Russia Vs Georgia..a widening crisis!

Finn, its just a matter of getting weapon systems that are of third party use. that is one reason for the no go on the merkava, The Bill,SPIKE and so on are all used by diff nations thus giving the supplier the uh...will have to investigate that...you know just like the terrorists or just to be PC "party of god" using Kornet against Israeli tanks. The other heavy weapons would be validated by joining NATO or under pretext protection against further russian aggression.

oh..and end user agreements are dust especially after the lebanon war. U.S and Israel are like...wink wink nod..."no, oh great giant bear, we would never give weapons to georgia..."did you loose another submarine".....name that movie?

 

Listing all the fancy kit that Georgia had, have or will have doesen't much help you if you don't have a trained army to operate them.

This "campaing" of Georgians showed that not only did they lack the very basics of diplomatic code of conduct but also practically every single aspect of basic strategical and tactical thinking of of modern warfare not to mention actual military training of how to fight. Reading the stuff what actually took place in the South Ossetia really makes me sad tough I'm utterly biased to Russian side...All the myth about heroic Georgian defending their homeland has fell in the gutter. It was tragi-comical fars of paper army playing real army and paying a hard prize...Us old grunts in here could have planned the initial georgian asault much better than it actually went on.

So If there would be a seccond phase of this war (which wont happen, Georgians wont be that stubid again) only thing that would avoid another similar humiliation would be foreing troops that actually knows how to fight helping Georgia out. You could give them all the toys from the stores but without knowing how to use them they are just that...toys.

 

More out of Ukraine, the Regions Party is attempting to sack the foreign minster over the "illegal" presence of US warships in the Black Sea. Thing to watch out for here; if Yanukovych and Tymoshenko form a coalition (which is looking more and more likely they will) then they will control the govt and could leave Yushchenko with no real power...

http://news.smh.com.au/world/political-crisis-in-ukraine-continues-20080904-49vi.html

 

Gol, San...I will agree with you that the U.S was kind of the puppet master but I do know from on the ground the Georgians in ossetia fought with a high degree of professionalism. First hand reports have them using next generation arty munitions with cluster bomblets to great effect against Russian tanks, they also used the SPIKE in killing tanks pretty well, HOWEVER, once it was apparent that Russia was planning its own move into Georgia on its own IE 1 full MR division and airborne Division already staged out it too was planning this.

I do know Ossetia separatist got the green light only after the Ossetians got absolute backing from big bear for intervention THEN got nasty and started attacking Georgian troops around ossetia. Georgia then moved, There were very few people living in the area at the time because Ossetian new it was coming then provoked it. Georgia bit like a striped bass and Washington did not know Russia could or would move so fast and in order to maintain the current Georgian government once Intel showed the bear had enough fire power to turn Georgia into something like Chechnya did Washington tell Georgia drop back and lets re-look at this.

Georgia kept its military and equipment above 70% and around 400 dead maybe 1,000 wounded mainly from the brigade in Ossetia. Its communication nets have already been re-installed by the Mount Whitney and supporting warships. We do know that communication systems have been going in along with more weapons.

The positives is that the DoD knows what russia can and can not do. We were watching and listening and the conclusion from information sources that I have is that the DoD is very happy with Russias warfighting ability as once things got into OP-2 the DoD saw that the russians telegraph its punches and are none to good in combined air operations. Rumor mill statment but pretty good sources" If this were Poland russia would have been defeated hands down" I understand russian communication nets are open for U.S Hi tech monitoring and had 100% situational awareness on there whole OP-PLAN around -2. We could hear what russian company commanders were bitching about and said were going well. Mainly again, SPIKE or other ATGW, Arty with submunitions and sniper teams. Russian columns jammed long stretches of road and did not go over land like U.S forces. Reports from DoD watching via satellite claim they could of just decimated most of the russian force with B-2 in just a matter of hours and taken out airfields in southern Russia.

Quote from **source**" it is very apperent these guys can only fight a 1970s type of war.Their war fighting doctrine and tech is 40 years behind us and they have little unified command structure. BUT, washington is going to play this like the bear is back and we are going to play along for funding"....cheers ute

 

^ Sigh.... suffering a major strategic blow is a funny way to show your strength.

Russia used its third tier troops and irregulars. It worked. The first tier troops would be a totally different animal.

 

Theres Russian spetsnaz and paratrops fighting. These are first tier troops. 19 Motorized division is a good unit too. Also all troops participating in fighting have recieved many exercises and training before the war as well as ammo and petrol supply.

 

Ute, have you by any change read the article posted in the post 423 of this thread? It's sofar the most detailed and all-covering analyze of the whole conflict and despite minor factual errors it's quite accurate and plausible.

That particular article gives bit different insight than your "fought with a high degree of professionalism" claim. Infact it gives completely opposite image oft he georgians and reveals that instead of being anyway near of any sort of professionalism they showed incompetense in almoust all areas of warfare and even plain stubidity. I know it's just an article and analyze of some individual (friend of Sandyj if I inturpered it right) but the facts and end result back it up quite well...

 

As even groups like the Taliban have repeatedly demonstrated, being poorly equipped is less important than effective organization, after all. This is something the Georgians seem to have neglected.