business jet AWACs are small, too small for China's needs. Y-20 is a much better platform IMO.
Chinese Aviation Industry
- Thread starter FriedRiceNSpice
- Start date
business jet AWACs are small, too small for China's needs. Y-20 is a much better platform IMO.
The West continues to sell aircraft and supply parts to China. It is a long conspiracy trying to weaken China's aviation industry. Of course, China knew this was a Western trap, but it was too tempting and he couldn't refuse.
To get out of this trap, China needs to adopt a strategy of XiangYu: "Break the kettles and sink the boats". By making retreat impossible, you basically make sure your entire army is fully committed to winning (if you lose, you will die and have no other choice).
Ban all foreign parts. Accept domestic aircraft with lower quality, higher cost, but definitely use 100% domestic components, then continuously improve quality and reduce costs
To get out of this trap, China needs to adopt a strategy of XiangYu: "Break the kettles and sink the boats". By making retreat impossible, you basically make sure your entire army is fully committed to winning (if you lose, you will die and have no other choice).
Ban all foreign parts. Accept domestic aircraft with lower quality, higher cost, but definitely use 100% domestic components, then continuously improve quality and reduce costs
Wait.
No one stopped China from researching and innovating and thereby leapfrogging Western companies. Ofcourse, one can indeed point at the suspicious business practises that goes against "free market ethics" in Civil aviation that both EU and US employs.
But China cares not much for "free market ethics" and therefore is one of the few countries which can meet the oligopoly champs halfway.
I mentioned a Chinese company Wuxi Hyatech which manufacturers compressor blades for major aviation Turbofans. That company wouldn't exist if not for the western companies you insisted should be banned. Ban never works - atleast towards the intended effect. Compete and innovate.
Like some, China has unique strengths that many countries wish ( and even pray before going to bed everyday) to have. Leverage them.
In not saying that china should support other country´s industry. The second phrase i have already answered.
You want to compare iran to china? not to mention the size of the economy, there is the crucial issue of iran possibly wanting to build a nuclear weapon, something that the west, and specially the US, will never acept. So, you cant possibly compare the two countries.
China doesnt really need a civilian airline industry to have military planes, even if the chinese military needs a plane like C919.
Thats the only thing that i can see that china really needs a "civilian" airliner (more military than civilian). But then, how many such planes does the chinese government needs? its not that the top chinese leadership needs that many planes.
manqiangrexue
Brigadier
You've learned nothing from the semiconductor/lithpgraphy bans? Money or no money, the US will call something a national security issue and ban its sale if it can hurt China. Money means nothing; it is only an artificial construct with no intrinsic value. Technology is everything. For an aspiring superpower, total self-sufficiency is a necessity.
I think you missed my point.
The civilian military tie up would result in gains in production speed, maturation of technology and breakthroughs in efficiency. Civilian Turbofans and associated improvements often find their way to military high bypass Turbofans. The PW800 series turbofans, for example, is touted for big Business jets. It is also an engine considered for B-52 upgrade.
I don't think China would say no to aerial refueling and strategic transport solutions based on a C929 /C919.
In the early '00's, China purchased a B767 to be used as presidential aircraft. It was sent to a company in San Antonio for interior furnishing, but it was found later that the aircraft was fully bugged. In the end, the idea to use it as presidential aircraft was scrapped.
I was going to mention this fact in my early reply to @Orthan, but left it out to keep the post short. There are simply too many reasons for China to have its own commercial aircraft industry - too numerous to list. That's why I said I wasn't sure he was naive or just being sinister.
Why is it too small and why does it have to be larger?
Why, for ex, not both types, as it is the case right now?
Forget screwing over paying customers, western politicians have no problem with screwing themselves over. For what? I'm not even sure.
I passed by a car dealership with no new cars in inventory. The semiconductor "shortage" is 100% self inflicted
Who's winning in this scenario?
Western companies? No, they don't have anything to sell.
Chinese companies? No, they can't make enough of what customers want.
ASEAN countries? If the Chinese supply chain wasn't disrupted, maybe...
A good AWAC plane needs to be able to loft a heavy radar and also have sufficient internal volume for enough crew to analyze data, give commands, etc.
The Y-9 platform has 25k kg lift capacity and 23k kg fuel capacity with 65k kg maximum takeoff weight.
A typical business jet like Gulfstream G550 has 21k kg empty weight, 19k kg fuel weight, 41k kg max takeoff weight, making it's effective lift weight 1000 kg which is barely enough for a 10 person crew each weighing 70 kg, never mind a very large radar array that also adds drag, or the electronic equipment requires for processing, or cooling systems for the radar, or hydraulic actuators for tilting the radar, or any emergency countermeasures...
They claim a 2.8k kg payload, I'm not sure about that, but even that is just tiny.