the society .People look up to them

Most of them come as single man since Imperial China forbid women to immigrate until late 19th century.So in non Muslim country they did intermarry with local like Thai or Filipino

In memory of Cory Aquino

Ex-Philippine president Aquino remembered for her China bonds

For his part, Go said he would never forget what Cory said on the day.

"She told us, you should all be proud because one of the daughters (of Chinese immigrants) became the president," Go said. "I was so moved."

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2009-08-02 19:30:48

By Xinhua Writer Xu Lingui

MANILA, Aug. 2 (Xinhua) -- She was the first woman president in Asia. Her legacy was defined by restoring democracy to the Philippines and ensuring a less corrupt government during her six-year term.

File photo taken on June 6, 2008 shows former Philippine President Corazon Aquino (C) attending a banquet at the residential place of former Philippine President Joseph Estrada (L) in Manila.(Xinhua, File Photo)

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But Corazon "Cory" Aquino, who died on Saturday at the age of 76, was also remembered by Chinese community as a president who openly appreciated her Chinese origin and the first head of state to embark on a "roots-tracing" trip to her ancestral hometown 21 years ago, Chinese-Filipino scholars said.
Aquino, the forth generation of Chinese immigrants, was seen in a rare photo speaking to a huge crowd in the tiny village of Hongjian in Fujian province in southeastern China. Clad in typically yellow-colored "Cory T-shirts", two dozen children in the front row raised their heads in awe to this English-speaking auntie, who was said to be a great-granddaughter from the neighborhood.

Like millions of other small traders in coastal China, Aquino's great grandfather Xu Yuhuan -- known as Jose Cojuangco to Filipinos left his hometown in Fujian province and sailed to the Philippine shore. In 1861, the Cojuangcos started by running a small rice and sugar mill in central Luzon but soon found themselves grow into one of the country's richest families

 

[shen]

SCS has never been a matter of "survival" for the "Communist mandarins" in Beijing.

safeguarding national sovereignty is most definitely a matter of survival for any Chinese government regardless of official ideology. The KMT lost legitimacy domestically largely due to the perception that it wasn't doing enough to counter Western and Japanese aggression. Like it or not, legitimate or not, generations of Chinese people have grown up believing SCS is a part of China. When its sovereignty is threatened, war is not a choice for China. It will be fought to the bitter end.

 

[Iron Man]

When its sovereignty is threatened, war is not a choice for China. It will be fought to the bitter end.

Nah. Your post sounds very flag-wavingly patriotic, but I don't believe that the SCS is as "sovereign" to Chinese leaders as you are trying to claim. Which Chinese leader in their right mind would offer multilateral/multinational development of resources in Tibet? Or Taiwan? Or Xinjiang?

 

[shen]

Nah. Your post sounds very flag-wavingly patriotic, but I don't believe that the SCS is as "sovereign" to Chinese leaders as you are trying to claim. Which Chinese leader in their right mind would offer multilateral/multinational development of resources in Tibet? Or Taiwan? Or Xinjiang?

I'm simply convening the mood of the general Chinese public. I've seen very anti-Communist Chinese get excited and casually talk about going to war in the event of going Taiwan independence.

But you are the right, the exact meaning of "sovereign" is flexible. In East China Sea just as in SCS, China is willing to push back the sovereign dispute indefinitely, and reduced tension through joint resource development. It is perception, to the domestic public, that matters.

 

[advill]

I found the postings very interesting. Tracing the historical achievements of the Overseas Chinese businesses, I must add that a few Chinese sub-cultural (clan) groups contributed to business successes for their families and their respective countries their forefathers had migrated. There were several clans who left Southern China during the famine & Chinese civil wars in the 19th & early 20th Centuries. In Thailand, the Teochew Clan, now known as Chao zao (sic) became the engines of economic growth. Most have also taken Thai names. In Singapore and Malaysia it is the Hokien clan that established successful businesses and banks since the British colonial period. Same too with Indonesia where big Chinese tycoons operated, We all already know that the Cantonese and Fukienese were and still run successful in businesses in HK and Philippines respectively. However, all these sub-cultural (clan) groups besides being successful economically/financially, now owe their allegiance to their respective indigenous independent countries. A common misconception by some quarters is that all these Overseas Chinese should owe their allegiance to their "motherland" China. There are several diatribes recently, which is best in my personal opinion be left to open debate/discussion in CCTV "Dialogue" or BBC TV etc. rather than any long expose' in a written blog. Incidentally, we also know that well educated Overseas Chinese have also made respectable inroads in the leaderships/governments of Singapore, Malaysia, Thailand, Philippines and quite recently in Indonesia (Jakarta's Chinese Governor standing for re-election soon)). My take is that we should never follow the Texan-style former US President Bush Jnr, who brashly (for his own reasons) demanded "Whether you are either For or Against us" after 9-11 attacks. The resultant mess we see in the Middle East is unfortunate, and this narrow concept is not recommended to be demanded by any major power. Switzerland, a small country survived during WW II Nazi Occupation of Europe by being neutral.

 

[Blackstone]

safeguarding national sovereignty is most definitely a matter of survival for any Chinese government regardless of official ideology. The KMT lost legitimacy domestically largely due to the perception that it wasn't doing enough to counter Western and Japanese aggression. Like it or not, legitimate or not, generations of Chinese people have grown up believing SCS is a part of China. When its sovereignty is threatened, war is not a choice for China. It will be fought to the bitter end.

Right you are, and least anyone forgets, one of the big reasons the Qing Dynasty collapsed was its inability to safeguard Chinese sovereignty and territory. Therefore, any government that leads China would loose its "Mandate of Heaven" if it can't protect Chinese sovereignty. That's true on the Mainland, in Taiwan, in Hong Kong, and in the South China Sea.

 

[Iron Man]

I found the postings very interesting. Tracing the historical achievements of the Overseas Chinese businesses, I must add that a few Chinese sub-cultural (clan) groups contributed to business successes for their families and their respective countries their forefathers had migrated. There were several clans who left Southern China during the famine & Chinese civil wars in the 19th & early 20th Centuries. In Thailand, the Teochew Clan, now known as Chao zao (sic) became the engines of economic growth. Most have also taken Thai names. In Singapore and Malaysia it is the Hokien clan that established successful businesses and banks since the British colonial period. Same too with Indonesia where big Chinese tycoons operated, We all already know that the Cantonese and Fukienese were and still run successful in businesses in HK and Philippines respectively. However, all these sub-cultural (clan) groups besides being successful economically/financially, now owe their allegiance to their respective indigenous independent countries. A common misconception by some quarters is that all these Overseas Chinese should owe their allegiance to their "motherland" China. There are several diatribes recently, which is best in my personal opinion be left to open debate/discussion in CCTV "Dialogue" or BBC TV etc. rather than any long expose' in a written blog. Incidentally, we also know that well educated Overseas Chinese have also made respectable inroads in the leaderships/governments of Singapore, Malaysia, Thailand, Philippines and quite recently in Indonesia (Jakarta's Chinese Governor standing for re-election soon)). My take is that we should never follow the Texan-style former US President Bush Jnr, who brashly (for his own reasons) demanded "Whether you are either For or Against us" after 9-11 attacks. The resultant mess we see in the Middle East is unfortunate, and this narrow concept is not recommended to be demanded by any major power. Switzerland, a small country survived during WW II Nazi Occupation of Europe by being neutral.

The financial successes achieved by the overseas Chinese diaspora have been frequent cause for jealousy and persecution by local populations. They are basically like the Jews of SE Asia. Just look at the pogroms and institutional racism against ethnic Chinese in Indonesia, Malaysia and other places.