So where's the evidence China only "rarely" sent patrols to the disputed areas, when it had clearly been building roads and other infrastructure in them for over a decade?
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Ladakh Flash Point
- Thread starter Mt1701d
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You are right. As I said, China was patrolling just as much as India, hence it was blocking IA from going past finger 4 in Pangong as Colonel Dinny said. And as you said, in other areas india probably patrols more. Those aren't involved in the standoff though. And China built the road in Pangong in 1999, and its roads in Gogra and hot Springs area were built several years before the standoff.
And if you really believe VK Singh, you must also believe that PLA suffered 60+ casualties in Galwan.
China's PLA blocked India from going past finger 4 AFTER at least March or April. The news didn't even come out until around May. Modi wouldn't even talk or admit to this confrontation (because he didn't know how to play this unpredicted path) until after May and June fighting made the severity obvious enough for Modi's opposition to scream about it twenty times a day.
So before PLA occupied and captured F8 to F4, India at least patrolled other parts of the disputed land if not also F4 onwards because there was no PLA occupation of F8 to F4 at that time. Indian troops could patrol on foot and to be honest this is the main method and they could access F4 and east through northern access points which are well within disputed 20%.
This video is from finger 4 in 2017China's PLA blocked India from going past finger 4 AFTER at least March or April. The news didn't even come out until around May. Modi wouldn't even talk or admit to this confrontation (because he didn't know how to play this unpredicted path) until after May and June fighting made the severity obvious enough for Modi's opposition to scream about it twenty times a day.
So before PLA occupied and captured F8 to F4, India at least patrolled other parts of the disputed land if not also F4 onwards because there was no PLA occupation of F8 to F4 at that time. Indian troops could patrol on foot and to be honest this is the main method and they could access F4 and east through northern access points which are well within disputed 20%.
Col. Dinny, who actually led patrols there until around 2015 gives a good description of India-China confrontations there
Once again, you have provided no evidence that PLA was not patrolling fingers 4-9 prior to 2020. Because Col. Dinny clearly said it was, and there is video evidence they were there.
So where's the evidence China only "rarely" sent patrols to the disputed areas, when it had clearly been building roads and other infrastructure in them for over a decade?
I already posted the evidence. You reject every piece of actual evidence but support every conjecture jai hinds come up with. Honestly there is no reasoning with you sometimes.
Here is the evidence and this is the only real piece of evidence pertaining to patrolling and frequency. The only piece and the also most valid since it comes from the horse's mouth.
It's widely reported and it's undeniably true that India's Four Star General said this about LAC/ Ladakh in 2020 in the context of this confrontation.
Sometimes trying to explain and reason is simply futile but I do it for other members too.
This video is from finger 4 in 2017
Col. Dinny, who actually led patrols there until around 2015 gives a good description of India-China confrontations there
Are you really kidding me? A footage from 2017 PROVES to you that PLA was there from 2017 to 2020? Really?
Do you realise that PLA come out to meet Indian patrols with banners sometimes whenever they see fit?
Fingers 4 to Fingers 8 are empty year round until Indians make moves and maybe every five or six Indian patrols, China sends PLA to meet them and formally perform counter patrols to the edges of China's claims which would no doubt be met by Indian troops... not always but certainly sometimes. Does that prove Indian troops have always been in the disputed 20%? For them to meet PLA with banners saying this land is Indian?
Again, when did I say Indian soldiers were never in the disputed 20%? You were the one who asserted that it was PLA that "rarely" patrolled the disputed areas. However, the available evidence does not back up your claim, and in fact suggests the opposite.Are you really kidding me? A footage from 2017 PROVES to you that PLA was there from 2017 to 2020? Really?
Do you realise that PLA come out to meet Indian patrols with banners sometimes whenever they see fit?
Fingers 4 to Fingers 8 are empty year round until Indians make moves and maybe every five or six Indian patrols, China sends PLA to meet them and formally perform counter patrols to the edges of China's claims which would no doubt be met by Indian troops... not always but certainly sometimes. Does that prove Indian troops have always been in the disputed 20%? For them to meet PLA with banners saying this land is Indian?
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Logic and debate exercise.
If I post a video of me at the base of mount Everest in year 2000, then I post another video of me arguing with another climber in year 2010. Does that prove I was there guarding my position between the year 2000 and 2010?
If China was in F8 to F4 the entire time between 2017 to 2020 November, wouldn't India have LONG ago already raised this confrontation? F4 to F8 is literally almost the entire disputed stretch as ONE section along Pangong lake northern fingers. Somehow it wasn't a problem then for Modi? lol Or perhaps that video from 2017 is showing one of many occasions where one side is doing patrols and the other side is meeting them. Sometimes it's India patrolling to the edge of their claims and sometimes it's China patrolling to the edge of their claims. The fact that patrols to edge of claims happen has no bearing on how frequently they happen and when. The events that set off this confrontation was China considering India's new increases in patrolling and presence to be threatening to Chinese control of Aksai Chin.
If I post a video of me at the base of mount Everest in year 2000, then I post another video of me arguing with another climber in year 2010. Does that prove I was there guarding my position between the year 2000 and 2010?
If China was in F8 to F4 the entire time between 2017 to 2020 November, wouldn't India have LONG ago already raised this confrontation? F4 to F8 is literally almost the entire disputed stretch as ONE section along Pangong lake northern fingers. Somehow it wasn't a problem then for Modi? lol Or perhaps that video from 2017 is showing one of many occasions where one side is doing patrols and the other side is meeting them. Sometimes it's India patrolling to the edge of their claims and sometimes it's China patrolling to the edge of their claims. The fact that patrols to edge of claims happen has no bearing on how frequently they happen and when. The events that set off this confrontation was China considering India's new increases in patrolling and presence to be threatening to Chinese control of Aksai Chin.
Again, when did I say Indian soldiers were never in the disputed 20%?
Again you ignored my main point. I corrected your post which aims to imply that PLA was present on F4 as early as 2017 with permanent positions at F4.
You know this is untrue and humiliating for India if it were true since PLA wouldn't have captured disputed land for just 9 months but 3 years.
You know what you're implying is untrue. You are trying to make the quiet implication because you know what I've written is correct and impossible to attack because it is backed by evidence (VK Singh) and facts on ground that both sides accept to be true.
The reason Pangong was an issue was because PLA had erected permanent structures which it had not done before. Confrontations between patrols happened all the time that is hardly newsworthy. You were saying that PLA "rarely" sent patrols.Logic and debate exercise.
If I post a video of me at the base of mount Everest in year 2000, then I post another video of me arguing with another climber in year 2010. Does that prove I was there guarding my position between the year 2000 and 2010?
If China was in F8 to F4 the entire time between 2017 to 2020 November, wouldn't India have LONG ago already raised this confrontation? F4 to F8 is literally almost the entire disputed stretch as ONE section along Pangong lake northern fingers. Somehow it wasn't a problem then for Modi? lol Or perhaps that video from 2017 is showing one of many occasions where one side is doing patrols and the other side is meeting them. Sometimes it's India patrolling to the edge of their claims and sometimes it's China patrolling to the edge of their claims. The fact that patrols to edge of claims happen has no bearing on how frequently they happen and when. The events that set off this confrontation was China considering India's new increases in patrolling and presence to be threatening to Chinese control of Aksai Chin.
When did I bring up permanent structures? I was referring to patrols. You said PLA rarely patrolled the disputed areas. I was saying that isn't true. I thought we were always discussing patrols?Again you ignored my main point. I corrected your post which aims to imply that PLA was present on F4 as early as 2017 with permanent positions at F4.
You know this is untrue and humiliating for India if it were true since PLA wouldn't have captured disputed land for just 9 months but 3 years.
You know what you're implying is untrue. You are trying to make the quiet implication because you know what I've written is correct and impossible to attack because it is backed by evidence (VK Singh) and facts on ground that both sides accept to be true.
Do you have any hard evidence PLA wasn't extensively patrolling fingers 4-8 and other disputed areas prior to 2020?
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