Thank you for the clarification. If possible, could you please share any further details about this ALCM—such as official confirmation, academic papers, concept disclosures, or other credible sources that support its existence?
Ask anything Thread (Air Force)
- Thread starter Jeff Head
- Start date
Thank you for the clarification. If possible, could you please share any further details about this ALCM—such as official confirmation, academic papers, concept disclosures, or other credible sources that support its existence?
Lol, if we had official confirmation, academic papers or concept disclosures, it would have been posted ages ago and be widespread knowledge such that we wouldn't be having this discussion
What we know about the 5th gen sized ALCM is from quite good rumours from like 5-6 years ago (might have been pb at the time) that such a weapon exists. I'm pretty sure the likes of Yankee et al have mentioned it on occasion as well.
Basically -- we don't know its name, we don't know its exact configuration, but it has been suggested as a 500kg class compact ALCM, which to the last of our knowledge, allows four to be carried in the IWB of J-20/35 (no other weapons in such a loadout in the ventral IWB). Range class, appearance, specific guidance all known but one could make a feasible guess based on what other systems in the world look like.
But to soothe people's insecurities over whether J-20/35 has a ALCM/powered stand off strike weapon, yes they do. But we don't know much else, so better just to wait patiently. If we're lucky we might get a picture in 5-10 years time.
AKF-98 has folding wings, but no folding fins.
As for hardpoints, sure in theory it could be accommodated on J-20/35's external hardpoints. Or alternatively they may have a more modern and volume efficient ALCM for external carriage.
Stealthy subsonic ALCMs are not that technologically sophisticated these days. The fact that AKF-98 and YJ-18C exist, as well as some export cleared other systems (including an export cleared AKF-98), means such systems aren't that exotic.
We have seen many rumors regarding the Hongniao (红鸟) series missiles—HN-1, HN-2, and HN-3. Does this project genuinely exist, or was it eventually rejected by the PLAAF?
Sorry for disturbing you again, as you mentioned earlier, subsonic missiles are not particularly sophisticated by today’s standards. Don't you think the PLAAF really needs a system similar to SIAW, or perhaps an even more advanced option such as a supersonic or hypersonic missile that could be easily integrated into internal hardpoints?
Sorry for disturbing you again, as you mentioned earlier, subsonic missiles are not particularly sophisticated by today’s standards. Don't you think the PLAAF really needs a system similar to SIAW, or perhaps an even more advanced option such as a supersonic or hypersonic missile that could be easily integrated into internal hardpoints?
The problem with weapons like SiAW is that they trade payload for compactness (to fit in 5th generation IWBs) and range.
For the PLA, at a system of systems level they have many other strike capabilities either from other aerial platforms or from other launch platforms in other domains which do not have to trade payload for compactness or range. If you want such a weapon to be higher speed as well in the same compact footprint, then you're going to have to trade even more compromises in payload or range.
Chances are the PLA will have some sort of higher speed air to ground strike weapon for J-20/35's internal weapons bays for "completeness" but as far as priorities go, there are more productive form factors to pursue in terms of highly capable fires (not to mention larger aerial platforms like GJ-X and the H-20 or whatever it'll end up being called).
As for "HN" -- we haven't really seen "many rumours" about it. It's just a past name that has been associated with a generic tomahawk/KD-20 pattern cruise missile in the past. It's not necessarily some exotic stealthy LACM. The "HN" series of names is not something I've seen posted in nearly 15 years.
Besides, the PLA already has AKF-98 and YJ-18C (which we know of) for that form factor.
It’s definitely a cooling intake, but I can’t say for sure what its purpose is. Note that near the trailing edge of the vertical stab there’s a matching outlet that most likely is the exhaust of this cooling inlet so my money would be that’s it’s there to cool avionics and/or oil from engines.
p.s. the exhaust is a bit hard to see in this particular photo due to the angle, check my attached photo for a better view
Attachments
-
IMG_8786.jpeg
We know? Now I‘m surprised and maybe I‘m getting old and forgettable but even if there are indeed rumours, I don‘t remember any hard proof or confirmation for this ALCM, even lesser an image or model?!
Or do we have written confirmation in documents? And if yes, could you please help to post them?
This is from like 2020 or even late 2010s I believe, from pb I believe which was posted in one of the threads here, for a 500kg class ALCM/AShM.
"We know" it exists in the same sense that "we know" the 3-5 quad pack MR SAM for UVLS exists -- i.e.: no documentation, no model, no definitive specs or full form factor, but that its "mission set" is fulfilled by a product that exists.
For the purposes of discussion, if I was to write about it among "skeptics" I would likely phrase it as: "There have been longstanding indicators that a 500kg class stand off multirole cruise missile exists for use in J-20/J-35 ventral internal weapons bays, however such a weapon has yet to be revealed or publicly disclosed."
For the purposes of our discussion on SDF, I am surprised that you do not recall this weapon being discussed.
To be fair it isn't that important because it's "only" a 500kg IWB cruise missile, so its effects and strategic significance are somewhat limited.
The problem with PLA missiles carried "internally" (whether it's IWB or in VLS cells) is that they can often be tested in relative obscurity and can enter service with next to no confirmation to us in the public apart from errant rumours that are brought up or referenced once every few years. PL-16 (until recently), the 3-5 quad pack MR SAM, and this IWB ALCM for J-20/35 are examples of it.
J-20 has them too but have mesh covering.