Chengdu next gen combat aircraft (?J-36) thread

[HailingTX20]

Here are some cool CG renderings of what the cockpit might look like. Though it should be clear that they aren't based on any real available information other than that it's a side-by-side cockpit.

Credit: See watermark

 

[talonn]

OOT but after looking at picture above, I was wondering if we have dedicated thread to discuss about pilot's helmets. I couldn't find it

 

[BillRamengod]

A little teaser
View attachment 152487
View attachment 152488

Pictures from Research on All-Domain Fire Field in Future Air Combat


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[BillRamengod]

2/3

 

[BillRamengod]

3/3

 

[Coach46]

To be fair, the US has been developing and testing tailless designs (for future supersonic fighter applications) since at least the 1990s.

The most visible examples being the Bird of Prey and X-36.

Based on what we've witnessed, it's plausible or arguably more likely than not that China has since surpassed the US in this domain, as it has in other areas like HGVs and MaRVs, in part due to years of DoD misprioritizations.

However, unless you have access to highly classified data from SAC, CAC, Lockheed, Northrop and Boeing on the current states of their tailless efforts, we ought to maintain an open mind and a measure of humility until enough information emerges to allow for a reasonably comprehensive comparison of next gen Chinese and American tailless designs.

This is not the Bird of Prey, its McDonnell Douglas X-36

 

[Tomboy]

This is not the Bird of Prey, its McDonnell Douglas X-36

Imagine if F-47 is just a bigger version of BoP

 

[Phantom Chuck]

It only indicates a mtow of between 50 and 60 tonnes. If it were any heavier then the requirements will be no less than 70 tonnes.

So, TOW of J-36 is over 60 tonnes? How's that possible?

If J-36’s three engines are WS-15s, then the maximum thrust is around 20 tons each. The J-36 can still attain thrust to weight ratio of 1:1 at its claimed 60 ton MTOW

A typical internal fuel fraction of a large long range combat aircraft is around 40% of MTOW. so a 60 ton j-36 can probably hold around 24 tons of fuel at take off. If it burns 15 tons of internal fuel on the way to target, it would arrive over mission area at around 45 tons. At 45 tons, even if it were equipped with WS-10, it can still manage 1:1 thrust ratio while over the target.

so 60 ton MTOW does not seem excessive for a aircraft with 3 large after burning turbofan for power, and whose intended mission profile doesn’t say dog fight.

 

[Phantom Chuck]

Another sign that J36 is probably not a bomber but a fighter:

It had about as much installed thrust as the B-1 bomber, but it weights only 1/3 as much.

 

[siegecrossbow]

If J-36’s three engines are WS-15s, then the maximum thrust is around 20 tons each. The J-36 can still attain thrust to weight ratio of 1:1 at its claimed 60 ton MTOW

A typical internal fuel fraction of a large long range combat aircraft is around 40% of MTOW. so a 60 ton j-36 can probably hold around 24 tons of fuel at take off. If it burns 15 tons of internal fuel on the way to target, it would arrive over mission area at around 45 tons. At 45 tons, even if it were equipped with WS-10, it can still manage 1:1 thrust ratio while over the target.

so 60 ton MTOW does not seem excessive for a aircraft with 3 large after burning turbofan for power, and whose intended mission profile doesn’t say dog fight.

WS-15 most likely cannot do 20 tons even at sea level. Optimistic projections put it at 18 tons but Orca says that it is still high. The most important metric of a military turbofan is not its maximum thrust.