ARM cuts ties with Huawei, threatening future chip designs


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AndrewS

Captain
Registered Member
Regarding Ark OS, I'm afraid you guys are too excited that you forget one big guy; the mobile OS's cartel "GOOGLE". Assume Huawei's ban is lift so Google can continue to supply its Android to Huawei, do you think Google is happy seeing Ark OS challenging its near monopoly in mobile OS position? iOS lives in its own world, so we don't care. I remember some years ago Alibaba developed its Aliyun OS and wanted to launch in some model of some hand-phone. I don't remember which one. Google threatened that if the company launch Aliyun on the mobile phone, Google will cut its Android from that company entirely. So what about Huawei's situation today? If I to stand in Google's position, I'd tell Huawei "you better keep the Ark OS in your safe, or this time not the US government but I WILL BAN YOU!"
It's possible that Google cut off Huawei, if Huawei launch Ark OS.

But remember the following:

1. This will immediately raise a huge anti-trust investigation into Google (in China, Europe and possibly the USA) for blatantly abusing its monopoly.
We're talking billions in fines.

2. Huawei may have already decided that it may never be removed from the Entity List, and once Meng is extradited and convicted in a US court, it's just going to get worse again.
In the medium-term, Huawei know they're always going to be at risk if they continue to rely on Google (or any other US tech), and if there is an ongoing trade war.
Just look at what happened with the US-Japan trade wars previously.
And this trade war is going to be worse because we're seeing a power transition from the USA to China, and which will take 10+ years

So Huawei may have decided that they have no choice but to challenge Google, and create a Huawei/China/Global standard around Ark OS.

And it is feasible to use the vast Chinese market to do this.
 

hkbc

Junior Member
I was thinking in what ways was HSBC linked to the arrest. And now this has happened after a somewhat long delay.

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HSBC Tells Beijing It Is Not to Blame for Huawei CFO Arrest: FT

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has started a lobbying drive to convince the Chinese government that it’s not responsible for the arrest of
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’s Chief Financial Officer Meng Wanzhou, the FT said, citing several people briefed on the discussions.



The bank is trying to distance itself from the diplomatic row over the Chinese telecom equipment maker, as it has stepped up engagement with Chinese officials after the arrest of Meng in December, the
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. Meng is under house arrest in Vancouver after being detained on a U.S. request.



HSBC has provided information that helped U.S. prosecutors build the case against Meng and Huawei in a move that has angered executives at the telecom company, the newspaper said, citing people familiar with the matter.



John Flint, HSBC’s chief executive, and other senior executives have told Chinese officials that it had little choice but to co-operate with the investigation after the U.S. Department of Justice requested information, the FT reported.
This is hilarious, so the Yankee Doodle Dandy's make a huge stink about how some Chinese law will mean the Chinese government can compel Huawei to divulge stuff but they merrily go and compel a British Bank to get information on Huawei's CFO! You can't make up this hypocrisy! Guess HSBC doing its best not to end up on China's Entity list given its massive exposure in Asia!
 

Gatekeeper

Captain
Registered Member
This is hilarious, so the Yankee Doodle Dandy's make a huge stink about how some Chinese law will mean the Chinese government can compel Huawei to divulge stuff but they merrily go and compel a British Bank to get information on Huawei's CFO! You can't make up this hypocrisy! Guess HSBC doing its best not to end up on China's Entity list given its massive exposure in Asia!
Not half as hilarious as some members here keeps harping on about how west respect international law, and there's always checks and balances. Blah blah blah.

All the time.they keep pointing their fingers at China. The west is doing exactly what they said China is doing. Yet not a single squeak of protestations ever come from these members!
Hypocrisy at its ugly best!
 

AndrewS

Captain
Registered Member
Following on from HSBC, it doesn't look good for Meng in a US court. As per the articles at the bottom.
---
Given the minor amounts involved in the Iran equipment deals, was it really worth it? I suspect Huawei regrets all this.
That's leaving aside whether you agree with Iran sanctions or not.

So when you add all of this together, I think Huawei sees that it has no choice but to remove any reliance on US technology.

And that leads to the creation of a non-US technology world, backed by the Chinese market, which is many times larger than the US equivalent in most categories of tech.

As for HSBC, it does look like they went beyond what was required, in the hope of being leniancy from billions in fines from the US government.
So I don't see how HSBC can escape being made an example of, with an even larger penalty from the Chinese government.

For example, there's a huge amount of money laundering in Hong Kong that HSBC is involved in, as the financial regulator has a very cosy relationship with the bank.
So that relationship may well change

Exclusive: HSBC probe helped lead to U.S. charges against Huawei CFO
Reuters
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NEW YORK/LONDON (Reuters) - An internal investigation by HSBC Holdings PLC into Huawei Technologies’ connections to a suspected front company in Iran found that the Chinese telecommunications equipment maker maintained close financial ties to the firm years after purportedly selling the unit, documents reviewed by Reuters show.

The HSBC probe of Huawei came in late 2016 and 2017 as the bank was trying to get the U.S. Department of Justice (DOJ) to dismiss criminal charges for the bank’s own misconduct involving U.S. sanctions.

The bank’s findings, which have not been made public, were given in a series of presentations in 2017 to the DOJ. The department used them to help bring its current criminal case against Huawei’s chief financial officer, Meng Wanzhou.

She is accused of conspiring to defraud HSBC and other banks by misrepresenting Huawei’s relationship with the suspected front company, Skycom Tech Co Ltd. Huawei has said Skycom was a local business partner in Iran, while the United States maintains it was an unofficial subsidiary used to conceal Huawei’s Iran business. Huawei and Skycom are also defendants in the U.S. case, accused of bank and wire fraud, as well as violating U.S. sanctions on Iran.

U.S. authorities allege Huawei used Skycom to obtain embargoed U.S. goods and technology in Iran and to move money out of the country via the international banking system. As a result of Huawei’s deception, U.S. authorities allege, HSBC and other banks cleared more than $100 million of transactions related to Skycom through the United States that potentially violated economic sanctions Washington had in place at the time against doing business with Iran.

Huawei declined to comment for this story. The company has denied the charges in the case.

Robert Sherman, a spokesman for HSBC, said, “Information provided by HSBC to the Justice Department was provided pursuant to formal demand, including grand jury subpoena or other obligation to provide information pursuant to a Deferred Prosecution Agreement or similar legal obligation.”

He added, “The U.S. Department of Justice has confirmed that HSBC is not under investigation in this case.”

A Justice Department spokesman declined to comment.

Meng, the daughter of Huawei’s founder, was arrested in Vancouver in December. She remains free on bail while the U.S. government tries to have her extradited to face bank and wire fraud charges. The case comes at a time of heightened trade tensions between Washington and Beijing, and amid concerns by the United States that Huawei’s equipment could be used for Chinese espionage. The Shenzhen-based company, the world’s largest maker of telecommunications networking equipment, has repeatedly denied such claims.

Meng has maintained she is innocent of the allegations made against her.

Reuters reported in December that HSBC – which is referred to in the indictment only as “Financial Institution 1” – figured prominently in the Huawei case. HSBC’s internal probe of Huawei is reported here for the first time.

The HSBC documents contain new financial details about Huawei’s relationship with Skycom and the company that Huawei claims it sold Skycom to in 2007, Canicula Holdings Ltd. All three firms previously had bank accounts at HSBC, with the Skycom and Canicula accounts part of what the bank internally called the “Huawei Mastergroup.”

The HSBC probe found numerous ties between the three firms that suggested Huawei controlled both Skycom and Canicula long after the purported sale, the documents show. For example, Canicula’s address was “c/o Huawei Technologies.”

The probe also found that Huawei financed Canicula’s purchase of Skycom, lending Canicula about 14 million euros in a deal the documents show didn’t close until December 2009. Canicula repaid Huawei a year later using funds from Skycom.

After HSBC asked Huawei in 2013 to close the Skycom and Canicula accounts, Huawei employees assisted the bank. At Huawei’s request, the remaining funds in the Skycom account were transferred to a Huawei bank account, according to the documents.

HSBC’s move to close the accounts followed stories by Reuters in 2012 and 2013 about Huawei, Skycom, Canicula and Meng. The articles – which are cited in the HSBC documents as well as the indictment – reported that Skycom had offered to sell at least 1.3 million euros worth of embargoed Hewlett-Packard computer equipment to Iran’s largest mobile-phone operator in 2010. Reuters also reported that Meng had served on Skycom’s board of directors between February 2008 and April 2009.

The earlier Reuters coverage can be read here
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and here
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.

The indictment alleges that banks in part relied on Huawei’s false statements in the Reuters stories – that it hadn’t violated sanctions on Iran and that Skycom was a local partner – to continue doing business with Huawei and Skycom.

HSBC had its own sanctions issues. In 2012, it paid $1.92 billion and entered into a five-year deferred prosecution agreement with the Justice Department for disregarding rules designed to prevent money laundering and processing transactions that violated sanctions.

Under the deal, HSBC agreed to strengthen its sanctions and anti-money laundering programs and to cooperate with the Justice Department in any investigations. To conduct its probe of Huawei, it hired the law firm Latham & Watkins.

The law firm did not respond to requests for comment.

According to the HSBC documents, investigators conducted more than 100 interviews, reviewed more than 292,000 emails and analyzed years of financial transactions. At least four presentations were made to the Justice Department between February and July 2017. The criminal charges against the bank were dismissed in December 2017.

The bank’s Huawei probe found that in August 2013, at Huawei’s request, HSBC’s then deputy head of global banking for the Asia Pacific region, Alan Thomas, met with Meng. According to the HSBC documents, Meng later provided Thomas with a PowerPoint presentation in English that stated that Huawei had sold its shares in Skycom and that she was no longer on its board. The presentation described Skycom as a Huawei “business partner” in Iran. That presentation – which the United States alleges contained “numerous misrepresentations” – plays a central role in the U.S. case against Meng.

Thomas, who retired in 2017, declined to comment.

In the months after the meeting with Meng, HSBC considered whether to retain Huawei as a customer, the documents show. The bank initially concluded the reputational risks were acceptable and kept on Huawei. But, according to the indictment, HSBC told Huawei around 2017 that it was terminating the relationship.

The HSBC probe also uncovered financial transactions by Canicula that referenced Syria or involved a Syrian bank. Reuters reported last month that until 2017 Canicula operated in Syria, where it was connected to Huawei. Like Iran, Syria has been subject to U.S. sanctions.

Two people familiar with Canicula’s operations in Syria have since told Reuters that Huawei used the company to circumvent sanctions there.

HSBC also told the Justice Department that it was aware of another company linked to Skycom in Iran. In August 2016, the HSBC documents say, the bank was notified by a British engineering recruitment company, Matchtech Group Ltd, that a Matchtech subsidiary had provided contractors to support telecommunications projects in Iran from 2010 to 2016.

The subsidiary, Networkers International Ltd, had contracted with Skycom and Huawei, and had received payments in U.S. dollars from Skycom, the HSBC documents state. The payments totaled about $7.6 million, the documents show. Networkers terminated its Iran-related contract with Skycom in October 2016, Matchtech told HSBC.

Matchtech is now known as Gattaca plc. A spokesman for Gattaca declined to comment.
 

Arkboy

New Member
Registered Member
Lol I'm less worried about Meng and more worried about the future of Chinese people overall. I'm terrified we'll end up like the Jews in their darkest days all because they used their brains instead of brawn.

Remember what Yang said:
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Of all the candidates on that debate stage Yang was given the least amount of time even though many others polled less than him. He also claimed his mic was at times cut off to prevent him from joining in a conversation... NBC denies it but supporters pointed out there were video evidence of this indeed happening.

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Bloomberg published article recently where it seems FBI is going around universities across America to deputize these campuses to do the governments bidding in keeping extra tabs on the Chinese students and Chinese researchers, whether or not they are US citizens. Case in point what happened to a cancer researcher in MD Anderson Houston, Texas... She, US citizen, was falsely accused of spying for China and although never actually charged much less convicted, she was basically shunned and effectively forced to resign her position which she worked at for 30 years.

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Peter2018

Junior Member
Registered Member
This is hilarious, so the Yankee Doodle Dandy's make a huge stink about how some Chinese law will mean the Chinese government can compel Huawei to divulge stuff but they merrily go and compel a British Bank to get information on Huawei's CFO! You can't make up this hypocrisy! Guess HSBC doing its best not to end up on China's Entity list given its massive exposure in Asia!
They probably need to kick HSBC out. This British bank moved their HQ from Hong Kong to London many years ago. They still make most of their profits from Hong Kong.
 

AndrewS

Captain
Registered Member
They probably need to kick HSBC out. This British bank moved their HQ from Hong Kong to London many years ago. They still make most of their profits from Hong Kong.
I think that is too extreme a move.

But it would be worth reminding HSBC that China/HK is way more important than the USA.
Particularly since the US government keeps fining them billions of dollars.

And remember that sometime in the future, HSBC will be one of the key players in building an alternative to the USD payment system
 

Deino

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
@Arkboy !!

Sorry to get in contact only via this way, but to an unknown reason I cannot start a conversation with you behind the scene!

Could you please explain what was the reason to start this insulting criminal thread in the strategic section? To accuse me I threatened you in person is beyond anything I ever had to notice in my already long life being active in several forums. :mad::eek:

So please explain, why that mess??
 
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